The Smackers Thread

[Supremo]

I want Sami to take his head clean off, raise the gold, big hug from Kevin Owens, confetti and fireworks everywhere.

The way Roman scared Sami by shouting at him? Horrible, gaslighting, bullying bastard. He's got a Helluva kick coming for his jaw.

Triple H isn't stupid. He has to know this is the best thing he's got. He has to know the only end game that'll satisfy. A shitty tag match? No thanks.

But yeah. Ospreay and Omega delivering one of the greatest matches of all time? Sami Zayn is still the wrestler of the year right now. He's the best.

Pray for Kevin Owens though. A one on one with Roman? If last week's tag is anything to go by it's going to be like Mass Transit out there.

Edited January 7, 2023 by Supremo

[RedRooster]

59 minutes ago, SuperBacon said:

But he shouldn't beat Reigns for the title. That's very silly. Sorry.

I don't think he needs to either. The story is in the heartbreak and the nearly. For me anyway.

I couldn’t disagree more - what other options are there, realistically, that make sense from a narrative perspective? 

Cody Rhodes or The Rock come to mind, but even if you buy into Cody’s story of wanting to hold the title his dad never held, you’re still being asked to cheer for a  obviously rich, privileged and handsome babyface. It doesn’t necessarily mean he’ll get booed, but the emotional highs for Cody can’t possibly rival what you’d get from watching underdog Sami Zayn succeed.

Same goes for The Rock, and there’s limited value in having him defeat Roman anyway. 

In this shitty time of multiple crises - economy, climate, war and pandemic-related - there’s no better distraction than watching the underdog succeed at this level. Even the idea of Wrestlemania closing with Zayn tearfully holding the titles above his head gives me goosebumps. I can only imagine how great the reality would be.

[Fatty Facesitter]

1 hour ago, SuperBacon said:

All shoot me down, but I'll say it again, I desperately want to see Sami vs Roman, but he shouldn't be beating him for the title.

EC in Montreal would be absolutely perfect for them to have a match, and let Sami have several VERY near falls, and just about get beaten to compound everyone's heartache. Although this feels quite soon-ish I'd agree. What's this, 6 weeks away?

But he shouldn't beat Reigns for the title. That's very silly. Sorry.

I don't think he needs to either. The story is in the heartbreak and the nearly. For me anyway. 

You’re a good sort Super Bacon. A fine fellow and I respect your opinion. Let’s shake hands like gentlemen and agree to disagree. 

…Bollocks. You’re wrong. Dead wrong. How very dare you. Certainly not very Ucey. Super Bacon? More like…Rubbish Salad. That’s what you are. That’s right. I said it. If you want some, I’ll give it yer.

Heartbreak and the nearly can work, but this is months of incredible storytelling. What’s more, he’s bloody earned it. He wrestles virtually every week, he’s basically their leader every time Roman isn’t around, he’s consistently the most entertaining presence every week. Even if an eventual title run is short lived, he bloody deserves it. He deserves at least one of those two shiny belts anyway. 

For some reason I’d totally discounted the two nights of Wrestlemania. Give me Roman vs Rock AND Roman vs Sami. Let me be greedy. 

[uklaw]

3 hours ago, SuperBacon said:

All shoot me down, but I'll say it again, I desperately want to see Sami vs Roman, but he shouldn't be beating him for the title.

EC in Montreal would be absolutely perfect for them to have a match, and let Sami have several VERY near falls, and just about get beaten to compound everyone's heartache. Although this feels quite soon-ish I'd agree. What's this, 6 weeks away?

But he shouldn't beat Reigns for the title. That's very silly. Sorry.

I don't think he needs to either. The story is in the heartbreak and the nearly. For me anyway. 

I won’t shoot you down. I agree with you.

For one thing, Sami Zayn and the Undisputed WWE Universal Title hasn’t even been mooted on-screen. The story has been about a number of things (seemingly conceived by Vince as a delusional blag for a bit of light relief, turned by Triple H into a tale of seeking acceptance, manipulation, turning against his very best friend when he actually needs him the most, and so on). But what hasn’t been factored or mentioned up to now is a desire for Sami to have the title. Of all the things Jey Uso objected to and all the things Roman blasted Sami for when his mask slips, the title hasn’t come up.

His crumbled relationship with Kevin Owens has been a consistent thread, so it makes most sense Owens picks him up when The Bloodline discard him and they dent the Bloodline.

With the WM30 situation, Bryan had history with the title and some sort of built-in fan engagement and the fans could see the company shoving him out of the way in a ham-fisted way. The sense of justice in seeing that ‘wrong’ righted was understandable. 

The Sami situation doesn’t fit that specific scenario. I know the fans are engaged and wedded to Sami and his journey so I’m not discounting that.

Also with Sami Zayn, yes, the payoff could be emotional, could be a Wrestlemania moment.

But then what?… 

‘Kofimania’ was the result of similar fan desire and pressure that also benefited from a generous champion, Vince’s erratic booking and the fact the title being contested was comfortably the secondary title. I don’t know about anyone else, but the only things I remember about that title reign were the moment Kofi won and when Lesnar beat him for the title in seconds.

Injury prevented us from getting enough of Bryan’s title reign to know exactly how business would have thrived or dropped with him as the on-screen company figurehead. 

So to this day, the idea of positioning someone unplanned as the FOTC remains largely untested and in a year that the company seem to want to bat its eyelids at potential suitors, I can see them wanting to have their biggest, most marketable names front and centre. It’s probably not fair to the most ardent watchers and fans, but that could be a factor.

I can see Sami facing Roman one on one, maybe even with the title on the line, between the ‘big lockout angle’ and Wrestlemania, but I don’t see Sami beating him, even suspending my disbelief.

I don’t usually put my head above the parapet here, but I’m seeing that either a massive story pivot will take place that will not ultimately benefit the company post-Wrestlemania with the fan-appointed hero of the piece being blamed, punished and sideline. Or we are on course for another 2014-style crap show where fans derail the product. Entitlement related to wrestling is not the reserve of those in it.

Yes, this isn’t ‘Ucey’ and I know I’ll be accused of not getting into the spirit of things- in fact, I’m expecting a Forum-style beatdown 🤣 but even after the biggest and greatest party, there is clean up…

Edited January 7, 2023 by uklaw

[Nick James]

Sami wins the title after a tremendous story arc with Roman, Solo destroys Sami for the title leading into Solo vs Reigns. That could be the next year to 18 months of storyline right there. 

[DavidB6937]

Some people just don't deserve Sami as champion.

[Slapnut]

I didn’t realise we had so many WWE shareholders on here. It’s the only explanation I can think of why some people would prefer a “good business” decision over something they would actually enjoy more.

I couldn’t give a fuck if Sami winning the big one ends up being a bad business decision. The emotion in that 30 minutes or so is far more important to me than how much Vince will sell the company for in a few months.

[Supremo]

The people who don’t want Sami winning the belt at Wrestlemania are the same people who did the “Yes,” chant when Big Show adopted it.

Edited January 8, 2023 by Supremo

[SuperBacon]

7 minutes ago, Slapnut said:

I didn’t realise we had so many WWE shareholders on here. It’s the only explanation I can think of why some people would prefer a “good business” decision over something they would actually enjoy more.

I couldn’t give a fuck if Sami winning the big one ends up being a bad business decision. The emotion in that 30 minutes or so is far more important to me than how much Vince will sell the company for in a few months.

For me it's got nothing to do with business decisions, I really couldn't give a shit about that.

I would love it if Sami won it, of course I would, he's always been a favourite of mine. It would be wicked.

I just dont think that he should, that's all. I watch WWE about 10 times a year, so maybe I'm not as invested in it as much as others.

5 minutes ago, Supremo said:

The only people who don’t want Sami winning the belt at Wrestlemania are the same people who did the “Yes,” chant when Big Show adopted it.

You bastard. I'd forgotten all about that.

[Fatty Facesitter]

I jest but full marks to @SuperBacon and @uklaw - Both have made perfectly valid and reasoned arguments for the case against, and they've done so without throwing their toys of out of the pram. Proof it's possible to have reasoned debate without needless pettiness. 

2 hours ago, uklaw said:

I don’t usually put my head above the parapet here, but I’m seeing that either a massive story pivot will take place that will not ultimately benefit the company post-Wrestlemania with the fan-appointed hero of the piece being blamed, punished and sideline. Or we are on course for another 2014-style crap show where fans derail the product. Entitlement related to wrestling is not the reserve of those in it.

This is the only point I don't think is entirely fair with regards to the 2014 product and fans derailing it. Bryan's organic growth amongst the fanbase was largely down to his own hard work and great performances. Connections forged like that between performers and fans which are so ferocious are absolute magic. Bryan not being in the Rumble match was a mistake - it was also a mistake to assume that a Batista return, Rumble victory and a programme with Orton would be enough to satisfy the fans heading into Wrestlemania. To call fans entitled for forging such a wonderful connection with Bryan is a tad harsh I think. Injuries and other factors perhaps made his eventual reign less successful than it could have otherwise been, but that run to Wrestlemania and the night itself were incredible. 

As for what Sami would do post-Wrestlemania - this is where I think a Bloodline split would make for a good 'second act' if you will. There's a number of different avenues they could explore from here before eventually splitting them all off individually, or reuniting them gradually and reverting everyone back to heels. Impossible to convey the mountain of possibilities into one post, but some options to chew on. 

The 'then what?' notion is perfectly valid. But Wrestlemania itself is supposed to be the crescendo for everything that's gone on before. Let it all blow up in a spectacular finale. If you can't give the lad both straps, at least give him one of them. He's totally earned it. 

The title/titles themselves may not have been mentioned explicitly as yet, but from the Rumble onwards as the picture becomes clearer, there's no reason this element can't be ramped up. 

LET HIM WIN. 

 

[DavidB6937]

The "then what?" is a problem with pretty much any and all end scenarios when it comes to the titles anyway. And not just in WWE but as we've seen with Hangman in AEW too. Even when you've got the perfect story and perfect ending there's no guarantee what comes after is any good.

And that can happen whether they go with Sami as champ or Cody fulfilling whatever dream he has or simply the notion of ANYONE ending Roman's run as champ. It's a huge fucking "then what?" whatever option you choose really.

And yet I think out of all of them giving Sami the win actually opens up the most possibilities rather than being the one that traps them in a corner or a short meaningless run. Sure, on the surface it could be seen as a Kofi type deal, but it's the one that makes the most sense in their long running storyline. It adds another layer and allows them to continue the Bloodline stuff in some way.

If all of this hadn't been arguably the best ongoing storyline in wrestling then of course I'd think Sami winning would be completely out of left field and unnecessary. But I'd much rather they kept delivering top notch moments here than stick to "the plan" if its Cody. He has time. Sami has now. Sami IS now. There will never be a better time for Sami Zayn. He's had the best year of his career and this is the one moment he's close enough to be accepted by the WWE fans as being that man on top. Even just for a short time. Why waste that?

[poetofthedeed]

Sami vs Roman,

KO neutralizes Solo Sikoa 

The Usos make their way to the ring, Jimmy's not happy but he knows what has to be done when suddenly Jey, remembering what Roman did to him at the start of his run, puts an arm out to stop him, looks at Roman and they walk off.

 

Just give me that moment and whether Sami wins or loses I'll be a puddle on the floor.

 

[Guest]

Watched the clips from this weeks show and Sami is so scrawny he makes starcade 97 Sting look like 89 hogan. If he wants to be believable against Roman who’s been champion this long, he should be at least trying to make his look a bit better. The hardcore may want a Sami title win, but he’s a peg warmer as a figure for a reason, he’s not popular and his role Now is more a Santino “give a moment of hope” than being a mania headliner. I don’t hide my dislike for Danielson, but he was on another level with his previous title runs and getting yes/ No/ yes over when the lead up to 30 began than where Sami is. They aren’t the same at all. 

[RedRooster]

6 minutes ago, Louch said:

Watched the clips from this weeks show and Sami is so scrawny he makes starcade 97 Sting look like 89 hogan. If he wants to be believable against Roman who’s been champion this long, he should be at least trying to make his look a bit better.

You're the first person I've heard say this, which suggests to me it doesn't matter. The way Sami looks is part of his appeal, and I don't think there's anything wrong with it. 

7 minutes ago, Louch said:

The hardcore may want a Sami title win, but he’s a peg warmer as a figure for a reason, he’s not popular and his role Now is more a Santino “give a moment of hope” than being a mania headliner.

Prove it. Who exactly are "the hardcore" here? Sami is consistently getting some of the best - if not the best - reactions on the show. It's simply untrue to say he's "not popular". There are legitimate arguments to make against Sami winning the title, but his popularity is not one of them. 

10 minutes ago, Louch said:

I don’t hide my dislike for Danielson, but he was on another level with his previous title runs and getting yes/ No/ yes over when the lead up to 30 began than where Sami is. They aren’t the same at all. 

There are definite similarities. People are organically getting behind Sami - a heel - much as they did heel Danielson during his heel World Heavyweight title run, and run in Team Hell No. There is a fantastic story to tell through Sami overcoming the odds and defeating arguably the best heel WWE has had in years. For Danielson, his story was about overcoming The Authority to lift the belt. There's also a clear danger that the investment fans have in Sami will see them turn on whoever is chosen ahead of him for the Wrestlemania title match. If Sami faces Roman at Elimination Chamber and pushes him close but loses, I think it's very likely fans will be clamouring to see the rematch sooner rather than later - much like "Kofimania".

[DavidB6937]

20 minutes ago, Louch said:

Watched the clips from this weeks show and Sami is so scrawny he makes starcade 97 Sting look like 89 hogan. If he wants to be believable against Roman who’s been champion this long, he should be at least trying to make his look a bit better. 

Absolutely not. It has nothing to do with his look whatsoever. He's been pushed as a guy who manipulates and outwits so often that him beating Roman is far more about beating him on a psychological level and taking him completely off his game than anything else. You're completely missing the point if you think Sami needs to bulk up to beat Roman. He's been on the inside. He's seen how Roman operates in and out of the ring. He's under Roman's skin already.

20 minutes ago, Louch said:

The hardcore may want a Sami title win, but he’s a peg warmer as a figure for a reason, he’s not popular and his role Now is more a Santino “give a moment of hope” than being a mania headliner.

And we're comparing what? His old figures and his heel run and underwhelming earlier babyface runs to where he's at now? He is popular.

20 minutes ago, Louch said:

 I don’t hide my dislike for Danielson, but he was on another level with his previous title runs and getting yes/ No/ yes over when the lead up to 30 began than where Sami is. They aren’t the same at all. 

Of course they're not the same but this is absolutely Sami's best work and the most the fans have ever been engaged with him. So why not make the most of that? Follow through on this and it could propel the guy to a place he's never been before.

.. or you know, what the guy who types quicker said above.

Edited January 8, 2023 by DavidB6937