RedRooster Posted January 10, 2022 Share Posted January 10, 2022 1 minute ago, LaGoosh said: No. I think there's just the right amount. Dark & Elevation are C shows and if you don't watch them it makes no difference. Rampage is a fun B show that again isn't really essential but is usually enjoyable. Dynamite is as mixed a bag as it's always been but as a casual fan you can easily get by on just watching Dynamite. If you think there's too much AEW the real answer is you're probably just a bit bored of AEW. For me, I think less is more. The more programming you have to watch, the more of a commitment it becomes to become an AEW fan. You describe Rampage as a "B show", but it still hosts big angles and moments - CM Punk's debut, Omega/Christian, the Punk/Kingston angle, Sammy losing to Cody and Hook's debut all come to mind. AEW has never been great at recaps either - if you miss Rampage, there's very little of "here's what you missed" on Dynamite, and that's a problem. Rampage has almost certainly benefitted them financially, but from the perspective of growing their fanbase, I'm not convinced it's helpful. There's so much content to consume these days, that it's a big ask, for people to commit to two shows twice-a-week. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members LaGoosh Posted January 10, 2022 Paid Members Share Posted January 10, 2022 1 hour ago, RedRooster said: For me, I think less is more. The more programming you have to watch, the more of a commitment it becomes to become an AEW fan. WWE have had multiple shows per week for decades with massive success...why should AEW be any different especially when millions of dollars are involved? You don't have to watch everything to be an AEW fan, especially with YouTube highlights where you can catch up with basically everything you want in the same amount of time it takes to have your morning shit. That's how used to keep up with WWE anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Merzbow Posted January 10, 2022 Share Posted January 10, 2022 I think there's less of a problem of there being too much AEW and more of an issue that not enough of it's very good and really worth tuning in for right now, maybe it's just me but I feel like there's a huge gulf between those truly excellent moments which there are some and the rest of the show which is just there, a bit dull. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Nick James Posted January 10, 2022 Paid Members Share Posted January 10, 2022 I think there was once an argument that AEW may have had too many shows on the go, but that was back when they were intertwining storylines with the 4/5 hour episodes of Dark which meant you ended up missing things that would just seem to happen all of a sudden on Dynamite, but since the inception of Rampage, it seems that they have really curbed that issue. You could watch just the three hours of AEW TV right now and not feel like you have missed anything. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Infinity Land Posted January 10, 2022 Share Posted January 10, 2022 50 minutes ago, LaGoosh said: WWE have had multiple shows per week for decades with massive success...why should AEW be any different especially when millions of dollars are involved? You don't have to watch everything to be an AEW fan, especially with YouTube highlights where you can catch up with basically everything you want in the same amount of time it takes to have your morning shit. That's how used to keep up with WWE anyway. Always been a pet hate of mine. People only seeing things through the Raw/Smackdown or Nitro/Thunder lens. Forgetting that both companies had multiple shows on the go before they things settled into this format. While changing the time slot wouldn't hurt long term i'll be happy with Rampage staying just an hour without the attempt at parity between it and Dynamite. TNT specials and the odd 2hr Rampage extension, as happened for Rampage Grand Slam, they've got extra TV time when they want to do something big. Rather than struggling to fill it 52 weeks a year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Butternut Squash Posted January 10, 2022 Share Posted January 10, 2022 It's a creative dilution to me. Some of the connective tissue in the storytelling is getting lost. Like Rooster said some of that is down to them not recapping things from Rampage. I don't know what happened with the Dante-Leo thing for example. There's definitely been an increase in backstage interview beatdowns too. My Petty Annoyance. Not every Rampage match should need an angle to set it up. The more they do, the more they water things down. It's gotten very contrived with them.  Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members LaGoosh Posted January 10, 2022 Paid Members Share Posted January 10, 2022 (edited) 24 minutes ago, Mr Butternut Squash said: I don't know what happened with the Dante-Leo thing for example. Fuck all. Nothing has happened. I don't think the stories are being diluted because AEW doesn't really have many stories. The booking has been fairly wonky since the last PPV. That's not because of Rampage, that's just because of bad booking. The over reliance on backstage fights and post match beatdowns has been fucking shocking recently. Edited January 10, 2022 by LaGoosh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Hannibal Scorch Posted January 10, 2022 Paid Members Share Posted January 10, 2022 20 minutes ago, LaGoosh said: Fuck all. Nothing has happened. I don't think the stories are being diluted because AEW doesn't really have many stories. The booking has been fairly wonky since the last PPV. That's not because of Rampage, that's just because of bad booking. The over reliance on backstage fights and post match beatdowns has been fucking shocking recently. And yet, as per the graphic shown during Dynamite, they are back  Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Infinity Land Posted January 10, 2022 Share Posted January 10, 2022 18 minutes ago, LaGoosh said: Fuck all. Nothing has happened. I don't think the stories are being diluted because AEW doesn't really have many stories. Yeah. This has always been a problem for them unfortunately. They will do some brilliant highlight/hype packages but then never put them on TV. Even something like Hangman v. Danielson II would have felt that much more epic if there had been a package beforehand. Instead of going straight into the entrances. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
d-d-d-dAz Posted January 10, 2022 Share Posted January 10, 2022 I just watch Dynamite and Rampage and keep up just fine. I don't think AEW have reached the point where saturation is a concern. For me, the biggest issue is control and discipline across the individual shows. It STILL feels as if each match is booked in a vacuum so the same gimmick (say, a table spot or whatever) can be repeated multiple times over the course of a show. The same is true of promos, where a big 'wow moment' (i.e., wrestler X calls wrestler Y an effing bumhole or something) could easily be diluted by someone else using the same phrase. Booking too - leading to multiple post-match beatdowns on one night, or backstage fights (to Goosh's point). That's all still a problem. Also, by discipline, I mean... they don't seem to be at a point where they're confident enough to look at their roster and decide who's main event, who's mid-card, who's a curtain twitcher and who's dead wood. And, without that self-awareness/self-appraisal, it means they're not pacing their shows very well... and you can have main events of shows that feel like dark matches, or main eventers dossing about with utter morons for far too long. Or shows where their main eventers have all been trotted out in the first 20 minutes, and then it's a waste land for an hour. I think they'd benefit from mapping out their roster into buckets based on star power and then mapping out the show ahead of time, so they know when they should have a main eventers on-screen.  Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedRooster Posted January 10, 2022 Share Posted January 10, 2022 1 hour ago, LaGoosh said: WWE have had multiple shows per week for decades with massive success...why should AEW be any different especially when millions of dollars are involved? You don't have to watch everything to be an AEW fan, especially with YouTube highlights where you can catch up with basically everything you want in the same amount of time it takes to have your morning shit. That's how used to keep up with WWE anyway. I think that's the key line here - "for decades". Their audience has dropped massively over that time; which suggests that their formula may not be fit for purpose anymore. Even if you look at the wider television landscape - it wasn't that long ago when the average length of a season of blockbuster American TV shows sat at 20+ episodes, and now you're looking at around 10 episodes per season. There are more choices out there, and people have less time. So while one two-hour episode of television might be something a potential new fan is willing to fit into their weekly viewing schedule, two episodes plus might be off-putting. Financially it may work out right now, but I'm not convinced that it's helpful in the long-term. These days, I firmly believe that less is more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members LaGoosh Posted January 10, 2022 Paid Members Share Posted January 10, 2022 1 hour ago, d-d-d-dAz said: Also, by discipline, I mean... they don't seem to be at a point where they're confident enough to look at their roster and decide who's main event, who's mid-card, who's a curtain twitcher and who's dead wood. And, without that self-awareness/self-appraisal, it means they're not pacing their shows very well... and you can have main events of shows that feel like dark matches, or main eventers dossing about with utter morons for far too long. Or shows where their main eventers have all been trotted out in the first 20 minutes, and then it's a waste land for an hour. I think they'd benefit from mapping out their roster into buckets based on star power and then mapping out the show ahead of time, so they know when they should have a main eventers on-screen. Absolutely this. Wrestling shows need a clear pecking order. Making clear jumps from lower to mid to upper is how you get wrestlers over. 90% of the roster feels like they're on equal footing and a lot of matches are wrestled the same way. CM Punk should not be selling for Daniel Garcia at this point. And instead of getting top programmes like Darby Allin vs Malaki Black you get Darby Allin vs Billy Gunn & Malaki Black vs Brian Pillman Jnr. Feels like AEW is holding back on a lot of big matches and when they're so new and have such a deep roster I have no idea why. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Jazzy G Posted January 10, 2022 Paid Members Share Posted January 10, 2022 Presumably they're trying to keep their top stars apart on TV to try and sell the PPV, but the problem with stocking them into competitive matches with underneath guys is that rather than making the underneath guys look good it can make your top guys look weak, as has been mentioned. At least it's not like that era in TNA where people would be doing the 50/50 thing in 5 minute matches every week while hoping that you'd buy the PPV to watch them go for 20 minutes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 10, 2022 Share Posted January 10, 2022 Yeah the keeping guys apart was cool when you needed fresh matches for ppvs. But there’s guys on shows they could have facing off that aren’t going to touch again for probably a year, just stop worrying too much than a single match loss will be damaging.  a point cornette made that played on YouTube I think holds weight, is that you see someone on dynamite early that you like, if that’s your only act you like you know you can switch off as they don’t reappear. If you are a punk fan you are sorted usually in the first hour, and can watch something Else and miss nothing Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members LaGoosh Posted January 10, 2022 Paid Members Share Posted January 10, 2022 9 minutes ago, jazzygeofferz said: Presumably they're trying to keep their top stars apart on TV to try and sell the PPV That's what's unclear to me. Because with only 4 PPVs a year you can't really save too much for the PPVs because you've got 3 months of telly to fill inbetween and as a newish company you'd think getting (and keeping) new eyes on the TV would be priority one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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