Paid Members BomberPat Posted December 16, 2019 Paid Members Share Posted December 16, 2019 That sort of thing does really annoy me. The show I was at on Saturday had people doing dueling chants in a match with a clear face/heel divide, either because that's how crowds behave these days, or because they were cheering for the one they recognised, irrelevant of her work in the match itself. I've had this conversation with promoters, and they tend to follow the line that punters can, and should, cheer or boo for whoever they want, and that if you try and dictate it to them, you're closing off opportunities for yourself - that Steve Austin was never supposed to be cheered, and so on. But I think there's a difference between a groundswell of support for a performer, and crowds/individuals being contrarian and cheering for someone who's clearly working heel. That said, a better class of heel would know how to turn even that crowd against them. It's harder on the indies, though. Most heels still want to be able to sell merch after the show, so they can't make the crowd genuinely hate them. There might be inconsistencies in whether the wrestler in general works face or heel in different promotions - I remember at the first Wrestle Queendom, Charlie Morgan being the obvious babyface hero in the main event, but initially getting a smattering of boos from a section of the audience because she worked heel in PROGRESS. There's also the thing with indie wrestling where people are as likely to go because their favourite wrestler is booked as because they follow that promotion specifically - and if you've traveled to a show to see one wrestler, you're probably going to cheer for them even if they're working heel. It's annoying, because honestly booing a great heel is so much more fun than cheering for them anyway. It's just such an over the top panto reaction, and great fun to indulge in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonny Vegas Posted December 16, 2019 Share Posted December 16, 2019 Joey Janela needs punted off TV as soon as they can. Everything about him screams all that's wrong with the indies. Shite look, shite gimmick, shite ring gear, shite in the ring. Everything about him reminds me of Z-Barr from the old CZW days. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The King of Old School Posted December 16, 2019 Share Posted December 16, 2019 6 minutes ago, Jonny Vegas said: Joey Janela needs punted off TV as soon as they can. Everything about him screams all that's wrong with the indies. Shite look, shite gimmick, shite ring gear, shite in the ring. Everything about him reminds me of Z-Barr from the old CZW days. Agreed. How on earth are we meant to believe that he is a threat to anyone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CavemanLynn Posted December 16, 2019 Share Posted December 16, 2019 11 minutes ago, BomberPat said: - that Steve Austin was never supposed to be cheered, and so on. Christ, if today's promoters think this, no wonder things are all to cock. Stone Cold worked at 100% a face's pace, with tons of fire and always showing out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonny Vegas Posted December 16, 2019 Share Posted December 16, 2019 3 minutes ago, The King of Old School said: Agreed. How on earth are we meant to believe that he is a threat to anyone. In fairness, he looks like having unprotected sex with him would pose a considerable risk to people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members BomberPat Posted December 16, 2019 Paid Members Share Posted December 16, 2019 17 minutes ago, CavemanLynn said: Christ, if today's promoters think this, no wonder things are all to cock. Stone Cold worked at 100% a face's pace, with tons of fire and always showing out. In fairness, there was a point where he started getting cheers while still more explicitly working heel, but you're absolutely right. Too many people today view "face and heel" as whether the crowd are cheering or booing, rather than explicit roles within the structure of a wrestling match. It worries me when Triple H or Cody Rhodes talk about how the face and heel roles don't really exist any more - Triple H once said that people should stop calling for Roman Reigns to turn heel because if they're booing him, then he's already a heel to them, and even as a corporate non-answer I just found it infuriating. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Accident Prone Posted December 16, 2019 Paid Members Share Posted December 16, 2019 50 minutes ago, Jonny Vegas said: Joey Janela needs punted off TV as soon as they can. Everything about him screams all that's wrong with the indies. Shite look, shite gimmick, shite ring gear, shite in the ring. Everything about him reminds me of Z-Barr from the old CZW days. Joey would absolutely take that Z-Barr comment as a compliment seeing as he's a massive fan of that CZW heyday. I've got a lot of time for Joey, as he injected a lot of panache and creativity into a stale North American indy scene and I find him entertaining in general, but I can see how some can be easily turned off by him and he for sure isn't being used correctly by AEW. It's not like he's there by accident though. He's gets bigged up by everyone that he works with, especially key people in AEW's fold, so he's doing something right, I just think they haven't found a way to properly present him on a bigger stage to a mainstream audience. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tamura Posted December 16, 2019 Share Posted December 16, 2019 (edited) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gDVx_Ck6E40 Video won't embed for some reason. There's heat, there's X-Pac heat, and finally there's Z-Barr heat. Edited December 16, 2019 by Tamura Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iPumaPants Posted December 16, 2019 Share Posted December 16, 2019 1 hour ago, The King of Old School said: Agreed. How on earth are we meant to believe that he is a threat to anyone. He looks about 50x more threatening than Havoc. Not saying much, but it's something. Janela's appeal/threat is in his do-anything-to-win, daredevil style, no? I quite enjoy his work, but he's not the best, that's for sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members IANdrewDiceClay Posted December 16, 2019 Paid Members Share Posted December 16, 2019 (edited) Joey Janela's also made stars of Shlak the nazi, that weirdo racist lad who elbow drops coke tins and Teddy Hart. One of these days, the bubble is surely to burst with Janela. He hangs with to many low lifes for the cap not to fit himself. I quite like him, though. But there's just something not right with him on a big telly in a proper arena. Its like seeing GG Allin at the Royal Variety. Edited December 16, 2019 by IANdrewDiceClay Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Accident Prone Posted December 16, 2019 Paid Members Share Posted December 16, 2019 (edited) Yeah, GCW continually booking Shlak is so incredibly shit, but I don't think Janela has a hand in the day-to-day booking of the shows. Maybe Shlak is their hookup for gimmicks, who knows? I wouldn't class Shlak as anywhere near a star or draw though, even on the deathmatch scene so his booking is always questionable. GCW have leaned off Teddy since September in fairness, even before all the shit hit the fan with him, and they'd be really brain dead if they booked him again. I think Janela is way too outspoken on Twitter and on commentary that if anything really problematic were to come out about him, it would've already happened through his own mouth already. He rallied against Tracey Smothers when the former dropped subbed homophobic slurs at a show and has shown to be pretty left-wing in his politics, so it would have to be something meaty to burst his bubble. I hope AEW get their shit together, because he certainly has a mind for connecting with a modern fanbase, it's just right now this stuff with Shawn Spears appeals to neither the indy crowd or the mainstream audience. Edited December 16, 2019 by Accident Prone Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members BomberPat Posted December 16, 2019 Paid Members Share Posted December 16, 2019 11 minutes ago, Accident Prone said: I wouldn't class Shlak as anywhere near a star or draw though, even on the deathmatch scene so his booking is always questionable. This is the thing that always gets me about Shlak and so many other wrong'uns on the scene. In the grand scheme of things, who the fuck is Shlak? Is there anyone out there buying a ticket based on Shlak being on the card? I'd understand making concessions to book bastards if they were simultaneously major draws, or elite level workers, but more often than not they're absolute shitarses in the ring as well. Aside from the boy's club mentality, why bother? As for Janela himself - he's had some matches I've really enjoyed, though I've not seen many. I don't think he has a bad look or gimmick at all, but it would lend itself better to being a scuzzy, sleazy heel. The most interesting stuff he's done has been around Spring Break which, before the concept was diluted by everyone and their dog trying to do "ironic" wrestling shows at 'Mania weekend, was some of the most genuinely exciting stuff happening on the indies over the past couple of years. He definitely brings a lot to the table as an "outside the box" ideas guy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members IANdrewDiceClay Posted December 16, 2019 Paid Members Share Posted December 16, 2019 1 hour ago, Accident Prone said: GCW have leaned off Teddy since September in fairness, even before all the shit hit the fan with him, and they'd be really brain dead if they booked him again. Janela was on Teddy's youtube show, having a phone conversation with him just last week. Seems they'll be doing business again soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Accident Prone Posted December 16, 2019 Paid Members Share Posted December 16, 2019 5 minutes ago, IANdrewDiceClay said: Janela was on Teddy's youtube show, having a phone conversation with him just last week. Seems they'll be doing business again soon. Well, fucking hell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TildeGuy~! Posted December 16, 2019 Share Posted December 16, 2019 16 hours ago, GeronimoJacksBeard said: I guess Jimmy can finally afford to move out of his Mums gaff now then. Jamie Hayter moving to Japan for 6 months whilst dating Jimmy, getting a gig in AEW presumably through him and then her chucking him for New Japan Young Lion Karl Fredericks makes that post seem funnier by the second. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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