The AEW Wednesday Night Dynamite Thread

[Statto]

Ogogo started training with WAW about 18 months/2 years ago, I believe.

Dunno if he’s any good in the ring, but for name value I’d not say he was that huge a name over here, let alone in the US.

[Egg Shen]

Ogogo retired from boxing due to a long battle with eye and nose injuries, the guy had it rough, a recent report stated hes had over 19 operations on his face. Coming out of London 2012 though he was a hot prospect, he signed with Golden Boy in America and was tipped for stardom, it just never panned out for him.

 

Edited October 27, 2019 by Egg Shen

[tiger_rick]

 

On 10/26/2019 at 7:38 AM, Supremo said:

On the subject of whether Vince McMahon actually likes wrestling, I think it was Moxley on one of his podcast appearances who said the only thing he knew Vince enjoyed was when someone told a story by selling a body part.

For some reason, that really amused me. Like Vince has the same taste as a teenager who’s read a couple of copies of Powerslam, thinking all psychology amounts to is selling the leg. Forget about building heat, hope spots, momentum swings or big comebacks. Did he hop afterwards or not? That’s what good wrestlers like Chris Benoit do.

That's overly simplistic. Vince has always pushed workers who are great at those things but he and the people he's been close to have always pushed the importance of selling everything properly, telling a story, slowing the pace to bring the crowd down or going into a hold to build to the next big spot.

Wrestlers who've worked in WWE for a long time have the best fundamentals. You can see that in a guy like Pac when he moves on. Look at Cody and Jericho compared to most other guys on AEW and it's obvious. I'm not mentioning Dustin because he's clearly a product of an even older school.

That is being lost though. I don't know if they still drive that home but you'd not know it watching NXT sometimes because some of them Johnny Kickpad fuckers on the Takeover cards are more interested in spots and dives than anything else. There's an element of it on the main shows too.

You also get a guy like Moxley who clearly knows how to work from being there. I worry though that he thinks they've held him back on promos and character work, which they have (and AEW are doing too little about) but also thinks the "WWE style" was holding him back and starts jumping about like the other shitarses.

All that brings up nicely this from Pat:

23 hours ago, BomberPat said:

Private Party remind me of the Young Bucks ten years ago - the talent is there, the gimmick is there, but it all needs fine tuning to make it actually work

Who is going to do this fine tuning? Who is giving advice to these guys? Surely not the fucking Young Bucks? As much as those two have come on over the years, their story telling and pacing is still very indy. Don't AEW have Arn and Malenko on the staff? They employ Jericho and Dustin too and yet they let a match like that dreadful opener happen. I'll have far more faith in this company if someone has watched that and had this conversation with them.

Edited October 27, 2019 by tiger_rick

[Egg Shen]

when the crowd they have is reacting like they are, they'll never change.

[Michael_3165]

1 hour ago, tiger_rick said:

 

That's overly simplistic. Vince has always pushed workers who are great at those things but he and the people he's been close to have always pushed the importance of selling everything properly, telling a story, slowing the pace to bring the crowd down or going into a hold to build to the next big spot.

Wrestlers who've worked in WWE for a long time have the best fundamentals. You can see that in a guy like Pac when he moves on. Look at Cody and Jericho compared to most other guys on AEW and it's obvious. I'm not mentioning Dustin because he's clearly a product of an even older school.

That is being lost though. I don't know if they still drive that home but you'd not know it watching NXT sometimes because some of them Johnny Kickpad fuckers on the Takeover cards are more interested in spots and dives than anything else. There's an element of it on the main shows too.

You also get a guy like Moxley who clearly knows how to work from being there. I worry though that he thinks they've held him back on promos and character work, which they have (and AEW are doing too little about) but also thinks the "WWE style" was holding him back and starts jumping about like the other shitarses.

All that brings up nicely this from Pat:

Who is going to do this fine tuning? Who is giving advice to these guys? Surely not the fucking Young Bucks? As much as those two have come on over the years, their story telling and pacing is still very indy. Don't AEW have Arn and Malenko on the staff? They employ Jericho and Dustin too and yet they let a match like that dreadful opener happen. I'll have far more faith in this company if someone has watched that and had this conversation with them.

The thing from that match Wass the clearly choreographed bullshit. Putting yourself in positions to take a move... Seriously?  If you can't do a quality basic match without stupid shit just to pop aa crowd you need alot of work. 

[Love-Wilcox]

46 minutes ago, Egg Shen said:

when the crowd they have is reacting like they are, they'll never change.

But if the crowd are going absolutely bonkers then why should they change? Just to play devils advocate for a sec and perhaps make a bit of a ludicrous comparison... If Rock/Hogan was so great soley because of the crowd reaction (because be honest, otherwise it was shit) then who are we to shit on something that has the live audiance off their feet?

For the record I didn't love the match but the raucous crowd drew me into it and it was short enough that it didn't out stay its welcome.

[tiger_rick]

The crowd will go apeshit for all sorts of things. But you'll burn them out if you do it over and over and over. They need to learn that less is more.

[Michael_3165]

I just worry that these guys will have a ten year career not a thirty year one because they will fuck themselves for claps. I went to the SSW show last night and the only table spot was the finish. Why kill yourself? 

[Snitsky's back acne]

1 hour ago, Egg Shen said:

when the crowd they have is reacting like they are, they'll never change.

Meltzer's argument these days is that if it's over with the crowd then what the wrestlers are doing is right, as much as we may think it is wrong.
Wrestling has bred a bunch of fans that love this overly choreographed, repeated highspots, a million near falls etc stuff.
 

[Supremo]

1 hour ago, tiger_rick said:

You also get a guy like Moxley who clearly knows how to work from being there. I worry though that he thinks they've held him back on promos and character work, which they have (and AEW are doing too little about) but also thinks the "WWE style" was holding him back and starts jumping about like the other shitarses.

Totally agree in principle that I don’t want to see Mox doing flips or dives. I’m interested though, have you seen much of Moxley’s G1? I think he had a number of matches in that tournament that absolutely proved how much better he is not adhering to WWE style. And that’s coming from someone who was always a huge fan. That Ishii match in particular was probably better than any match he ever had in WWE and was a real indictment of how potential gets stunted and wasted in that system. 

Who knows? Maybe even Seth Rollins could be as good as he thinks he is in that environment. Provided New Japan didn’t give him the WiFi password, of course.

Edited October 27, 2019 by Supremo

[Loki]

AEW needs to sack of the Lucha House Party knockoff and use Pentagon Jr as a main event heel.  What a fucking great look, style and demeanour.  I've not seen most of the AEW roster before, so from a standing start he's the one guy who I've thought "money" straight away.  Head and shoulders above anyone bar Jericho and Moxley atm.

[Merzbow]

Penta was my fav wrestler in the world when he was doing his stuff solo in Lucha Underground, I've never really got along with the tag-team and their "look, we're cool and into hip-hop" vibe.

[Bellenda Carlisle]

I agree with everyone saying Pentagon Jr is the coolest thing in wrestling with unlimited potential but I love his team with his brother.

They're only a few shows in and there's plenty of mileage in them as a team before doing anything else, especially as AEW are big into tag team wrestling.

Lucha bros is a dry name though, they could do better than that.

[DavidB6937]

Lucha Bros music just makes me angry. Not sure why but I want to mute it.

It's difficult as clearly both guys are bona fide singles main event stars but if they're not going to be the focus at the moment in AEW, there's no harm in having them as a top tag team. At least they're being used.

The main event scene in AEW is pretty damn stacked. They need to take their time and not just burn through everything quickly.

[garynysmon]

Again, AEW is largely my window into the current wrestling scene as I haven't been a consistent viewer over recent years.

But I thought it was a little scary, and I noticed it this week especially, how many moves were executed that resulted in a heavy impact on one of the competitors' necks.

I may be an old fuddy duddy in this regard, but as someone who finds even a few German Suplexes as uncomfortable to watch, I can't say I was too keen.

I've lost count of the number of suicide dives but I think that the move is nowhere near as spectacular to a layman in the audience as it may seem to a wrestler performing it. 

While it may legitimately feel like a big spot for a pro wrester, there are many safer moves, less dangerous in reality that may still look just as good to a TV viewer.

Edited October 27, 2019 by garynysmon