Extreme Rules 2022 **Spoilers**

[Chili]

@Pincwanted Bray's return to be like Pipes from Ghostwatch sort of. Which would have also been good but still lead to Bray Wyatt returning. 

[RIDDUM_N_STYLE]

Thought it was a really fun show that really flew over helped by some good commentary from Cole and Graves, particularly during the end sequence of the I Quit match 

I’m curious as to what’s next with Bray, Raw looks bloated as is for Monday with the Bloodline showing up, the DX celebration and the Lashley/Rollins US Title match so maybe they hold fire till SD?

[simonworden]

2 hours ago, Pinc said:

We must enjoy fiction differently mate, which is fine like. There's no explanation - in the canon of the show - for why the camera crew knew where all the Wyatt cosplayers dotted around the crowd would appear, right on cue. And that bothers me. I'm not choosing to find it bothersome, its an automatic response while watching the show. Makes it less believable, less immersive.

All it takes is a bit of forethought, have the characters start appearing in the crowd but the camera only catches them incidentally at first. Have Bray walk out of something (anything!) other than a backlit door with a smoke machine behind it. You can hit all the same character beats while giving my subconscious mind fewer reasons to ask questions about what I'm seeing. I'm not asking for it to be hyper-realistic at all, just internally coherent.

I'm super tired for baby raising so getting drawn in when I wouldn't usually. I didn't hate the return as the big overdone production for a return we've seen before. Taker had several of these between 06 and 11. It was exciting, it was entertaining and to leave it with no patsy to take a move off Bray keeps people guessing. If you need a plot hole twist you could argue that Bray probably controlled the production crew and had people he manipulated don the costumes in the audience. 

I do agree it could have been toned down. My preference would have been lights out, scary voices, white rabbit plays bray walks out in Craig David/Guy Fawkes mask with lantern....I'm here end but as I said it was what it was and wasn't that bad 

[Mr Butternut Squash]

Well I liked it. Bray's builds and debuts are always brilliant and this was up there with the best, at least in the moment. I don't want to watch it again incase I hate it. But at stoned a.m. this was genuinely creepy and exciting. Bray is great and it's just nice to look at things that are different and outside of the wrestling universe occasionally. 

The problem with Bray of course is when he enters into the wreslting universe it all goes to shit and he sucks the life out of whoever he works with. One of the most fascinating things about this new era is how this will go - how Bray and HHH will handle it, and if they're any good afterall. I'm quite worried about it to be honest. But yeah. Love Bray when he first shows up.

As for the card, opening sixman tag was excellent and match of the night. I've always loved Sheamus and it's great to see him get this hot run and be appreciated. I don't know what happened to him after he returned a couple of years ago but he's shaken off that stale feeling completely. Gunther's awesome and it's great that he's been pushed so well. Awesome, hard hitting match. Great heels, great babyfaces. This is the second best thing in wrestling.

Liv vs Ronda was an amusing train wreck. Utterly terrible, but entertainingly stiff and violent at points too. I still kinda enjoy Ronda for how weird and idiosyncratic she is, but Jesus. Her selling of the chair shots is the most bush league thing I've seen in a bigtime WWE match. Should've been a squash.

Can't remember anything about the strap match other than Scarlett. She's a superstar. 

Ladder Match was good. The climbing spots seemed more natural to me than usual. Bayley coming good after a lacklustre return.

Edge vs Balor was embarrassing at first. I felt like Cornette watching it. After two hours of tables, ladders, chairs and shillelaghs, the ref shoving the mic in their face and asking if they want to quit inside a headlock was fucking ridiculous. Even Philly were laughing it out of the building. This had the death stench of Edge vs Orton at Mania, but thankfully they picked it up and things got really good when it became an angle. This whole storyline has been enjoyable wrestlecrap. Finn is being dragged down by JD (how do you make Finn Balor look shitty and uncool?), but it's doing wonders for Rhea and Dominic. Brutal chair shot from those bastards to send them nuclear.

Fight Pit wasn't a fight pit and felt like any other Seth Rollins match, which is fine. My gosh, that senton was nasty. 

Overall, thumbs up show. The digestable length is greatly appreciated. Cole is more tolerable now too. Sometimes fun and good even. Graves is insufferable. Still sounds like a Vince drone and gives away every fucking nearfall. 

Edited October 10, 2022 by Mr Butternut Squash

[WeeAl]

Bray Wyatt hasn't been involved in anything remotely resembling good, since The Shield Vs The Wyatt Family. Fair play to all those that like his schtick, but it's an additional reason why I won't be able to try WWE again.

There's clearly some stuff they're doing at the minute that's getting universal praise, but a recent Raw I started, that within five minute I had to turn off again due to the graphics, camera cuts, commentary and 'Seth Freakin' Rollins', means I'll struggle hugely to give this product another chance. 

I might try to give some of the Bloodline stuff a go (as that does seem to be getting praised all over the place), though fast forwarding Roman's entrance of course, so hopefully Bray Wyatt stays well away from them in the meantime. 

[RedRooster]

I'm optimistic about Bray Wyatt, mainly because we've already seen a Triple H version of Bray Wyatt in NXT, and it was good. His return was brilliant, and I liked the symbolic destruction of his Fiend gimmick, indicating that something different is on the horizon. There's no reason why it can't work, but it really depends on whether or not they decide to ditch the supernatural bollocks that has followed him around for the longest time. 

As far as the show goes, the opening match was brilliant. Sheamus feels red hot right now, and while it probably should feel counterproductive to have a strong up-and-coming heel lose to someone who has been around the midcard for this long, it surely has to happen? Everyone wants to see Sheamus win that IC belt, and it'll feel like a genuinely big moment when he does. 

McIntyre/Kross was fine, but essentially confirmed my feelings about Kross. Outside of a snazzy entrance, there really isn't all that much there. At least Wyatt compensates for his lesser ring work by having a charisma about him, but Kross is bang average in that respect too. I just don't see what Triple H sees in him, although WWE is certainly maximising his very limited potential; I'll give them that much.  

5 hours ago, Mr Butternut Squash said:

Liv vs Ronda was an amusing train wreck. Utterly terrible, but entertainingly stiff and violent at points too. I still kinda enjoy Ronda for how weird and idiosyncratic she is, but Jesus. Her selling of the chair shots is the most bush league thing I've seen in a bigtime WWE match. Should've been a squash.

This is the best summary of this match I've read. Couldn't agree more. It was terrible, but entertaining at the same time. I enjoyed it, and I'm glad to see them take the title off Liv, who has been exposed as champion. I didn't understand why, prior to her championship run, there were people suggesting that she was being underutilised; but she's now proven that she'd been exactly where she should have been. She's not very good, and on a very strong roster of women, should be nowhere near a title belt. 

[Devon Malcolm]

Meh, this was mediocre. But any event where all the matches are EXTREME is always going to get boring after a while. Which is why ECW was boring. Anyway.

The Brawling Brutes vs Imperium - This didn't quite get going for a while. The two lads with Gunther are not as good at him at showing the same intensity and I don't think this group will work outside NXT. Match was too long and I was quite bored after a while but Sheamus and Gunther are superb. Felt like this should have showcased Butch more though considering he's supposed to love a fight. Not that impressed by this and it's normally my sort of thing.

Liv Morgan vs Ronda Rousey - This wasn't good. Ronda Rousey doesn't want to be there. And they're trying to do something with Liv Morgan and she's trying to make it work back, so they tried a different image with that ending which at least gives them something to work with, I'll give them that. Match was bad though and the baseball bat stuff was stupid.

Drew McIntyre vs Karrion Kross - This was quite boring although the beginning was quite clever when Kross threw the strap away. Felt like they should have thrown the match out after a while and McIntyre wouldn't have been hurt by a loss. I'll reserve judgement on Kross until I see him in a proper match.

Bianca Belair vs Bayley - So, a rivalry they've been building for a couple of months and a match that had loads behind it - two of the best and most popular wrestlers in the company. And they waste it on a ladder match. The ladder match should have been the third in the series, not the first. It was awkward at the beginning but got really good later on. It worked because Biance and Bayley are so fucking good. But where do they go now they've done the EXTREMEEEEE match?

Finn Balor vs Edge - This match is still going on now. Finn Balor is crap, another 'good in Japan' loser, and that sling blade move is fucking shit. But just when I was going to just flick to the last match, everyone did a run-in and it suddenly got superb. The ending was brilliant and generated actual heat, those three foot stomps was the sort of vicious stuff Balor should be doing if he wants to do anything with this role. And if they're gonna do a Rhea Ripley vs Beth Phoenix match out of it, all the better.

Seth Rollins vs Matt Riddle - Best moment of this was Rollins doing the RVD taunt on his entrance to all the ECW pensioners in the crowd. That guy's become so great. Match was alright considering it is Riddle. That senton was fucking nasty. Am I supposed to know who Daniel Cormier is? Nobody gave a shit because MMA is rubbish.

Then the Bray Wyatt stuff. A character who has always worked best as such than as a wrestler. The package was really well done, WWE are so good at that stuff. At the end of the day though, it's still Bray Wyatt and he's never had any good matches outside of the Shield feud and that cage match with Daniel Bryan. The white rabbit stuff has been conceptually outstanding though, if only they could have used it on someone good.

[mim731]

Was the thing on the announce desk that freaked Cole and Graves out supposed to be the burnt Fiend mask from last year? Couldn't quite figure it out. 

[WyattSheepMask]

37 minutes ago, mim731 said:

Was the thing on the announce desk that freaked Cole and Graves out supposed to be the burnt Fiend mask from last year? Couldn't quite figure it out. 

Yeah it was, which must mean that the other Fiend that was shown in the crowd must be wearing a second Fiend mask, or there are two Fiends*

 

* insert “wrestling has loads of Fiends” joke

Edited October 10, 2022 by WyattSheepMask

[Hannibal Scorch]

4 minutes ago, WyattSheepMask said:

Yeah it was, which must mean that the other Fiend that was shown in the crowd must be wearing a second Fiend mask, or there are two Fiends*

 

* insert “wrestling has loads of Fiends” joke

If you remember (and no shame for forgetting), The Fiend was back on TV weeks after being murdered live on PPV by Orton. So definitely multiples. Like The Prestige.

[Your Fight Site]

8 minutes ago, Hannibal Scorch said:

If you remember (and no shame for forgetting), The Fiend was back on TV weeks after being murdered live on PPV by Orton. So definitely multiples. Like The Prestige.

SPOILER.

[BomberPat]

4 hours ago, RedRooster said:

I'm optimistic about Bray Wyatt, mainly because we've already seen a Triple H version of Bray Wyatt in NXT, and it was good. 

I don't think Triple H was booking NXT when Bray was there, I think that was Dusty.

I think the Triple H version was what we saw at the PPV - putting a hat on a hat in terms of gimmicks, and More Is More self-indulgence. 

Like people have said earlier, either WWE is a real live event or it's a TV show that happens to be filmed live, and the camera guys all had their cues as to when to shoot certain sections of the audience and the arena even though it was all apparently a surprise. It's all two or three steps too far at once in terms of suspension of disbelief. 

Characters like Wyatt are best when there's ambiguity; is he a crazy fanatic who believes himself to be possessed by a demon, is he a conman winning over followers by convincing them he has supernatural powers, or is he a wrestler playing mind games to get one over on his opponent? The least interesting interpretation is "it's all true and he's genuinely magic" because, for all the nerds obsessed with Lore, it has the least depth, he's just a cartoon character. It also makes the rest of WWE nonsensical by association - why aren't all the other wrestlers remotely concerned that there's a literal demon running around their TV set and, presumably, unfazed by their entire conception of reality being upturned?

[Supremo]

Seeing the reaction to Bray’s return online, I’ve got to hand it to Hunter. He’s a genius. The Cerebral Assassin, indeed.

He was already promoting on Easy Mode after inheriting the company from the weirdest man who’s ever lived. He’s spent the summer dining out on fruit baskets by simply allowing people to have surnames and say the word, “wrestling.” And now he’s brought in the one man who, for whatever reason, regardless of the actual quality of a anything he’s involved in, there’s a subsection of the audience that fucking love him.

What a cheat code from Papa H! He can’t lose! He’s got a character that’s practically bulletproof! I mean, fucking hell, people were doing video essays calling Bray a creative genius when he looked like this.

[Ironic Indie Lad]

I feel like I am being gaslighted when I read peoples opinions on Bray Wyatt.

[Loki]

If they had ditched everything before the door lit up, the return would have been perfect.

I don’t mind a bit of Taker-esque spookiness around Wyatt’s presentation as long as he’s not presented as an ACTUAL wizard.  That stuff has never worked for him.

 Backwoods Bray, if that’s what we’re getting, is something I’ll watch.  As regards his actual wrestling style, he’d be better being more like Abyss - a brawling, violent monster who takes punishment and deals it out.  Actually I hope Parks is working on this angle, he’d be a great fit for where I think they will go with Wyatt.