Paid Members air_raid Posted March 21 Paid Members Share Posted March 21 6 minutes ago, LaGoosh said: I haven't seen any of Okada outside AEW so this legendary status they've given him is a bit confusing to me because he hasn't hugely impressed in-ring. He's working a slow and safe style but I'm not really buying him as this super talent that they are telling me he is. After hearing for so long how great Okada is in-ring I'm looking forward to seeing him put on a top performance. Soon hopefully. This is the problem with transplanting a top New Japan name to a new place of work. It’s hard to explain, but after many years a match just becomes a big time match because Okada is in it. You give a shit because you’ve given a shit for years. The live crowd are excited, those of us watching are excited, and by the end you’re convinced you’ve watched one of the best matches of all time without him or the other guy having needed to do that much, but the when and why stuff gets done being so crucial. In many of his biggest title defences, for example, the point at which he finally nails the challenger with the dropkick usually draws a big gasp from the crowd and you immediately grasp that “Shit, the end might be nigh” because it’s been one of his big trademarks that can lead into a tombstone, Rainmaker and three count. Strip him of the journey that the viewer has gone on from his return from excursions through first title win, G1 and Wrestle Kingdoms highs and lows and ascent to the top, and any prior knowledge of his previous matches and…. oh look, that bloke did a dropkick. And? Anyone can do a dropkick? What’s special? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrodyGraham Posted March 21 Share Posted March 21 I thought that was simultaneously a banging episode of television and a relative disappointment. Okada is going to struggle as a weekly TV wrestler relative to the level of reputation he has. I thought the match with Kingston was good, but so much of Okada's reputation is based on having 40 minute epics on mammoth NJPW PPV's or during the G1 when basically every show is a PPV, that I do think he'll suffer on TV. Omega had a similar problem but it was mitigated by his stuff being flashier than Okada's. The problem for Okada is he's come in at the same time as Osprey who can do a mad sprint on telly and seems to have hypnotised America with his weird chirpy Essex Lad bravado. Mercedes remains a dodgy promo.Hopefully they're building up to heel Mercedes Vs Uber Baby Face Willow. It's the closest thing to Sasha Vs Bayley in NXT that they could possibly do. Cope Vs Cage was a hoot although I'm not sure that your baby face handcuffing your heel to a corner, repeatedly kicking him in the balls and then wellying him in the downstairs business with a spiked spanking paddle is a great look. Mad fun though.  Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Hannibal Scorch Posted March 21 Paid Members Share Posted March 21 44 minutes ago, BomberPat said: I went into the match thinking "I hope they end on a cliffhanger to bridge between Dynamite and Rampage, would be a missed opportunity otherwise". I wasn't expecting it to just abruptly end without even giving the announcers time to tell you to stay tuned. If ever an opportunity arose for a Tony Schiavone "WE'RE OUT OF TIME!" Weirdly while watching live there was no abrupt stop or AEW 2024 at the bottom or anything, the feed just continued into Rampage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members LaGoosh Posted March 21 Paid Members Share Posted March 21 4 minutes ago, air_raid said: Strip him of the journey that the viewer has gone on from his return from excursions through first title win, G1 and Wrestle Kingdoms highs and lows and ascent to the top, and any prior knowledge of his previous matches and…. oh look, that bloke did a dropkick. And? Anyone can do a dropkick? What’s special? Yeah that sounds about right. However at the same time I don't think AEW are really doing anything wrong at all with his current presentation. He's being presented as a top star and sometimes you just need to go all in on someone and hopefully with time the audience who are unfamiliar with him will catch up and see them as a top star too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chili Posted March 21 Share Posted March 21 I really enjoyed the finish to the I Quit Match. Christian has the biggest, trolling, unrepentant shithead as TNT Champion and it's been fantastic. A finish where a total gobshite gets repeatedly kicked in the bollocks until he quits was a end I enjoyed. Hardly valiant babyface stuff, but also it's an I Quit Match and the prick deserved it. I'm assuming the Cope Open becomes a TNT Challenge like when Cody did it for a bit, until Copeland gets a new feud in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DavidB6937 Posted March 21 Author Share Posted March 21 I guess the one thing you can't port over, no matter who it is, is a long term emotional attachment if you've not followed their journey before. There's top stars and then there's favourites and a mixture of both. Kinda like why I don't hate Seth Rollins quite as much as some - sorry! - simply due to having watched him from day 1 in ROH and being invested in his journey, even if I'm not necessarily a massive fan of his current "character" (and I use that word loosely). We all find ways to be invested in certain people. Might be their work. Might be a long term commitment. Can be both. It's definitely something a lot of the Japanese stars suffer with if they don't have an immediately impressive performance or character, especially in WWE. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members air_raid Posted March 21 Paid Members Share Posted March 21 5 minutes ago, DavidB6937 said: We all find ways to be invested in certain people. Might be their work. Might be a long term commitment. Can be both. It's definitely something a lot of the Japanese stars suffer with if they don't have an immediately impressive performance or character, especially in WWE. Or even if they do. Nakamura vs Zayn (here he goes again) was note perfect because they had 19 minutes to structure a match against a guy he should beat but its not implausible that he might lose, where all of Shinsuke's stuff could be done precisely when it needed to be, in front of a crowd already willing to accept that he was one of the biggest stars on the planet. He never quite reached that peak again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedRooster Posted March 21 Share Posted March 21 (edited) 1 hour ago, air_raid said: Or even if they do. Nakamura vs Zayn (here he goes again) was note perfect because they had 19 minutes to structure a match against a guy he should beat but its not implausible that he might lose, where all of Shinsuke's stuff could be done precisely when it needed to be, in front of a crowd already willing to accept that he was one of the biggest stars on the planet. He never quite reached that peak again. The problem with Nakamura is that he never really followed that impactful debut up with anything even close to being as good. I'd go as far as to say that it's his only memorable match in WWE. It's not that the rest have been bad (although some matches have been) it's that they've been no better than OK. I think Nakamura is to blame for his very average career in WWE. They showed willingness to push him - having him defeat Cena and Orton, and win the Rumble - but all of the matches he had were very average, even against AJ Styles; who we were told he enjoyed legendary chemistry with. As far as Okada goes, I'm yet to see the qualities in him that set him apart; but it's early days. I'm obviously willing to give him a chance. Edited March 21 by RedRooster Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members air_raid Posted March 21 Paid Members Share Posted March 21 20 minutes ago, RedRooster said: They showed willingness to push him - having him defeat Cena and Orton, and win the Rumble - but all of the matches he had were very average, even against AJ Styles; who we were told he enjoyed legendary chemistry with. Which, to be fair, was based on one match in New Japan. That match was a fucking belter, to be fair, but virtually every wrestler of note has a story where things either did or just didn't click on a given night compared to a dozen other matches where the inverse was true. God, I remember this show like it was yesterday. A ton of crowd pleasing wins underneath (save the relative shock of Naito losing to Goto), then THIS match which even Okada vs Tanahashi struggled to follow... but at least Little Kazu finally beat the fucker.  Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members ReturnOfTheMack Posted March 21 Paid Members Share Posted March 21 9 hours ago, LaGoosh said: Fuck me, they're going to have to turn Mercedes heel soon aren't they? Pretty hard to cheer her, even Toronto seemed to give up after the initial CEO chants. She's coming across as insanely phoney and unlikable. That she basically came out just to be like "hey, I made the production team put together a video about how great I am, watch it!" isn't exactly top babyface behaviour. This a million time. I've never seen a promo that felt as insincere as this. Â Is Kingston injured? He looked way more out of shape than usual, and loads of his offense felt really light. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Lion_of_the_Midlands Posted March 21 Paid Members Share Posted March 21 The only way Eddie could look more out of shape is if he was attached to a defibrillator. I thought the match was OK but they both looked a little tentative at times. Okada is going to have to adapt to the American TV style under the full glare of the spotlight which should be doable but won't be easy. Ospreay continues to defy belief. The delivery and accent went a bit Tom Hardy in Peaky Blinders this week but again more than did its job. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loki Posted March 21 Share Posted March 21 6 hours ago, DavidB6937 said: I guess the one thing you can't port over, no matter who it is, is a long term emotional attachment if you've not followed their journey before. There's top stars and then there's favourites and a mixture of both. I mean, it's a problem with either complex character, or 'workrate' based gimmicks generally in wrestling. Â If your main strength is that you have great 40 minute matches, you're going to have to have some great 40 minute matches before a new audience invests in you. Â That's why it took ages for guys like Chris Benoit to get really over in WWF, he had to wrestle his way into people's enthusiasm. Â If, say, Adam Page ends up going to WWE, they'll have to properly introduce him to the audience and let his character develop in front of them, and so on. If you're Scott Steiner, you rock up looking like the Michelin Man, and your first words are "gimme the fucking mic" then everyone has got your character within 30 seconds of hitting the building. Â Samoa Joe strolls out with his towel and scowl and he's off to the races. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Nick James Posted March 22 Paid Members Share Posted March 22 The problem with Mercedes feeling disingenuous, is because it probably is. It was only a few weeks ago she was saying she will be back in WWE, which doesn't really play into here being there to help 'the cause' rather than it being convenient for her. Time will tell, she's only had 2 appearances so far and we know from time gone by that a flop debut doesn't automatically mean the person will flop. Look at Christian. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OzExile Posted March 22 Share Posted March 22 In 2024, why isn't Christian going over Adam Copeland? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members ReturnOfTheMack Posted March 22 Paid Members Share Posted March 22 2 hours ago, OzExile said: In 2024, why isn't Christian going over Adam Copeland? Yeah Copeland, move over for the (1 month) younger talent! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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