Paid Members Lion_of_the_Midlands Posted December 13, 2023 Paid Members Share Posted December 13, 2023 52 minutes ago, Big'Olympic_Hero'Pete said: Just imagine the email being sent out 'Congratulations you won the UK election lottery fund and are entitled to £X amount of money. Pleaze send to us your entry confirmation and proof of address and account details. Once it's all confirmed we will send the money to the bank account of your choice' Doesn't look like a scam at all..... Perhaps it is telling Grim Peter that your mind went immediately to the scam potential of the situation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Carbomb Posted December 13, 2023 Paid Members Share Posted December 13, 2023 One way we could make things fairer is by fully federalising the country, and not just along constituent nation lines. "State" governments with maximum possible devolution for Scotland, Wales, NI, Northern England, Southwest England, and Southeast England. Essentially make the UK government the umbrella for defence, general infrastructure, and international relations and trade. This way, enough large, democratically-significant bodies of people are less likely to end up with governments they didn't vote for doing things they didn't want them to do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith Houchen Posted December 16, 2023 Share Posted December 16, 2023 The text of the article in case it doesn’t embed. Spoiler Labour backs away from press reforms after Prince Harry’s phone-hacking court victory The party has made it clear that Keir Starmer had no intention of reviving the second stage of the Leveson inquiry Toby Helm and Vanessa Thorpe Sat 16 Dec 2023 19.20 GMT The Labour party has backed away from plans to impose new controls on the press in a move likely to spark fierce controversy inside the party after Prince Harry’s landmark victory in his phone-hacking caseagainst the Daily Mirror. Party sources made clear on Saturday that Keir Starmer was not intending to revive a second stage of the Leveson inquiry into press standards – abandoned by the Tories in 2018 – nor would Labour oppose current Conservative plans to weaken the press regulation regime in the media bill now going through parliament. On Thursday, Mr Justice Fancourt ruled that Mirror Group Newspapers had been guilty of “extensive” phone hacking and unlawful information gathering against Harry. The Duke of Sussex said it was a “great day for truth” and promised to continue his fight for justice. The ruling triggered fresh calls for a more robust system to protect people from unwanted intrusion, with Laboursupporters calling for clarity on Starmer’s stance and policy if his party came to power. Despite pressure on Saturday night from press reform campaigners and Labour activists, it appeared Starmer was, however, not prepared to risk angering big media companies, including the Mirror Group and Rupert Murdoch’s News UK, in the run-up to a general election. Starmer has made strenuous efforts over recent months to court rightwing media owners, including Murdoch, with whom he is known to be in regular contact. The fear in the Labour leader’s inner circle is likely to be that elements of the media would unleash a ferocious pre-election campaign against Starmer and his party, along the lines of that mounted against Neil Kinnock in 1992, if he indicated he would curb their activities once in office. Labour, under previous leaders, was in favour of reviving the Leveson process. In May 2018, the then party leader Ed Miliband told Tory ministers that their decision to axe the inquiry’s second stage was “contemptible”, and that it was a “matter of honour about the promises we made” to the victims of phone hacking. On Saturday night, Labour officials pointed out, however, that there was no reference to reviving the inquiry in the latest reports of the party’s national policy forum, suggesting all plans had been ditched. Earlier this year it was suggested that Labour wanted to retain a law that would have pressured media companies into signing up to statutory regulation, or face large legal costs in any case in which they became involved. But earlier this month, the shadow minister for digital, culture, media and sport, Stephanie Peacock, signalled in the House of Commons that Labour would no longer oppose the Tory plan to repeal the relevant law.Peacock told MPs that most press outlets had by now introduced some form of regulation, “whether individually or through the Independent Press Standards Organisation”, which, she added, “was not anticipated when the law was drafted”. She made it clear that Labour would not seek to oppose the Tory move and therefore suggested her party was not more on the side of regulation than the Conservative government. On Saturday night, the comedian and actor Steve Coogan, himself a victim of press intrusion, suggested it was time for Labour to step up: “We must give up on the Tories, who are wholly owned by the Rothermeres, Barclays and Murdochs, but it is clearly unsustainable, if the rule of law counts for anything in this country, that a new prime minister, who is rightly proud of being a former chief prosecutor, fails to reinstate the second half of the Leveson inquiry so it can correct the false evidence it was given in the first part. Keir Starmer, are you listening?” skip past newsletter promotion Sign up to First Edition Free daily newsletter Our morning email breaks down the key stories of the day, telling you what’s happening and why it matters Privacy Notice: Newsletters may contain info about charities, online ads, and content funded by outside parties. For more information see our Privacy Policy. We use Google reCaptcha to protect our website and the Google Privacy Policy and Terms of Service apply. after newsletter promotion Alastair Campbell, former press chief to Tony Blair, also called for Labour to make press standards a central issue in its election campaign. He said: “The whole body politic has been badly damaged in recent years and I hope Labour put the restoration of political and media standards at the heart of both their campaign and government if they win. “The worst elements of the press have contributed to the damage done and contrary to their claims the culture has not fundamentally changed since Leveson. “Without section 40, there is no protection for the public from intrusion and inaccuracy. As well as being an incentive to join a recognised regulator, section 40 acted as a guarantor of access to justice. The claim it threatens freedom of the press is just another press lie. “The Tories have a majority and so can repeal section 40 but it has to be replaced by something and that should be guided by principles of accuracy, fairness, and proper incentive to be part of a post-Leveson regulator. “The Tories will never do it because they have never been serious about reform. Labour should do it because it is the right thing to do and they will find widespread support for a campaign aimed at repairing the enormous damage done to our political and media culture.” Hello to you, dear reader! When the former Albanian dictator Enver Hoxha delivered his New Year message back in 1967, he pulled the cord marked “truth bomb”. “This year will be harder than last year,” he declared. “It will, however, be easier than next year.” I mean … on the one hand: thanks for not sugar-coating it, Enver. On the other: way to kill the party buzz, you monster! I don’t want to murder the atmosphere (or indeed any dissidents) by reminding you of the news year you’ve just lived through – or by warning you of the news year you’re about to live through. It’s not big, it’s not clever, and it’s sure as heck not seasonal. But I will say, pointedly, that our reporting feels particularly necessary in dark times. If you can, please help support the Guardian on a monthly basis from just £2, so as to keep it open for everyone. I can’t tell you how much it would be appreciated. A free press is needed now as much as it has ever been – and on some days, more than it has ever been. In return for this support, I am formally* bestowing upon you the right to refer to yourself – in conversation, in the pub, and on any business cards you may care to have printed up – as “a newspaper baron”. Face it: if you pay to support a news organisation, then you ARE to all intents and purposes a newspaper baron. Just enjoy it! All the others do. With that, it simply remains is for me to wish you a very happy holidays, and a splendid new year. Goodness knows you’ve earned it. Marina Hyde *not formally Contribution frequency One-time Monthly Annual Contribution amount £3 per month £5 per month Other Support with Support with Remind me in January Explore more on these topics Press regulation The Observer Labour Leveson inquiry Newspapers & magazines Keir Starmer Conservatives Steve Coogan news Reuse this content Most viewed UK UK politics Education Media Society Law Scotland Wales Northern Ireland News Opinion Sport Culture Lifestyle Original reporting and incisive analysis, direct from the Guardian every morning Sign up for our email About us Help Complaints & corrections SecureDrop Work for us Privacy policy Cookie policy Terms & conditions Contact us All topics All writers Modern Slavery Act Digital newspaper archive Facebook YouTube Instagram LinkedIn Twitter Newsletters Advertise with us Guardian Labs Search jobs Patrons Back to top © 2023 Guardian News & Media Limited or its affiliated companies. All rights reserved. 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Loki Posted December 17, 2023 Share Posted December 17, 2023 Very disappointing as Leveson 2 has long been a bugbear of mine. It’s a calculated move, I’m guessing he doesn’t want to antagonise the press barons he needs to soft shoe him during the election. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
d-d-d-dAz Posted December 17, 2023 Share Posted December 17, 2023 (edited) 6 minutes ago, Loki said: Very disappointing as Leveson 2 has long been a bugbear of mine. It’s a calculated move, I’m guessing he doesn’t want to antagonise the press barons he needs to soft shoe him during the election. Friday’s News Agents podcast was pretty good, on this. The issue seems to be that the people animated by this issue want to see prison sentences handed out and for this to be pursued through the criminal courts. They see the courts ruling last week as being the first step towards that, despite a lot of the experts saying the level of proof needed for criminal convictions doesn’t actually exist. So, Leveson 2.0 probably ends with a recommendation for independent regulation of the media; something neither government wants to spend political capital on as it’ll lose them the press, plus it’ll be controversial through parliament as, yes the media will lobby their mates, but there are genuine concerns about how free the press should be given a ‘free press’ is a pillar of democracy. But, also, it probably doesn’t pacify the people animated by this who’ll still be looking for those criminal prosecutions. I imagine this is another issue both sides just want to fuck off. Edited December 17, 2023 by d-d-d-dAz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Posted December 21, 2023 Author Share Posted December 21, 2023 On 12/13/2023 at 7:29 AM, BigJag said: I recently had a conversation with a friend on his refusal to vote. I'm the same. I can't remember the last time I actually took the trouble to vote. It was a long time ago. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Boycie Posted December 21, 2023 Paid Members Share Posted December 21, 2023 24 minutes ago, David said: I'm the same. I can't remember the last time I actually took the trouble to vote. It was a long time ago. I think a lot of people feel that way at the moment. A friend of mine has quite proudly never voted in his life. When I asked him why, his response was "it won't make any difference to my life". It wouldn't surprise me to see a very low turnout at the next election, probably the lowest in years. Also, I don't think we'll see the landslide Labour victory that many are predicting. I still think they will win though it will be a close call in the end. A lot can happen between now and then. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Posted December 21, 2023 Author Share Posted December 21, 2023 Just now, Boycie said: I think a lot of people feel that way at the moment. A friend of mine has quite proudly never voted in his life. When I asked him why, his response was "it won't make any difference to my life". I mean, it's not something I'd claim to be proud of. It's just something I have no real desire to do. I certainly have no issue with those who choose to get involved in the whole process and don't have an attitude of "you're wasting your time" or anything like that if you choose to vote. To each their own and all that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members BigJag Posted December 21, 2023 Paid Members Share Posted December 21, 2023 Except that the decisions made do effect everyone's life. Ignoring and abstaining from the process is folly. If there's one thing that the democratic process absolutely needs. It is for the electorate to be a part of the process. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Posted December 21, 2023 Author Share Posted December 21, 2023 2 minutes ago, BigJag said: Except that the decisions made do effect everyone's life. Ignoring and abstaining from the process is folly. If there's one thing that the democratic process absolutely needs. It is for the electorate to be a part of the process. The truth is, apart from reading the odd thing on here now and then, I have found myself more and more not following anything that's going on politically. I don't really read newspapers, I don't have access to terrestrial television with news channels and don't really discuss politics with friends or family. I don't even spend most of my time in the UK now. Outside of work, which I do remotely, I spend my time on stuff I enjoy. Which no longer includes politics. I was really into it all at one point, and was what I'd like to think of as fairly clued up, but not anymore. I wouldn't know who to vote for. It would be an entirely uninformed decision. I don't even think I'm registered to vote now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith Houchen Posted December 21, 2023 Share Posted December 21, 2023 14 minutes ago, BigJag said: Except that the decisions made do effect everyone's life. Ignoring and abstaining from the process is folly. If there's one thing that the democratic process absolutely needs. It is for the electorate to be a part of the process. It isn’t folly, it’s not endorsing a political and voting system that is broken. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperBacon Posted December 21, 2023 Share Posted December 21, 2023 19 minutes ago, David said: The truth is, apart from reading the odd thing on here now and then, I have found myself more and more not following anything that's going on politicall This is mental David. You're going to end up being swayed and voting for a party that endorses sitting on the bog backwards and buying kebabs from "chippys" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Posted December 21, 2023 Author Share Posted December 21, 2023 5 minutes ago, Keith Houchen said: It isn’t folly, it’s not endorsing a political and voting system that is broken. It's the illusion of choice, isn't it? Again, I'm not anti-voting or anything like that. I don't even tell people I know "in real life" that I don't vote unless they ask me about it, as it's not a "I'm better than you because I don't vote" thing. It may very well be an age thing. Or it's where politics is nowadays, I dunno. I just grew weary of it all. It's the same old shit. The only thing that changes is the smug faces beaming out at you from the same old suits and haircuts as always. What I can say is that in the time I actively stopped reading about and watching political news and discourse, I have found myself getting less wound up, less angry, and less anxious. And here's the kicker. Whenever I do peek my head in for a quick look to see what's happening? Fuck all has changed. Me not being involved or not voting hasn't made any difference at all. And it hasn't changed my life either. So, for those who are actively involved and engaged? Awesome. But honestly, if the whole thing is stressing you out and causing your quality of life to deteriorate? Try stepping away entirely for three or six months. See how you feel and what difference it makes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Posted December 21, 2023 Author Share Posted December 21, 2023 2 minutes ago, SuperBacon said: This is mental David. You're going to end up being swayed and voting for a party that endorses sitting on the bog backwards and buying kebabs from "chippys" Now, if we had a UKFF party, I might be tempted back into the fold. Reclaim our chippy teas and our Union Jack! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith Houchen Posted December 21, 2023 Share Posted December 21, 2023 6 minutes ago, David said: It may very well be an age thing. Or it's where politics is nowadays, I dunno. I just grew weary of it all. It's the same old shit. The only thing that changes is the smug faces beaming out at you from the same old suits and haircuts as always. Whenever I hear this, and I do agree, I’m reminded of something Owen Jones said at an event when his Chavs book came out. He said that a lot of people’s first engagement in politics was joining their union when they got an apprenticeship or first job. And the more you disenfranchise the young working class, the easier it is to maintain any status quo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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