Paid Members Chunk Posted December 2, 2019 Paid Members Share Posted December 2, 2019 On 11/7/2019 at 2:01 PM, JNLister said: You shouldn't obsessively check polls and projections every day, but if you do, this is probably the best one-stop way: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1nUxnVJIFRo9A806IHtkTcd_Cxn1hO4P98nHCnBgeMFI/edit#gid=586083410 It's done by 326 Politics and is updated each night. It averages out the latest poll figures then tries to forecast what that could mean for each seat. If you scroll across the main tab, there's all sorts of juicy stuff like chances of winning the seat if the election was today and a simple "leans/likely/safe" ranking next to the result from last time so you can spot where seat changes are likely. The last tab on the spreadsheet tracks the daily projected seat totals, which might be a smoother way to track "how the campaign is going" than trying to track voting intention, particularly when it comes to where the votes make a difference. (Note this is only valid while it continues to show the Tory vote share ticking down each day. The moment it shows them gaining, it's clearly voodoo junk.) Hasn't been updated for a while but, interestingly, is showing the gap between Labour and Conservatives closing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members JNLister Posted December 2, 2019 Paid Members Share Posted December 2, 2019 37 minutes ago, Chunk said: Hasn't been updated for a while but, interestingly, is showing the gap between Labour and Conservatives closing. I believe the updates are on pause while they reconfigure the model to start accounting for polls done in specific constituencies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Carbomb Posted December 2, 2019 Paid Members Share Posted December 2, 2019 (edited) 14 hours ago, hallicks said: State ownership of utilities is not uncommon in Europe. Many of the UK rail franchises are owned by the state run rail companies of other countries - the Dutch, German, Italian, Hong Kong and French state all get a slice of our rail pie, the infrastructure of which is all paid for by the taxpayer anyway. The consequence is the highest rail prices in Europe. My season ticket will be pushing £5k next year. I think Labour's plan to nationalize trains is to let the franchises expire and then bring them into public ownership. The privatization of Royal Mail was actual robbery, as it was deliberately undervalued by George Osborne to make money for his pals. I'm sure the super rich will scream bloody murder regardless of what price Labour puts on bringing companies back into public ownership. Also, in response to @quote the raven's point about the state getting these industries for "less than the market price" - why should they pay market price? Those people are not entitled to a profit, just like anyone else who makes an investment on what they think they might get. An investment has all sorts of potential factors that might affect it, and one of them is the possibility of the government taking ownership of it. That's a calculated risk, and it's one that is now possible. As is pointed out in the below article, there is nothing in UK law which says the government has to pay the market price outlined by the CBI, and that we should actually buy them back for the price the investors paid for it, which comes to a shit-ton less. I personally wouldn't have a problem with it - part of the reason this country's in this state is because of private individuals trying to profit at the expense of the public. https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/nationalise-royal-mail-energy-water-savings-bills-national-grid-a9203636.html Edited December 2, 2019 by Carbomb Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr_Danger Posted December 2, 2019 Share Posted December 2, 2019 I know all my contributions to this thread are postal work related but given the recent scandalous outcome of the strike conflict we're in nothing would give me greater pleasure than a below market rate government takeover. Especially as I've dumped all my shares anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members JNLister Posted December 2, 2019 Paid Members Share Posted December 2, 2019 Good piece on some of the common misconceptions/criticisms of opinion polls (and why some are valid): http://ukpollingreport.co.uk/blog/archives/10114 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Cod Eye Posted December 3, 2019 Paid Members Share Posted December 3, 2019 Question to those of you with a more in deph knowledge of the various polls that are going around. I've seen that they are generally saying the Tories lad is down to 9 points. How would this translate to seats, and does it mean we are likelly to have another hung parliament? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Lion_of_the_Midlands Posted December 3, 2019 Paid Members Share Posted December 3, 2019 13 minutes ago, Cod Eye said: Tories lad is down to 9 points. Its bad enough that you call him Boris. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Cod Eye Posted December 3, 2019 Paid Members Share Posted December 3, 2019 1 minute ago, Lion_of_the_Midlands said: Its bad enough that you call him Boris. I'm going to have to start proof reading my posts more.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members JNLister Posted December 3, 2019 Paid Members Share Posted December 3, 2019 16 minutes ago, Cod Eye said: Question to those of you with a more in deph knowledge of the various polls that are going around. I've seen that they are generally saying the Tories lad is down to 9 points. How would this translate to seats, and does it mean we are likelly to have another hung parliament? Most common view is that it would take around six or seven points for the Conservatives to be confident of getting a majority this time. Less than that and they'd be relying on their votes being as or more efficiently distributed than the other parties. The risk would be a small lead just represented them putting on more votes than usual in the Midlands and North but winding up with lots of close seconds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Ronnie Posted December 3, 2019 Paid Members Share Posted December 3, 2019 23 minutes ago, Cod Eye said: Question to those of you with a more in deph knowledge of the various polls that are going around. I've seen that they are generally saying the Tories lad is down to 9 points. How would this translate to seats, and does it mean we are likelly to have another hung parliament? A lead of 9 percentage points is significant. You know Labour's landslide win in 1997, when they got 2.5 times the seats that the Tories did? Their lead over the Tories was 12.5 percentage points. In 2015, the Tories' lead over Labour was only 6.5 percentage points, which was enough to give them a majority, with Labour wining about a third of seats. Extrapolate from there and you get the picture that 9 percentage points is good news for the Tories. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Hannibal Scorch Posted December 3, 2019 Paid Members Share Posted December 3, 2019 Trump - We do not want the NHS, even on a silver platter Rabb - Hold my beer. The Labour narrative is wrong. The NHS, I don't think, is for sale. What will happen is we will allow the NHS to be opened up to US firms to take over parts of it, and the changes in the drug deal will see a huge increase on the cost of medication to the point of crippling it to the point of collapse. THEN they will swoop in and buy it. https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/dominic-raab-brexit-nhs-privatisation-trump-us-drugs-price-increase-a9230661.html?fbclid=IwAR0JHFk_rWDQeLCi4yRsU8G9votsYdkzKwrVHoiEHGn3WYbkYCNq5_mo_hk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Carbomb Posted December 3, 2019 Paid Members Share Posted December 3, 2019 I think Chest nailed it previously - the US is angling for a deal that will be bad for the NHS, and it's been mischaracterised as selling it off. It could be viewed as "selling it off" in a sense, but in the literal sense, no - which enables BJ and Co. to get off the hook by denying it's literally for sale. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members BomberPat Posted December 3, 2019 Paid Members Share Posted December 3, 2019 It mostly comes down to no one defining what "For Sale" means, so like so many things, either side can willfully misconstrue the argument of the other, and get away with being not technically wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Chest Rockwell Posted December 3, 2019 Moderators Share Posted December 3, 2019 It's unnecessarily ambiguous wording, without actually explaining the situation though. But I guess people need simple catchphrases and talking points. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Factotum Posted December 3, 2019 Share Posted December 3, 2019 Well yeah, the simpler the message the better. Its like 'Get Brexit Done', it doesn't mean anything. There's no nuance, but a lot of people just don't care about that. Things have to be black and white. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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