The AEW Wednesday Night Dynamite Thread

[DavidB6937]

In the grand scheme of things, we are still very very very very early days for both AEW and NXT TV - AEW especially. The key factors are two fold really:

1) Being able to sustain a quality product for a longer period of time - NXT has a proven track record of being able to reinvent itself with new stars etc, while AEW has done well in the short term. It'll take time for them to really get out there, and it relates to point 2..

2) The industry as a whole. While there are more options than ever, it's obviously in a down period especially in relation to the mainstream etc. It's very difficult to obtain to casuals at the moment because interest is waning. It'll likely come back in time, and perhaps AEW could be the catalyst for change but it's not an overnight thing.

What AEW needs to do is survive. They were never going to win a war or even have a HUGE impact right off the bat. It's an industry that is so 'WWE' for many years now that it's a real challenge to change that perception. Can it be done? Maybe. Is it something AEW should be looking to do? I'm not sure what their fight should be really. I think at the moment the sensible thing is to find their footing, see what works and what doesn't, and just provide a consistently good show that offers something a little different. That's what they're doing right now and they need to stick to their guns and ride out the first few months/years.

For what it's worth, I've been very impressed by both NXT and AEW since they went to TV and I'm loving having both to watch every week.

[Snitsky's back acne]

13 hours ago, The King Of Swing said:

After DDT Ultimate Party I'm convinced that Japan is the only place he looks the star he's portrayed as.

 

Agreed.

I always hear 'He was huge in Japan!!' - Yeah, so were The Nolans, so....
 

[Accident Prone]

The difference between Kenny in Japan and Kenny in AEW, is that in Japan he had all his bad habits reigned in, or at least under moderation, by the bookers.

In AEW, he's been given the freedom to just do as he pleases and it's meant all his negatives are there for all to see. The Kenny Omega we saw chasing for the IWGP title and grueling G1 performances in New Japan is vastly different from the flippant, self-indulgent Kenny Omega we see in AEW.

[Hannibal Scorch]

1 hour ago, Snitsky's back acne said:

Agreed.

I always hear 'He was huge in Japan!!' - Yeah, so were The Nolans, so....
 

as Accident Prone said, had you watched those matches you would understand the rave reviews. He has been disappointing in AEW and I think, or rather hope, the reason for this is because it's been planned as this slow heel turn. He's not been turning up, he hasn't been getting the results, he hasn't as been as important or integrual as the rest of The Elite have been. And I wonder if this is all part of the masterplan for him to turn his back on them for not having his back.

Or they have let him do what he wants and actually without a filter, he is just bang average.

[Chris B]

I think it's also a difference in which audiences he's playing to. He's on a different stage than he's ever been on, after all. At the moment, if he was doing long, grueling matches with everyone, it wouldn't work either - that'd just make him seem less of a star too, because they don't have many stars yet that he can work with, and he's coming in as more of a star. He's also in his first big feud, and it's opposite a tweener who everyone wants to cheer.

For what it's worth, I couldn't stand Omega for a while after I started watching him. To the point where I found him outright off-putting. But the video and twitter thread someone did a little while ago that explained the Kenny/Ibushi love story turned me around on him, and I gave him more of a chance - and that coincided with a great run in NJPW that also made me a fan of Okada.

I'm liking him in AEW, but I came in liking him, so he already feels like a big star to me. One slow-burn thing they seem to be doing (which I really like) is that losses really, really bother him. He dwells on them, they annoy him - and that's not a story I've seen done like this. They've done the set-up, and once he got a decent win or two, he was fine again - but that feels like something they'll go back to.

[Snitsky's back acne]

5 minutes ago, Hannibal Scorch said:

as Accident Prone said, had you watched those matches you would understand the rave reviews. He has been disappointing in AEW and I think, or rather hope, the reason for this is because it's been planned as this slow heel turn. He's not been turning up, he hasn't been getting the results, he hasn't as been as important or integrual as the rest of The Elite have been. And I wonder if this is all part of the masterplan for him to turn his back on them for not having his back.

Or they have let him do what he wants and actually without a filter, he is just bang average.

I think that last point is spot on. I've no doubt he came across like a star in Japan but away from that environment he has been horribly exposed.

A lot of wrestlers looked great in ECW because Heyman was so good at hiding their flaws. Outside of that environment those same wrestlers were pretty naff.
Russo looked like a creative genius in WWE because he had McMahon as a filter. Outside of that environment he was exposed as being shit.
Omega looked great in Japan - likely due to who he worked and how he was booked and, as has been said, what he was/was not allowed to do. Outside of that he has shown himself to be a decent enough modern style wrestler but nothing more. He is certainly not this huge megastar that Meltzer and others hyped him up to be.

[Hannibal Scorch]

Just now, Snitsky's back acne said:

I think that last point is spot on. I've no doubt he came across like a star in Japan but away from that environment he has been horribly exposed.

A lot of wrestlers looked great in ECW because Heyman was so good at hiding their flaws. Outside of that environment those same wrestlers were pretty naff.
Russo looked like a creative genius in WWE because he had McMahon as a filter. Outside of that environment he was exposed as being shit.
Omega looked great in Japan - likely due to who he worked and how he was booked and, as has been said, what he was/was not allowed to do. Outside of that he has shown himself to be a decent enough modern style wrestler but nothing more. He is certainly not this huge megastar that Meltzer and others hyped him up to be.

Oh aye, we definitely have not seen the headliner Kenny Omega in AEW. Everyone is suggesting a MJF turn on Cody, but that is too obvious. I would love it to be Kenny and that is what I am hoping this has been leading up to.Remember, AEW was launched without Omega. He only joined in the February when it had been launched on the 1st January. Yes, we know why, but he could definetly play up to that. For his mates to not wait for him to be available etc.

[Carbomb]

To be fair, Accident Prone's earlier point of him being reigned in in NJPW and not in AEW rings particularly true because it's the case with a lot of things in AEW at the moment. From what I understand (I haven't been able to keep up with every episode yet), there's a lot of over-use of similar spots in different matches, particularly the Tope Suicida. They really need to start restricting their performers at least a little. They don't have to go full-on WWE with it, there's plenty of middle ground, but they need to start putting their talent's ideas through a filter. Jericho's smashing it and clearly enjoying himself, but he's massively experienced, so chances are he knows what he's doing, and won't need that much reigning in. Same goes for Cody to a lesser degree (that throne-smashing should've been nixed). And I daresay that Dustin would be the same.

Everyone else on the roster, though - I don't know what the road agent situation is, but they either need to change him up if he's crap, give him more authority if he's good, or get one in if they don't have one.

[Chris B]

7 minutes ago, Hannibal Scorch said:

Oh aye, we definitely have not seen the headliner Kenny Omega in AEW.

That actually brings up an interesting point - I wonder how he's going down with fans that don't give a shit about Meltzer. This is obviously getting a bunch of new people watching, who won't have seen Omega before. From a fresh perspective, rather than 'best bout machine', I wonder how he's coming across.

[Snitsky's back acne]

7 minutes ago, Hannibal Scorch said:

Oh aye, we definitely have not seen the headliner Kenny Omega in AEW. Everyone is suggesting a MJF turn on Cody, but that is too obvious. I would love it to be Kenny and that is what I am hoping this has been leading up to.Remember, AEW was launched without Omega. He only joined in the February when it had been launched on the 1st January. Yes, we know why, but he could definetly play up to that. For his mates to not wait for him to be available etc.

It depends if he has the capability to pull that off.

I have no doubt he can deliver amazing match after amazing match but can he carry a top level American feud and become a big star to a new audience who are not familiar/don't care about his Japan work? I haven't seen it yet. Maybe he can.
 

[The King Of Swing]

One funny thing about the Countdown video was me foolishly assuming that the segment about Japan would be about Riho and Sakura, possibly building upon the whole student/teacher dynamic.

Of course it was about Omega.

[Accident Prone]

The thing with Omega is he genuinely is one of the best in the world. This is not a case of Heyman hiding Tazz's negatives, this is a case of Kenny being quite self-destructive outside of pre-set parameters and seniors with the balls to say "No". Hell, he was great in DDT, a promotion that actively encourages all kinds of zany shit, and even they had the right kind of restrictions to keep Kenny in the zone.

But with AEW he's just been given this sandbox to play in and it's brought out the worst in him.

I'm not a Melzter band-wagoner nor am I totally against everything he says and writes, but I can tell you that his opinion had nothing to do with Omega's popularity, at least with me. Omega is up there with the best but he's letting his worst attributes (because every wrestler, no matter how great, has their bad points) really come to the forefront. 

Remember that awesome sit down interview he did after he learned that Mox had to pull out of their originally scheduled match? Where's that Kenny? Where was that passion? Where was that story? Where has that been since then? I think that was the last time we saw a version of Kenny Omega that we were excited about, because since then it's been barbed wire brooms, cospay and bitter shots at his ex-employers and ex-colleagues.

[Snitsky's back acne]

52 minutes ago, Accident Prone said:

The thing with Omega is he genuinely is one of the best in the world.

Depends what criteria that is being based on I suppose.

Great matches? Sure, but Dean Malenko consistently had great matches. Plus, look at who Omega had those great matches with.
Great promo? Everyone says the Moxley one so, okay, but other than that.... ..? I would imagine there is a reason Kenny has not been given/requested live promo time...
Charisma? M'eh... no sorry... not seeing it..... he comes off like a goof....he appeals to the gamers and the nerds but we are not talking Rock or Austin charisma here. He needs something else if he is going to draw in a wider audience, especially in a company with the likes of Jericho and Cody. 
...what else is there?....

Dare I say it but... have we all fallen for the hype and Kenny Omega is maybe actually just not THAT great?.... Maybe? .... 






 

[DavidB6937]

2 minutes ago, Snitsky's back acne said:

Dare I say it but... have we all fallen for the hype and Kenny Omega is maybe actually just not THAT great?.... Maybe? .... 

Nah, if he was overhyped then people would have seen through it by now. He's not just some guy that got pushed to the moon over the past 6 months and is suddenly being exposed as a fraud.

Is his self-booking questionable right now? Absolutely, but perhaps by design. They could have easily put him right at the top straight away and made AEW a vanity project for him and Cody etc. I think they're smart by keeping him away from being their top face BUT they're not doing it in a very careful way. He needs to be protected. He needs to be made to look good even if he's not champion or challenging for that title.

The focus is too much on him having fun and doing what he wants, which isn't going to cut it on a TV show where he has to accept that he has an audience to appeal to. It's okay in small doses but AEW now has a weekly TV show to worry about.

Saying that, they do have more than enough time to rehab him to the point where he comes off as the star he should. They have a LOT of viable top tier talent who could be champion and he's just one of them. When the time is right, they can pull the trigger on him being at the top of the company, but they really need to make sure he looks as good as he should even away from the title. He is that good.

[Snitsky's back acne]

3 minutes ago, DavidB6937 said:

He is that good.

I suppose time will tell.