25/26 Football thread DEAD, USE A NEW ONE

[Glenryck Pilchards]

13 hours ago, SuperBacon said:

And that's the crux really isn't it? Allegedly. Look, it's daft, it's really, really daft but Boro have absolutely lost their heads.

I understand that people looking in from the outside will see this as a freak show, but there is sporting integrity at stake here. 

Winning the Championship Playoff is worth £140M, so the equity of all four participants is £35M. The game is all about fine margins and I am sure every team pushes each rule and regulation to it's absolute limit, but Southampton have been caught red handed violating two rules in the EFL rule book. 

The rules are in place for a reason and if Southampton only get a fine it would only encourage other clubs to break the rules due to the vast sums of money involved. 

Last season my local non-league team Stockton were thrown out of the Northern Premier League playoff for fielding an ineligible player. Their captain was sent off in a previous match and the rules stated that the suspension would take affect 7 days after the offence. 

What the club secretary failed to realise is that rule only applied to the league portion, and the playoffs had a rule where the suspension is in play with immediate affect. 

This was an administrative error and Stockton were thrown out. What Southampton have done is flagrant rule breaking. I will be shocked if Southampton aren't thrown out of the playoffs. I am not really arsed if Middlesbrough are reinstated or if Hull get a bye in the final. I just hate to see cheats prosper. 

After we smashed Southampton 4-0 in January, they have went on a 20 game unbeaten run. In January they were fucking awful and didn't know their arse from their elbow. Either Eckert is a genius, or he knew his opponents too well...

If Southampton have committed systematic cheating, they should be demoted to League One.

 

[westlondonmist]

11 minutes ago, tiger_rick said:

I think two teams get a very clear advantage and have for a very long time. I don't think the instructions go out to referees with "Give Celtic/Rangers a penalty in the last minute" but I think there's decades of clear influence that hangs over everyone. The officials last night knew the shitstorm that was coming if they didn't give Celtic that decision. That didn't weigh on them at all last week when Hearts had a blatant penalty turned down.

They're as dodgy as Scottish fivers.

Utter horse shit. You are ignoring all the decisions that go against Celtic and Rangers. Go watch the first Rangers Hearts game of the season, there's a handball leading to the Hearts goal and their penalty is a dive. In the most recent Celtic Hibs game the Hibs goal should have been disallowed and Celtic should have had a penalty. Also like to add Hearts haven't conceded a single penalty this season. 

Any other manager gets a touchline ban for what McInnes has said. He's saying it's fixed and not for the first time. Neil Lennon got a 6 game ban this season. Rodgers said a ref was poor and got a touchline ban last season. But Celtic are specifically treated ones?

[FLips]

I just don’t get the appeal of Scottish Football at all. It’s a two team system where you can count the division winners from the past 100 years that aren’t Celtic or Rangers on one hand. What’s the point in it other than picking Celtic or Rangers as your team and having a fight about it?

Just seems a completely pointless affair. I don’t know if it’s still a discussion point but growing up at least there was always talk about getting Celtic and Rangers into the Premier League and calling it a day. 

I think to even suggest it’s not a rigged system is a waste of breath, there’s no way two teams can be so dominant in a division for that long without some sort of bias.

[SuperBacon]

@Glenryck Pilchards I understand the severity of it mate, I just think it's been embarrassing all round, that's all.

[tiger_rick]

5 minutes ago, westlondonmist said:

Utter horse shit. You are ignoring all the decisions that go against Celtic and Rangers. Go watch the first Rangers Hearts game of the season, there's a handball leading to the Hearts goal and their penalty is a dive. In the most recent Celtic Hibs game the Hibs goal should have been disallowed and Celtic should have had a penalty. Also like to add Hearts haven't conceded a single penalty this season. 

Any other manager gets a touchline ban for what McInnes has said. He's saying it's fixed and not for the first time. Neil Lennon got a 6 game ban this season. Rodgers said a ref was poor and got a touchline ban last season. But Celtic are specifically treated ones?

You're right, it's a level playing field.

[Lion_of_the_Midlands]

10 minutes ago, tiger_rick said:

You're right, it's a level playing field.

That's obviously not Scotish football. The crowd is too big. 

[westlondonmist]

42 minutes ago, FLips said:

I just don’t get the appeal of Scottish Football at all. It’s a two team system where you can count the division winners from the past 100 years that aren’t Celtic or Rangers on one hand. What’s the point in it other than picking Celtic or Rangers as your team and having a fight about it?

Just seems a completely pointless affair. I don’t know if it’s still a discussion point but growing up at least there was always talk about getting Celtic and Rangers into the Premier League and calling it a day. 

I think to even suggest it’s not a rigged system is a waste of breath, there’s no way two teams can be so dominant in a division for that long without some sort of bias.

I support Celtic because my parents did as did my mum's family. I totally understand however why it's boring as fuck for other supporters though. I also totally get why people want Hearts to win, I think football fans probably should just as I enjoyed Leicester winning the title or teams that weren't United winning in the 90s.

I think there are significant periods in the last 40 years which has caused it to be like it is. Late 80s when Rangers went on a financial doping spree to dominate for a decade. Up until then the 80s Dundee United, Aberdeen and Hearts teams were all pretty good. Celtic becoming a PLC and getting their act together, made it very difficult for other clubs to win the other two cups. Then Rangers promoting back, Celtic went out to make sure they didn't catch up (too much). Up until the quadruple treble (which I still find bizarre) a league and cup double was a big achievement by a team. In the previous 9 seasons at least 1 team has won 2 trophies (Celtic 8, St Johnstone 1). 

I do believe Aberdeen, Hibs and Hearts have underachieved in recent years. St Mirren and St Johnstone have done better in the last ten or eleven years. While Celtic and Rangers dwarf them, those three have budgets that dwarf the others. Hearts now seem to have a well structured long term plan and I hope others follow suit (I include Celtic in thst too as the club is a mess). Strangely I've found myself more emotionally invested than I have the previous couple. I'm not thinking yeah we will win that easy about any match, not even Dunfermline. 

Celtic and Rangers should NEVER be allowed into the Premier league unless they at least started from the National league, it would be unfair to the clubs in the EFL. Even then calling it fair would be a stretch. 

Edited May 14 by westlondonmist

[SuperBacon]

10 minutes ago, westlondonmist said:

Celtic and Rangers should NEVER be allowed into the Premier league unless they at least started from the National league, it would be unfair to the clubs in the EFL. Even then calling it fair would be a stretch. 

I've never understood why it's even suggested to be honest, absolutely no one in that scenario would be happy. It'd never, ever happen anyway, the fans would push back so hard, it'd be like that Super League bollocks a few years back.

The best thing they can do is bring back the Anglo Scottish Cup aka the Texaco Cup (one day I'll get round to writing that book about defunct tournaments and trophies) and settle it that way.

[I Bent My Wookie]

Yeah I'm in a weird boat, where half my family is Rangers and half is Celtic because Grandad was a protestant Glasweigan and Granny was a Catholic Dubliner. I spent more time with my Gran so I ended up Celtic watching with her. Its no different to people being a Hull City fan because they grew up in that area of the country or being a Spurs fan because they come from a family of masochists. 

I grew up an hour from Birmingham and an hour from Cardiff and none of those teams from there ever interested me, same with watching Fowler and Owen or Beckham and Giggs I had no interest in the "big" teams.

I found more interest in hearing about the old days Old Firm derbies and it helped me find a footing and be a lot closer to the Scottish people I've met through uni and general day to day life who also were fans of their local or family team.

I'll accept the farmer league jibes and the 2 team comments, but it'll always come down to revenue and stadium size. If the largest (or second) city in Scotland has 2 stadiums with over 40,000 people weekly and Football is the main sport there (I would say Edinburgh cares more about Rugby from general people I've met bar diehard Hearts and Hibs fans) of course they're gonna have more to win when other stadiums barely hold 10,000 weekly. 

The thibg about joining the English leagues genuinely I only seem to hear from English fans these days, "oh they won the league again, but they'd be shit in our league", and you're bloody right. We were celebrating years ago sending Van Dijk to Southampton before he became world class, sending Ajer to Brentford, Edouard to Palace, bringing home a crocked Tierney who couldn't cut it at a top level, McGregor and Forrest never leaving being a big fish in a small pond. The only way it'd ever work is if Sponsorship money helped stabilise the two clubs further (because Sevco is as stable as a paper boat and Celtic are stockpiling money for the next recession) to start spending more to compete. Our transfers this year have been a shower of shit and overspending where teams like Hearts and Motherwell strengthened their teams to a point only one or two players stand out but the whole club is great. 

I think at the end of it all, if there wasn't Champions League places and country capitals at stake right next to England, the Scottish leagues wouldn't even get looked at or commented on. How much discussion in this thread or any in years has been about the Irish leagues or even the Welsh when their big city clubs all run in England instead? I'm excited for Saturday, either we're about to see a team win that'll really put a boot up the arse of Rangers and Celtic or I've got another championship and Martin O'Neill gets a trophy for saving a sinking ship. And then I can watch all you lot shout at each other about 1st and 18th place the week after. 

[westlondonmist]

8 minutes ago, I Bent My Wookie said:

Yeah I'm in a weird boat, where half my family is Rangers and half is Celtic because Grandad was a protestant Glasweigan and Granny was a Catholic Dubliner. I spent more time with my Gran so I ended up Celtic watching with her. Its no different to people being a Hull City fan because they grew up in that area of the country or being a Spurs fan because they come from a family of masochists. 

I grew up an hour from Birmingham and an hour from Cardiff and none of those teams from there ever interested me, same with watching Fowler and Owen or Beckham and Giggs I had no interest in the "big" teams.

I found more interest in hearing about the old days Old Firm derbies and it helped me find a footing and be a lot closer to the Scottish people I've met through uni and general day to day life who also were fans of their local or family team.

I'll accept the farmer league jibes and the 2 team comments, but it'll always come down to revenue and stadium size. If the largest (or second) city in Scotland has 2 stadiums with over 40,000 people weekly and Football is the main sport there (I would say Edinburgh cares more about Rugby from general people I've met bar diehard Hearts and Hibs fans) of course they're gonna have more to win when other stadiums barely hold 10,000 weekly. 

The thibg about joining the English leagues genuinely I only seem to hear from English fans these days, "oh they won the league again, but they'd be shit in our league", and you're bloody right. We were celebrating years ago sending Van Dijk to Southampton before he became world class, sending Ajer to Brentford, Edouard to Palace, bringing home a crocked Tierney who couldn't cut it at a top level, McGregor and Forrest never leaving being a big fish in a small pond. The only way it'd ever work is if Sponsorship money helped stabilise the two clubs further (because Sevco is as stable as a paper boat and Celtic are stockpiling money for the next recession) to start spending more to compete. Our transfers this year have been a shower of shit and overspending where teams like Hearts and Motherwell strengthened their teams to a point only one or two players stand out but the whole club is great. 

I think at the end of it all, if there wasn't Champions League places and country capitals at stake right next to England, the Scottish leagues wouldn't even get looked at or commented on. How much discussion in this thread or any in years has been about the Irish leagues or even the Welsh when their big city clubs all run in England instead? I'm excited for Saturday, either we're about to see a team win that'll really put a boot up the arse of Rangers and Celtic or I've got another championship and Martin O'Neill gets a trophy for saving a sinking ship. And then I can watch all you lot shout at each other about 1st and 18th place the week after. 

You mention two stadiums having 40,000 or more only. There are definitelt too many clubs in Scotland sharing such a small audience, but Scotland does have one of the highest football attendance per head of any country. 42 teams in the SPFL would be better if about 30. I understand for most of the last 150 years local teams made sense, but imagine if Dundee, North Lanarkshire, South Lanarkshire or Ayshire each had one big team with 15-25k each week. I think Scottish football in general would be a much higher standard. 

 

People can shout it's rigged, nah Scottish Football is just really really badly run. The SFA and SPFL don't know how to promote or improve the game. 

[Carbomb]

44 minutes ago, SuperBacon said:

The best thing they can do is bring back the Anglo Scottish Cup aka the Texaco Cup (one day I'll get round to writing that book about defunct tournaments and trophies) and settle it that way.

Replace the League cups with an all-UK cup. 

[Wretch]

4 hours ago, Ironic Indie Lad said:

Or I could be talking complete bollocks and its a multi layered Catholic conspiracy in Scottish football. Unseen forces are doing everything they can to ensure Celtic win the league. 

 

[SpiritOfTheForest]

2 hours ago, Lion_of_the_Midlands said:

That's obviously not Scotish football. The crowd is too big. 

This part is easily refuted nonsense. The Scottish Premiership has the highest attendances in Europe per head of population. 

https://www.bbc.com/sport/football/articles/c749ql0yzdno

 

Of course, a real issue is people from places like Inverness, Perth or Ayr electing to choose one of Celtic or Rangers over their local team but to say that nobody goes to watch Scottish football is demonstrably false. 

[Briefcase]

3 hours ago, tiger_rick said:

 from one angle because Scottish Football isn't worth multiple camera angles apparently

There needs to be a rule in football that if your going to have VAR in any league then at least make sure there are multiple camera angles, doesn't need to be 26 cameras like the Premier League with cameras moving on wires but at least have a few (behind goal, touchline etc). 

[Ironic Indie Lad]

2 hours ago, SuperBacon said:

I've never understood why it's even suggested to be honest, absolutely no one in that scenario would be happy. It'd never, ever happen anyway, the fans would push back so hard, it'd be like that Super League bollocks a few years back.

I think part of it is that English football fans love to belittle the Scottish League with their ALWAYS ABSOLUTELY HYSTERICAL BANTER about it being a farmers league, low attendance etc. (honestly its hilarious every single time!!!!!)

If you are Scottish and that sort of bullshit upsets you, the counter argument is that Rangers or Celtic could theoretically compete in the premier league if they had premier league money. 

Its all just "what if?" nonsense really because any club would need several years of big money and perfectly scouted transfer windows just to have half a chance of competing in the top half of the table. You would basically be saying "we could compete with you if we had as much money as you and players that are as good as yours!!!" which is an absurd argument.

There have been times where you could reasonably argue one of the Glasgow clubs could have done well if they were (for some baffling reason) moved into the English league. Martin O'Neills early 00s Celtic side for example when they eliminated Blackburn Rovers (finished 6th in Premier League that season) and Liverpool (finished 5th in the Premier League that season) en route to the UEFA cup final.

(Rangers fans would probably point to their European results evidencing their quality over and above the perception of Scottish football.)

For me thats a long time ago and the finances have changed dramatically since then. The quality up here is lower and the money in England is just a totally different universe. Even Scotland's best teams would get absolutely embarrassed in the premier league today in my opinion.