WyattSheepMask Posted December 1, 2020 Share Posted December 1, 2020 (edited) Appreciate airing on the side of caution with the spoiler tags, but I think that’s common knowledge. I get that reinventing Bray Wyatt from Swamp Cult Leader to Poor Man’s Pennywise allows them to refeud him with everyone as it’s essentially a different person, but feuding with Orton worked out so well last time I’m amazed they’re doing it again. Edited December 1, 2020 by WyattSheepMask Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pinc Posted December 1, 2020 Share Posted December 1, 2020 2 hours ago, WyattSheepMask said: Appreciate airing on the side of caution with the spoiler tags, but I think that’s common knowledge. I get that reinventing Bray Wyatt from Swamp Cult Leader to Poor Man’s Pennywise allows them to refeud him with everyone as it’s essentially a different person, but feuding with Orton worked out so well last time I’m amazed they’re doing it again. I maintain that Orton in the Wyatt family was the most interesting he'd been in years. The feud started well and all it was just that stupid projector match at Mania that sours everyone's memory of it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Supremo Posted December 1, 2020 Paid Members Share Posted December 1, 2020 AJ Styles vs. Drew at the PPV has the chance to be great. Both feel like the perfect opponent for the other. Let's just pretend the Randy Orton title change never happened and get back to making Drew a superstar by having boss matches, looking incredible and beating everyone. Seeing the match graphic really hammers it home though. There needs to be a company-wide email sent out forbidding guys from having the identikit dark long hair and a short beard. Bleach it, dye it green, get a trim, shave it off, whatever. Just set yourself apart! When every fucker on your roster looks the same, is it any wonder guys can't get over? And to that point, no wonder Adam Cole can't move to the main roster. He just looks like everyone else if your mum shrank them in the wash! Â Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members tiger_rick Posted December 1, 2020 Paid Members Share Posted December 1, 2020 43 minutes ago, Pinc said: I maintain that Orton in the Wyatt family was the most interesting he'd been in years. The feud started well and all it was just that stupid projector match at Mania that sours everyone's memory of it. Absolutely right. They built and built that perfectly, Orton was a bundle of fun in the Wyatts, invigorated the family, fighting Luke Harper and chucking away his WM title shot was great stuff. Then having told a good intruiging story, they flipped a switch into weeks of overblown nonsense and stunts. All it needed was the Batista reveal and they had a few months of solid PPV main events in their hands. easy to escalate into existing gimmick matches that would have sold it. Instead, as Pinc points out, everyone just remembers it as being atrocious because the whole thing was soured. Remember Orton, the supposed babyface, burning down Wyatts cabin for no real reason? What on earth was that? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WyattSheepMask Posted December 1, 2020 Share Posted December 1, 2020 (edited) I agree it that it got interesting once Orton “joined” the family, but before that they had a snoozer at one of post-Summerslam PPVs, and then Randy was suddenly a twisted firestarter yet presented as the face. Had they done the canvas projection just the once they might’ve got away with it, but as is the style they milked it dry in the space of one match, and then they had that match round at Rob Zombie’s house and I don’t recall the feud getting a proper blow-off because after that Randy was paired up with Jinder. No-one came out of the feud better for it having happened, which granted you can probably say that for the majority of the show for the last 10+ years Edited December 1, 2020 by WyattSheepMask Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Supremo Posted December 1, 2020 Paid Members Share Posted December 1, 2020 I’ll never get over the fact that instead of naturally including Luke Harper in that match, which would have improved it ten-fold, someone went, “nah, don’t worry about it, I’ve got a lad in the production department who’s got a video of maggots. We’re sweet.” Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members LaGoosh Posted December 1, 2020 Paid Members Share Posted December 1, 2020 1 hour ago, Supremo said: I’ll never get over the fact that instead of naturally including Luke Harper in that match, which would have improved it ten-fold, someone went, “nah, don’t worry about it, I’ve got a lad in the production department who’s got a video of maggots. We’re sweet.” Storyline wise it would have made perfect sense to have a fatal four way with AJ Styles and Harper. The match would have been a lot better, the show would have been shorter and Shane McMahon would have been kept off the card. A no-lose scenario. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members TheBurningRed Posted December 1, 2020 Paid Members Share Posted December 1, 2020 2 hours ago, LaGoosh said: Shane McMahon would have been kept off the card To be fair, that AJ and Shane match was probably the best match on the show. Nowhere near as bad as it could’ve been considering it’s Shane.  The triple threat would’ve been the way to go though. Everything about that story was going so well. And then it just turned to shit so quickly. I think even before Orton turned arsonist, it started to fall apart. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Nick James Posted December 8, 2020 Paid Members Share Posted December 8, 2020 That was quite possibly one of the most boring Raw's for a long while. If these are the rewrites, god knows what was left on the cutting room floor. Even Drew wasn't great on this one with the cheesy scrap with Sheamus backstage and the fake laughing as they walked off. Ricochet needs to get out as soon as possible, 2 minute matches on a 3 hour show is appalling. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Statto Posted December 10, 2020 Paid Members Share Posted December 10, 2020 Made the mistake of scrolling through the comments on an article promoted at me on Facebook on how they "managed to pull off" the clearly pre-taped Wyatt/Fiend switcheroo on Raw. "I was convinced it was Bo Dallas". "It definitely wasn't pre-taped, Bray was wearing tear-off clothes with the Fiend outfit underneath, he just quickly changed when the lights went out". Fuck me, these people walk among us, and are allowed to vote, drive & procreate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WyattSheepMask Posted December 10, 2020 Share Posted December 10, 2020 2 hours ago, Statto said: Made the mistake of scrolling through the comments on an article promoted at me on Facebook on how they "managed to pull off" the clearly pre-taped Wyatt/Fiend switcheroo on Raw. "I was convinced it was Bo Dallas". "It definitely wasn't pre-taped, Bray was wearing tear-off clothes with the Fiend outfit underneath, he just quickly changed when the lights went out". Fuck me, these people walk among us, and are allowed to vote, drive & procreate. Wrestling fans really are a fascinating bunch. We complain when things change, when things don’t change, some question whether a guy really had his arm amputated or not so he had to post a photo of what remains of the limb to prove it. Some questioned whether or not Dean Ambrose and Renee Young getting married or not was a angle to the point that they went searching for their marriage certificate online. They’re terrified of having the wool pulled over their eyes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snitsky's back acne Posted December 10, 2020 Share Posted December 10, 2020 (edited) 3 hours ago, WyattSheepMask said:  They’re terrified of having the wool pulled over their eyes I've seen these kind of things online. Modern fans scoff at fans of the past for 'believing' what they saw, like 'Yeah, I'D never be THAT dumb!' yet what they fail to realise is that most people never believed - they allowed themselves to be lost in the moment, to become emotionally invested. It's become 'Paint by numbers' now (pre-Covid obvs). Chant here. Cheer here. Fans know what they're SUPPOSED to do but any ounce of genuine emotion has gone. Now, a lot of fans are so keen to be seen as 'smart' and view wrestling like one would a painting at an art gallery. I've been watching a lot of 80's/90's stuff on the Network and the wrestlers could do almost nothing and have the crowd going crazy. I'd rather THOSE fans, the 'stupid marks' that a section of modern fans decry, than the fans who are just waiting to get their chants in and put themselves over any day of the week. Edited December 10, 2020 by Snitsky's back acne Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Lenin Posted December 10, 2020 Paid Members Share Posted December 10, 2020 1 hour ago, Snitsky's back acne said: Fans know what they're SUPPOSED to do but any ounce of genuine emotion has gone. I genuinely pity any fan that doesn't feel (or allow themselves to feel) genuine emotion in wrestling. There's been so many moments looking back, where I feel a bit silly for getting carried away with how I reacted to things. Then again, I still get goosebumps thinking about them all. Judgement Day 2001 - Undertaker's return Wrestlemania 21 - Hulk Hogan returned (mentioned on here before but the group of us were hugging, crying, cheering) HBK/Jericho promo on Raw at the 02 Arena, London - (2009?) When he came out to Flair's music and started their epic feud Wrestlemania 27 - HHH's tombstone, pin and the subsequent kick out is probably the greatest thing I've ever seen. Goosebumps, tears, shock. Totally exhilarating. SummerSlam 92 - Savage/Warrior - awestruck These days there's a fair amount of guff but it can still be great if we let it. I even screamed "F***!" last week when Sting appeared. Lovely stuff.       Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snitsky's back acne Posted December 10, 2020 Share Posted December 10, 2020 5 minutes ago, Suplex Sinner said: I genuinely pity any fan that doesn't feel (or allow themselves to feel) genuine emotion in wrestling. There's been so many moments looking back, where I feel a bit silly for getting carried away with how I reacted to things. Then again, I still get goosebumps thinking about them all.  I'm sure those same fans will say 'but look how everyone lost their shit Edge returned' and, yes, that's true but those moments are the exception rather than the norm and those momentary lapses where they truly allow themselves to be lost in the moment are quickly replaced with 'I can't believe he lied on Twitter' or ' Yeah well it was obvious he was going to return!' because Heaven forbid we are actually a fan and got worked once in a while. I think the other thing is people saying how shit wrestling was 'back then' - yeah but you know what, 'shit' wrestling with a crowd going ape-shit is WAY easier to watch than a 'great' match with a tepid reaction and soulless, formulaic chanting.  Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Cutting Edge Posted December 10, 2020 Share Posted December 10, 2020 Its tragic what alot of fans have become, every where you look about wrestling "Vince" is mentioned, I think alot have worked themselves into a shoot believing all the stories are true about him (I'm sure alot are but you get my point) and WWE can't do anything right and he should die etc. Even AEW is starting to get backlash, no wonder companies don't know what they want or how to please them, most have no attention spans and want the opposite of what they're given   Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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