WHAT PLAY YOU!? Version 3.0

[FLips]

3 hours ago, DavidB6937 said:

For me it's probably not a change in gaming but a change in my life. Ironically the bigger and more open gaming has become, the less time I've had to put into it. Growing up and having a family and responsibilities means I'd love to have time to put into these games but i simply dont. I'm sure younger me with hours to kill would've absolutely loved the exploration.

This is certainly part of it. I really enjoyed RDR1 but the sheer scale of RDR2 means I’ve never even attempted to play it.

Another thing for me though is that some games are backing themselves into a huge corner with scale now. The Legend of Zelda is a massive one. I know I’m in the tiny minority but BoTW is one of my least favourite Zelda games, and one I’m very unlikely to replay. That’s not because it’s a bad game because it’s not, it’s a gorgeous and creative game that really captures Miyamoto’s original concept behind the Zelda idea of pure unbounded exploration. My issue is that because it took so long to get to that point, it’s no longer a Zelda game. It’s another open world game in a sea of open world games.

Despite being that core concept, it sacrifices everything else that previous games had as part of it’s makeup; no dungeons, forgettable characters, forgettable music, no proper bosses and so on. You could take the Nintendo license off it and it could be any other game.
The biggest problem though and one that’s more apparent with Tears of The Kingdom is they went so big on the scale they can’t go back, or will likely be met with contempt if they do. BoTW is now the benchmark for Zelda games so the chances of them going back to smaller and linear games with all that charm and character crammed in is very unlikely. It’s just going to be bigger maps with more crafting options which isn’t what I want from a Zelda despite how great that first playthrough is. I can dedicate 20-30 hours to replaying Ocarina, Twilight or Wind Waker and finding all the secrets but there’s no way on earth I’m doing another 100 hours of BoTW.

Edited May 9, 2023 by FelatioLips

[Mr_Danger]

I’d say a big challenge that the AAA open world game faces is how to offer a meaningful playing experience for the ‘dad gamer’ crowd for sure. Red Dead 2 actually does a really good job of leading you through it but you have to put the hours in to learn its language first. The Zelda games are a great example of leading you without you realising you’re being lead so it all feels organic and like you’re the first person to stumble across a secret. From Soft have their own way of funnelling you but without experience in their games and even the odd walkthrough reference it’s a hard sell to a player with time constraints. AC falls a bit short for me but it’s mostly due to the Ubi style and it being so easy to miss stuff just because it’s so big and not particularly well crafted.

[Merzbow]

I still feel weird calling FromSoft an AAA developer, coming in from King's Field and their fantasy games are practically love letters to the most esoteric PC RPGs that needed a novel sized manual to understand shit.

Didn't Demons Souls nearly kill them off as everyone at Sony was like "this shit won't sell to mainstream audience", nearly not getting a Western release and now we have one of the biggest selling games in recent times in Elden Ring.

[BomberPat]

14 hours ago, Tommy! said:

Where do you stand on the occasionally heard view that lack of limitations hinders creativity by not presenting problems to try and solve?

I'm a huge believer in this, not just in games, but in pretty much any creative endeavor. If all you have in front of you is a blank slate, you get a kind of choice paralysis, and with nothing forcing you to make adjustments you'll never do your best work, because you'll always be able to go with your first instinct. Pretty much every artist, writer, filmmaker, musician or game designer can tell you about times that limitations or constraints forced their hand - whether that's time, budget, the limits of the tech, or their own ability - and how it was working around those limitations and working within those constraints that produced their best work; whether that's the fog mechanic in Silent Hill, or the broken shark prop in Jaws completely changing the direction of that movie.

I'm playing Horizon Forbidden West at the moment, and I'm enjoying it, but it's a game that suffers for a lack of limitations. The open world is massive, and has a few really impressive set-pieces, but it's not as interesting as the world in the original game, and the countless "follow this person, climb a mountain, fight a machine" side-quests get extremely repetitive, particularly when you're trekking across the map for all of them. It's not necessarily a game that would be improved by being made less open world, because I get the impression they started with "open world" as the core concept and built from there, but a lot of its weaknesses stem from that. 

I loved Red Dead 2, it might be one of my favourite ever games, but I doubt I'd have ever played it, and certainly never finished it, if I hadn't been stuck at home during a pandemic. Aside from a brilliant story, what makes that game work is that it feels alive. You're rarely just trudging your way across a massive map between quests, there's always something going on, random events taking place, and bits of scenery that you want to stop and take in. If you don't have those moments of discovery, open world is more of a weakness than a strength to me.

[Ironic Indie Lad]

I think I have reached my own personal burn out point with modern AAA 3rd person games. Trying desperately not to sound like a cynical old man here but they are all the same thing!

• Unnecessarily huge map.
• Squeezing through a little gap in a wall to hide the loading time of the next enormous area.
• Constant new customization and CRAFTING~! options with your character and weapons.
• Skill tree to enhance your health, abilities and so on.
• Tacked on side quests, things to collect etc.

I have previously enjoyed some of these games a lot (even Assasins Creed ones!) but I just cant get through them now. I dont know if its just a genre thats become so saturated or that Elden Ring has ruined gaming forever.

 

[seph]

On 5/8/2023 at 4:14 PM, seph said:

[Old man yelling at cloud]

Not cool #1 - Jedi Survivor is 155GB min on PS5, so had to toss two games off the drive. Maybe another if/when I get hit with a 50GB update thanks to Sony's IDIOTIC patching policy.

Not cool #2 - Whatever is copying/downloading is taking its sweet time - it's about 20% done with est. 70 minutes to go. I miss games being ready out of the box.

Either *external additional* SSDs will need to be mandatory in the near future due to escalating asset sizes, or things will become full circle and we'll go back to cartridges with "full" games on them. I may well love this game but once it's done it's going off.

[/Old man yelling at cloud]

 

TURNED CONSOLE ON, WHAT DID I SEE? A PATCH FILE THAT IS 1GB

 

Improvement is noticeable. Performance mode is far smoother, Resolution mode is blurrier of course but turning off the grain effect improves things.

Edited May 9, 2023 by seph

[The King Of Swing]

I remember back in the day, thinking that a 600meg patch (Disgaea 3, I think) was taking the piss.

[Keith Houchen]

Looking at the sale on Xbox. 2K23 NBA and golf bundle for 26 quid. Very tempted, although never played their golf games. 

[Jazzy G]

I don't think there'll be a golf game as fun as the Everybody's Golf series. Maybe Neo Turf Masters. 

[Dr. Alan Grant]

Is Tears Of The Kingdom a direct sequel to Breath Of The Wild? I have played BotW, but didn’t come close to finishing it. I’m wondering if it’s worth going back and playing it before I start the new one. Zelda games are usually standalone, but this one looks like it’s set in the same time period/world. 

[FLips]

10 minutes ago, Dr. Alan Grant said:

Is Tears Of The Kingdom a direct sequel to Breath Of The Wild? I have played BotW, but didn’t come close to finishing it. I’m wondering if it’s worth going back and playing it before I start the new one. Zelda games are usually standalone, but this one looks like it’s set in the same time period/world. 

It is yes!

[Bus Surfer]

Finished up The Ballad of Gay Tony and felt a bit burned out by the GTA IV map so decided to dust off GTA Online after a few years. Decided to play in invite only sessions to completely remove the knobbers on flying bikes gunning me down at all times. 

Had about 5 million in the bank so got myself the nightclub and a cocaine lock up. I apparently have the criminal enterprise pack unlocked (had no idea about this) so I got a free Bunker and counterfeit cash operation too along with some cars and guns. 

It all feels very grindy but I'm having fun at the moment and hopefully that will continue. I've read there's a fairly new Heist that can be done solo so I'm gonna look into that once I have enough money to buy the Submarine. 

Unbelievable that this is still going strong 10 years later.  Surely they won't just pull the plug when GTA 6 is released? 

[Dr. Alan Grant]

17 minutes ago, FelatioLips said:

It is yes!

Well now I’m torn. Go back and sink many hours into the first one, whilst everyone else is playing Tears. Or dive right into the new one, story be damned, eventually playing BotW down the line. 
 

The FOMO is real. 

[Loki]

On 5/9/2023 at 8:55 AM, FelatioLips said:

That’s not because it’s a bad game because it’s not, it’s a gorgeous and creative game that really captures Miyamoto’s original concept behind the Zelda idea of pure unbounded exploration. My issue is that because it took so long to get to that point, it’s no longer a Zelda game. It’s another open world game in a sea of open world games.

I have to say I disagree with this; I think BOTW actually sets the benchmark for what works in open-world play.  It's unmistakably Zelda but also actually an enjoyable open experience.

There's a great video about this, based on a lecture Nintendo gave on their design - 
 

I'm working on an open world game at the moment, and all these problems are ones we have to solve... and BOTW is the benchmark.

Like you, I'm not going to re-play it, and indeed I never finished it as it was TOO BIG.  But my nephews have completed it multiple times, with multiple different strategies and load outs.  There is so much replayability in the game, it's astonishing.  Roll on the new one, which I will also play, love, and not complete - but then I'm not the target audience, none of us are.

 

[Mr_Danger]

I spent far more time on BotW after I’d finished it than I did before that but even then it’s a long game. I don’t imagine you could beat it in less than 30 hours first time round. I’m trying to go in cold on the new one but heard a few bits on a podcast and it sounds like they’ve innovated/magpied some new systems again. I think Nintendo are the masters of game design and they do all their work in an arena that is accessible to 8 year olds as well as old arse gamers. Pretty good at selling old games for full price too!