hallicks Posted September 21, 2019 Share Posted September 21, 2019 32 minutes ago, MPDTT said: This news on Jon Lansman and his move to oust Tom Watson, one of the few remaining moderate voices in the Labour front bench makes my blood boil. Momentum are such a disgusting movement that have ruined the Labour party. If we could go back in time ame stop Ed Miliband standing against his brother, this country would be in a radically different position today. Labour wouldn't be the joke it is today, he would have defeated David Cameron in 2015 and brexit would never have happened. Credit where it's due, you're a very smart troll, because nobody is this stupid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CavemanLynn Posted September 21, 2019 Share Posted September 21, 2019 You can't throw money at Parliament to solve its systemic failings. Politics should be management of the country but it's the management of its people. Like you said, politicians can't solve problems. At best, they should be gathering the right people, the right minds, to examine and attempt to deal with these problems, allocating the people's tax money accordingly. I genuinely believe a better governmental system would be a massive reduction in seats but with the addition of a compulsory selection by every taxpayer at the start of every tax year of what percentage of their income tax goes to which service. I know that requires a devolution of sorts, of government into separate services managed by a cabinet and treasury, but it would at least in theory remove a great chunk of the current bloated admin (and associated overheads) in favour of putting control in voters' hands by feeding services directly rather than via essential one big government pot. The current climate of personality politics has pushed actual performance to the side, so you can incentivise via increased as much as you like, but unless you deal with the way people make it to those positions, you're just chucking more money into the same trough. Health, housing, education, infrastructure, agriculture. All these things need an altruistic intent that I just don't think exists in our current system. One thing Brexit has shown up is how dependent the UK has become on outsourcing essential services, underfunding our own (and yes, getting the most for your money is sound business sense). One more issue is that personality politics requires candidates to draw the most voters to themselves through relatability. As much as we are all apparently aware that many MPs are of a certain class and privilege, a common trait used to gain support is the "oh he's just like us" factor. For every voter who would opt for a candidate with intellectual and academic or industry acumen, eminently better qualified to manage a sector of the country, there'll be a dozen more who won't on the grounds that "he don't know what it's like to be us". From having met a number of successful business and industry leaders (as well as the usual online talks available), they will want to focus on the macro or systemic issues, whereas your everyman will want the local problems he can see corrected. An example is combating crime by raising penalties rather than looking at the causes, like poverty and poor education. Adding a deterrent or increasing punishments might be seen to be trying to correct the current problem now, but it does nothing for preventative. It's a different approach that I think requires a complete change in mindset in both the electorate and government that I don't think is possible right now. Intelligent, accomplished, selfless, charismatic. I love that. PM = dreamboat. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MPDTT Posted September 21, 2019 Share Posted September 21, 2019 5 minutes ago, hallicks said: Credit where it's due, you're a very smart troll, because nobody is this stupid. Not a troll, stand by this. Thank you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hallicks Posted September 21, 2019 Share Posted September 21, 2019 11 minutes ago, MPDTT said: Not a troll, stand by this. Thank you. Watson was legit mates with a paedo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MPDTT Posted September 21, 2019 Share Posted September 21, 2019 20 minutes ago, jazzygeofferz said: Whichever Milliband was leading the Tories would have had an uphill struggle against the Tory backing media onslaught, especially with the prospect of being able to avoid the EU tax transparency laws as presented by the referendum. Maybe the Tories would have had a smaller majority, or someone would have had to make some deals to get into power, but I don't think we'd have ended up with an actual Labour government. Possibly, but as I recall all the damage Eds rise to prominence did, I still think David Milliband would have been an entirely different proposition. Stabbing his brother in the back, the fact the PLP voted for Dave and unions put his brother over the top, the Red Ed campaigns, the stone tablet...... I think a David Miliband led Labour party would have seen a rebirth of the rebirth of the New Labout movement which was so popular for so long with the public. At the time, I don't think the New Labour ethos was toxic, but Blair / Brown were. David Miliband would have been a far more formidable opponent for David Cameron. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MPDTT Posted September 21, 2019 Share Posted September 21, 2019 Come on......that's a stretch. Did he fall for Carl Beach's lies? Yes he did. So did the Metropolitan Police! So did the media! Do you believe Tom Watson believed he was a fraudster, criminal and paedophile when he threw his support behind the case? I certainly don't. Was he wrong not to let the criminal justice system run its course before speaking out? Yes he was. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Devon Malcolm Posted September 21, 2019 Author Paid Members Share Posted September 21, 2019 Stop double posting and posting utter irrelevance in what is supposed to be a Brexit thread. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hallicks Posted September 21, 2019 Share Posted September 21, 2019 17 minutes ago, MPDTT said: Come on......that's a stretch. Did he fall for Carl Beach's lies? Yes he did. So did the Metropolitan Police! So did the media! Do you believe Tom Watson believed he was a fraudster, criminal and paedophile when he threw his support behind the case? I certainly don't. Was he wrong not to let the criminal justice system run its course before speaking out? Yes he was. That's not the point. He should be out on his arse for that alone, never mind that he's been a constant wrecking cunt for the last 3 years. But that's why you like him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith Houchen Posted September 21, 2019 Share Posted September 21, 2019 Yeah, fuck Tom Watson. Tried to torpedo (torPAEDO more like, amirite) his partys brexit policy the day they announced it. Corbyn has tried to placate the cunt for years by having him as his deputy and unite the party. Johnson boots 21 including two ex chancellors out of the party and it's strong leadership. Labour want shot of someone who has tripped up the party leader time and again and it's a Stalinist coup. Yeah, go fuck yourselves you tory pricks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Chest Rockwell Posted September 21, 2019 Moderators Share Posted September 21, 2019 3 hours ago, MPDTT said: I'm a firm believer that if we want to attract the brightest and best minds into politics, to run the country, we need to pay salaries equivalent to leadership roles in corporates in the private sector. I have some bad news for you about the intelligence and competence of people in leadership roles in the corporate world... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperBacon Posted September 21, 2019 Share Posted September 21, 2019 Old Keithy’s slipping in his old age for not picking up on the Garthing going on in AEW boys last post. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith Houchen Posted September 21, 2019 Share Posted September 21, 2019 Does Kool Keith want to attract the brightest and best minds? He does, as long as they are from the UK. Does he think that the brightest and best should remain where they are and help their own economy? He does. Is that racist? HOW DARE YOU!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vamp Posted September 21, 2019 Share Posted September 21, 2019 I worked for somebody who used to brag about their financial prowess because they stopped giving employees pens and made then bring their own in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Posted September 21, 2019 Share Posted September 21, 2019 47 minutes ago, Vamp said: I worked for somebody who used to brag about their financial prowess because they stopped giving employees pens and made then bring their own in. Apply that policy to stamps and other miscellaneous stationary and you'll have something I can very much get behind. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith Houchen Posted September 21, 2019 Share Posted September 21, 2019 48 minutes ago, Vamp said: I worked for somebody who used to brag about their financial prowess because they stopped giving employees pens and made then bring their own in. I bet they're a huge AEW fan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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