UFC 187: Cormier vs Rumble

[chokeout]

How Chuck was never caught doing anything dodgy when he was the poster boy for UFC i'll never know. Tito at his peak knew what he was doing and made headlines for the right reasons (for himself) but apart from his endless cycle of 'This fight you'll see the best Tito/ Lose / I was fighting with 'insert injury' excuse he never seemed to get himself in much trouble.

[WyattSheepMask]

 

Last thing I expected to see on the main page of BBC Sport

[Supremo]

Of course, that's always a possibility too. It was also discussed that Jon has essentially spent his entire UFC career getting away with whatever the fuck he wanted, never really facing particularly harsh consequences for his actions, so it's just as likely that he figured he could run away and not have to face the music.

 

Between Anderson and Jon there's definitely a sense that MMA is starting to feel like pro-wrestling, in that it's becoming a rarity for guys to retire with their legacies in tact.

[wandshogun09]

Between Anderson and Jon there's definitely a sense that MMA is starting to feel like pro-wrestling, in that it's becoming a rarity for guys to retire with their legacies in tact.

Yeah. Add Chael Sonnen and Wanderlei Silva as well, both went out with their legacy in tatters. Cung Le as well. These are obviously lesser names than Anderson and Jones but it's still adding to the feeling that getting out of MMA with your reputation and legacy in one piece is hard as fuck to do.

 

I'm happy with Cormier vs Rumble. It's not quite Jones vs Rumble but it's the next best thing.

 

I've got a feeling Cormier wins this, for some reason. It's a weird triangle between Jones, Cormier and Rumble. I think Jones beats Cormier every time, I think DC beats Rumble and I don't know what the fuck happens in a Jones vs Rumble fight.

[Egg Shen]

knowing that DC will be coming in at close to top shape i'm favouring him too. I think there's going to be a lot of people writing DC off after the Jones loss. Any word on odds?

[Carbomb]

I'm probably in the minority here, but I honestly don't think Jones will beat Cormier every time, for two specific reasons:

 

1. Until Cormier uncharacteristically seemed to "break" halfway through their match, he seemed to have a gameplan that, whilst not foolproof, was achieving visible results against Jones. I don't know what it was, but I don't think Cormier will be making the same mistake in training for a re-match that led to this problem.

 

2. More importantly, until Jones, Cormier was undefeated, which means we don't know for certain how exactly the L is going to affect him. He may very well be one of those fighters who comes back several times better than before, he might have completely folded. Until we see how he does against Johnson, there's very little way to tell how he would fare against Jones in a rematch.

[David]

The thing is, the kind of stuff that Jones has done (drugs, DUI, hit & run etc) isn't really that surprising when you look at other well paid US sports athletes. There are guys who played NFL football that have been convicted of murder, robbery, rape and all sorts.

 

As I said, i'm actually surprised that it took so long for one of MMA's big stars to get caught up in this kind of thing.

[jimufctna24]

I want Cormier to win, but I am picking Rumble.

 

If the fight goes Rumble's way, I see two routes to victory. Firstly, he could come out aggressive, overwhelm D.C, and finish him early. Similar to how he beat Gusty. That scenario is possible, but I don't see it happening. It's unlikely that D.C approaches the fight in a way that enables Rumble to score a blowout. 

 

What I do see happening is Rumble being too powerful, and controlling the fight from the clinch, and smothering D.C up against the cage. In the process, racking up the rounds. Rumble would need to be measured, but I suspect he can be. D,C is a great wrestler, but I just feel the likes of Jones and Rumble can neutralise him at 205lbs. Remember how Phil Davis had nothing for Rumble?

 

If the fight is fought in open air, and away from the clinch, D.C still has a chance. D.C had some success against Jones in the earlier rounds, as he got inside and landed some decent shots. If he can do the same to Rumble, things could get interesting. Also, I still wonder about Rumble's gas tank over 5 rounds. I would say D.C is the slightly more proven over a long distance.

 

However, I think Rumble will simply be too strong. Rumble by UD.

[David]

I don't want Cormier to win, simply because I have no real interest in seeing another Jones/Cormier fight so soon after the last one. I want Rumble/Jones!

[jimufctna24]

I don't want Cormier to win, simply because I have no real interest in seeing another Jones/Cormier fight so soon after the last one. I want Rumble/Jones!

I agree. I would rather see Jones vs Rumble. I just find it impossible to root against D.C.

 

However, how does Cormier vs Gusty grab you? I think it is possible that Jones might be gone for a while. Provided Gusty beats Glover (which I strongly think he will), I think he has an excellent chance of being next in line for a shot. Ideally around October/November time. 

[Egg Shen]

The thing is, the kind of stuff that Jones has done (drugs, DUI, hit & run etc) isn't really that surprising when you look at other well paid US sports athletes. There are guys who played NFL football that have been convicted of murder, robbery, rape and all sorts.

 

As I said, i'm actually surprised that it took so long for one of MMA's big stars to get caught up in this kind of thing.

I think MMA fans liked to think MMA fighters were on a kind of pedestal that set them apart from the other sports. Last year or so has shit all over that theory.

[GlennCullen]

I love DC, but I kind of want Rumble to win. Cormier becoming champion after being soundly beaten by Jones would dilute it a bit, whilst Rumble offers up a range of possibilities.

[wandshogun09]

I can't even disagree with any of that. It's not like I'm massively confident Cormier wins. Rumble is so dangerous that one slip up against him and you're fucked.

 

But I think Cormier has the right skills to give Rumble some grief. While the Phil Davis fight showed Rumble has great defensive wrestling, that doesn't necessarily mean Cormier won't outwrestle him. Cormier is a better wrestler than Davis, both in pure wrestling and MMA wrestling IMO. Only Jones has had any answer at all for DC's wrestling. He's a better striker than Davis as well, which on its own doesn't help him much because I don't like his chances trading strikes with Rumble. But his striking is good enough that it compliments his wrestling. He can set up his shots with strikes or feints, disguise takedown attempts with strikes or switch between grappling and striking to throw Rumble off and/or tire him out. With Davis, all he had was wrestling and even with that he often seems to be kind of hesitant to fully commit to takedown attempts. He'd have also been more predictable than DC with his attempts because it's all he had in his toolbox.

 

All easier said than done of course. I just think it's important to remember that Cormier is a different and tougher opponent entirely than anyone Rumble's faced since returning to the UFC. He's better than Davis at everything. Nog is shopworn and had been on the shelf over a year. Gus is elite but his style plays to Rumble's strengths because he's more of a striker.

 

I actually think the Cormier vs Rumble and Weidman vs Belfort fights are very similar. Not in terms of outcomes or chances of one guy winning (I give Rumble a MUCH better shot than Vitor). But in that I think if Cormier/Weidman can get through that initial blitz, they'll take over and overwhelm Rumble/Belfort down the stretch. Again, easier said than done. And I think Rumble's initial storm will last longer than Belfort's, so it will be hard for DC. But I think if he fights smart, he can contain Rumble. Rumble's never gone past three rounds either. We don't know how he'll hold up. He may be fine but explosive guys like him historically fade more than the more strategic technical types.

 

I've got Cormier by decision. Wouldn't be at all shocked if Rumble clobbers him early, but DC on points for me.

[David]

 

The thing is, the kind of stuff that Jones has done (drugs, DUI, hit & run etc) isn't really that surprising when you look at other well paid US sports athletes. There are guys who played NFL football that have been convicted of murder, robbery, rape and all sorts.

 

As I said, i'm actually surprised that it took so long for one of MMA's big stars to get caught up in this kind of thing.

I think MMA fans liked to think MMA fighters were on a kind of pedestal that set them apart from the other sports. Last year or so has shit all over that theory.

 

 

Maybe in years gone by, but where you see fighters being paid a fortune by big sportswear companies and suchlike you'll find stupid behaviour and astounding arrogance.

[Supremo]

Khabib has a knee injury, potentially off the show.