Paid Members Hannibal Scorch Posted January 20, 2021 Paid Members Share Posted January 20, 2021 54 minutes ago, Lion_of_the_Midlands said: Looks like I was wrong. Bannon obviously stumped up the cash to buy his pardon. i am more angry about no second run of Tiger King next year Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Chest Rockwell Posted January 20, 2021 Moderators Share Posted January 20, 2021 1 hour ago, Lion_of_the_Midlands said: Looks like I was wrong. Bannon obviously stumped up the cash to buy his pardon. The BBC picture for Bannon says "he is accused of fraud but denies any wrongdoing". If he's accepted a pardon then he's admitted guilt. Shoddy reporting and it bothers me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Jazzy G Posted January 20, 2021 Paid Members Share Posted January 20, 2021 He's obviously accepting the pardon to save himself a long, costly legal process, and definitely not because Trump wants help with his social/news network or political party. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith Houchen Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 23 minutes ago, Chest Rockwell said: The BBC picture for Bannon says "he is accused of fraud but denies any wrongdoing". If he's accepted a pardon then he's admitted guilt. Shoddy reporting and it bothers me. He could’ve accepted a pardon because now there won’t be a trial and that’s the end of it. Like settling out of court isn’t an admission of guilt. But yeah, he did it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Chest Rockwell Posted January 20, 2021 Moderators Share Posted January 20, 2021 18 minutes ago, Keith Houchen said: He could’ve accepted a pardon because now there won’t be a trial and that’s the end of it. Like settling out of court isn’t an admission of guilt. But yeah, he did it. No, but from a legal standpoint settling out of court is not an admission of guilt whereas taking a pardon is. Obviously his mentality is "I did it and I got away with it fuck you plebs" and he will show no contrition at all. But that's why it's doubly important to remind everyone that he has admitted guilt to the charges by accepting the pardon. Make that shit stick to him and make him answer for it at least if he's not going to face any repercussions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedRooster Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 Just now, Chest Rockwell said: No, but from a legal standpoint settling out of court is not an admission of guilt whereas taking a pardon is. Obviously his mentality is "I did it and I got away with it fuck you plebs" and he will show no contrition at all. But that's why it's doubly important to remind everyone that he has admitted guilt to the charges by accepting the pardon. Make that shit stick to him and make him answer for it at least if he's not going to face any repercussions. My understanding of this may be a little off - but isn't that why a pardon isn't necessarily the free pass it seems? Because it is indeed (in a legal sense) an acceptance of guilt, it makes it very easy to pursue a civil case/damages. Again, my understanding of the US legal system is sketchy, but given what Bannon had been charged with I would have to imagine someone could do that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members chokeout Posted January 20, 2021 Paid Members Share Posted January 20, 2021 By accepting the pardon, and basically admitting guilt could he legally be described as 'thief and fraudster, Steve Bannon' in the press when mentioning him? Just wondering how easy it will be to publically discredit him when he inevitably pops back up to help Trump. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Surf Digby Posted January 20, 2021 Paid Members Share Posted January 20, 2021 20 minutes ago, chokeout said: By accepting the pardon, and basically admitting guilt could he legally be described as 'the man who - by accepting the pardon - acknowledged that he was a thief and fraudster, Steve Bannon' in the press when mentioning him?  Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Carbomb Posted January 20, 2021 Paid Members Share Posted January 20, 2021 I love the idea that Trump could get wrecked by a Bannon call. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith Houchen Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 2 hours ago, Chest Rockwell said: No, but from a legal standpoint settling out of court is not an admission of guilt whereas taking a pardon is. Obviously his mentality is "I did it and I got away with it fuck you plebs" and he will show no contrition at all. But that's why it's doubly important to remind everyone that he has admitted guilt to the charges by accepting the pardon. Make that shit stick to him and make him answer for it at least if he's not going to face any repercussions. Does he have a say in receiving a pardon?  It’s not like an Alford plea where that’s your decision so you can be free. Bannon hasn’t been tried so this is just making it go away. There have been many presidential pardons that occurred in cases where justice groups have maintained wrongful convictions took place, They weren’t admitting guilt when pardoned.  But Bannon did it and you’re right. He’s laughing at us because he can do what he wants. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Chest Rockwell Posted January 20, 2021 Moderators Share Posted January 20, 2021 Yeah my understanding is that you can decline one, and one of the main reasons you might choose to do so is the implicit acceptance of guilt. I don't know the detail well at all but my understanding from what I've read is that from a legal standpoint it would be hard to get a conviction overturned if you've accepted a pardon. But it doesn't stop you still saying that it was a bullshit conviction and regardless of whether it's true or not you're gonna take what you can get, right? Dunno. Not sure how it works at all with these preemptive pardons! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members JNLister Posted January 20, 2021 Paid Members Share Posted January 20, 2021 The legal position on pre-emptive pardons (ones made before a conviction) is very unclear as they've never been tested. Before Trump, the only ones were Ford doing an "all crimes he may have committed" for Nixon, Carter saying "all the Vietnam draft dodgers are pardoned) and George Bush Sr pardoning two people in the Iran-Contra affair who'd been indicted (charged) but not yet tried. Nobody tried prosecuting them so there's never been a constitutional ruling on whether a pardon has effect if somebody hasn't yet been tried or the pardon doesn't specify an offence. So a lot of Trump's pardons won't be tested unless and until somebody gets prosecuted and uses "I have a pardon" as their defense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Dead Mike Posted January 20, 2021 Paid Members Share Posted January 20, 2021 53 minutes ago, Keith Houchen said:  But Bannon did it and you’re right. He’s laughing at us because he can do what he wants. Maddest thing is that he was guilty of conning Trump supporters & now they're celebrating him being pardoned?!? Definitely not a cult though Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wordsfromlee Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 I don’t know if I dreamt it, misheard, or just plain made it up in my head but is there any truth in if he gets impeached, his pardons can be over turned? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperBacon Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 @Chest Rockwell More importantly, he didnt pardon Steady B or Cool C, so fuck him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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