FA Carling Premiership and Milk Cup thread 2024/25

[hallicks]

I’m naturally very pessimistic about Arsenal, and even more so about tonight. We’ve spluttered and stumbled so badly over the last few weeks, it’s hard to see a way past PSG. I feel the gameplan will be 90% defending the edge of the box and 10% failing miserably to counterattack because we don’t move the ball quickly enough, with the hope of maybe scoring from a set piece. I’m not feeling it. 

Although one chalk mark in the “Hope springs eternal” column is that we did beat PSG in a two-legged semi final the last time we won a European trophy, so… I’ll be clinging onto that for at least the first 2 minutes before we concede an early goal that effectively kills the tie. 

[garynysmon]

I can understand certain disappointment over a top player leaving for free, but some of the reaction to Trent Alexander-Arnold’s decision to leave Liverpool has been ridiculous.

I bet most of Liverpool’s top players left fans of their former clubs disappointed upon leaving. It happens, its shit, move on.

Or is this just more of that ‘We are Liverpool, this means more’ exceptionalism?

Christ, its not like he strung Liverpool along for months like Sol Campbell and signed for Everton or Man United. 

[CleetusVanDamme]

https://www.barcablaugranes.com/2025/5/7/24425135/every-50-50-decision-went-for-inter-hansi-flick-speaks-out-after-barcelonas-champions-league-exit#comments

[hallicks]

Gave it a much better go than I thought we would. Needed the goal when we were really on top in the first 20 minutes, but Donnarumma, so yeah. PSG were clinical and we weren’t. 

[SuperBacon]

29 minutes ago, hallicks said:

PSG were clinical

Thought they were the exact opposite of that, incredibly wasteful.

[hallicks]

58 minutes ago, SuperBacon said:

Thought they were the exact opposite of that, incredibly wasteful.

Meh. They scored more than we did. They were clinical enough. 

[Devon Malcolm]

In the last 48 hours, Arteta has said that Arsenal "technically won the last two Premier Leagues" and has now said that Arsenal were the best team in the Champions League this season.

I'm not unbiased when it comes to Arsenal, obviously, and I think Arteta is a prick who plays terrible football. But what do Arsenal fans think about this sort of thing? Nobody's buying it, surely?

[SuperBacon]

"You’re 16th in the league, had an absolute shocker of a season, could get knocked out the Europa League by Arctic FC tonight, surely you’re not going to laugh at Arsenal…”

Spurs fans: 

[air_raid]

1 hour ago, Devon Malcolm said:

In the last 48 hours, Arteta has said that Arsenal "technically won the last two Premier Leagues" and has now said that Arsenal were the best team in the Champions League this season.

I'm not unbiased when it comes to Arsenal, obviously, and I think Arteta is a prick who plays terrible football. But what do Arsenal fans think about this sort of thing? Nobody's buying it, surely?

I imagine after all the "put the pressure on" DVD memes over the years, I believe Arsenal fans will... think absolutely nothing of this twaddle from their gaffer, because they have zero self-awareness.

Mind you, putting club allegiances to one side for a second and just thinking about annoyance levels, I'd definitely take them winning the league over another Liverpool one at any point in the next 30 years.

[Devon Malcolm]

28 minutes ago, air_raid said:

Mind you, putting club allegiances to one side for a second and just thinking about annoyance levels, I'd definitely take them winning the league over another Liverpool one at any point in the next 30 years.

Absolutely not! Arsenal's Specialist(s) In Failure streak is the best comedy in the Premier League right now.

[mim731]

2 hours ago, Devon Malcolm said:

In the last 48 hours, Arteta has said that Arsenal "technically won the last two Premier Leagues" and has now said that Arsenal were the best team in the Champions League this season.

I'm not unbiased when it comes to Arsenal, obviously, and I think Arteta is a prick who plays terrible football. But what do Arsenal fans think about this sort of thing? Nobody's buying it, surely?

Clearly. Which makes me think this will not be a good faith discussion, especially given you've already misrepresented what he said. 

 

41 minutes ago, Devon Malcolm said:

Absolutely not! Arsenal's Specialist(s) In Failure streak is the best comedy in the Premier League right now.

Yep. 

For the record, I completely get why other clubs fans don't like Arteta. I'm sure I wouldn't too if the roles were reversed. 

EDIT: To add some more thoughts, I do think Arteta lost his way a bit this season in tactical and philosophical terms compared to last season, but I also look at the difference in where Arsenal where when he came in to now, and I do think that is a reasonable metric for success up to the point of winning a trophy. I imagine that next year that will be a requirement to stay in his job.  

  

1 hour ago, air_raid said:

I imagine after all the "put the pressure on" DVD memes over the years, I believe Arsenal fans will... think absolutely nothing of this twaddle from their gaffer, because they have zero self-awareness.

I actually think this a bit harsh. There are, like at every club a number of absolute cretins who lack self awareness, but to add a sweeping generalisation feels unfair. I've met plenty of fans from other clubs who are also wildly lacking in self awareness as I have met plenty of Arsenal fans who fit the same description. There's not exactly a massive bar to entry for football, so it's always going to attract a broad church, including a healthy number of morons.

Edited May 8, 2025 by mim731
Adding some extra thoughts

[SuperBacon]

28 minutes ago, mim731 said:

There's not exactly a massive bar to entry for football, so it's always going to attract a broad church, including a healthy number of morons.

We call them West Ham fans.

[tiger_rick]

47 minutes ago, mim731 said:

Clearly. Which makes me think this will not be a good faith discussion, especially given you've already misrepresented what he said. 

I'm not sure he has. Arteta's point was pretty stupidly made. I get why he's making it. They've had two good seasons, looked like the team best placed to end City's streak and Liverpool have absolutely mullered them. I can see why he's trying to save face.

47 minutes ago, mim731 said:

EDIT: To add some more thoughts, I do think Arteta lost his way a bit this season in tactical and philosophical terms compared to last season, but I also look at the difference in where Arsenal where when he came in to now, and I do think that is a reasonable metric for success up to the point of winning a trophy. I imagine that next year that will be a requirement to stay in his job.  

I think this is about right. They're in a good position with positive momentum. Two good seasons in the PL, perhaps about to finish second for a third season and good performances in the CL. The squad is clearly light on a top forward and a DM if Partey goes but other than making a couple of signings to keep it fresh, there aren't any glaring holes in it and they've brought through some superb young players.

Arteta has been responsible for changing the squad and the culture. They could easily have spiralled down like Man Utd have (and that isn't a cheap dig at United, even I feel sorry for them these days! Sorry Dev.) but he's arrested the decline and built well. Injuries to Odegaard, Saka and Havertz have cost them big over the last season and a bit. All things considered, he's the right person to have another go at it with a full squad and two class additions. If he doesn't succeed next season, I think you then need to give someone else a shot at it. They have too much going for them to waste it winning nothing.

[mim731]

3 minutes ago, tiger_rick said:

I'm not sure he has. Arteta's point was pretty stupidly made. I get why he's making it. They've had two good seasons, looked like the team best placed to end City's streak and Liverpool have absolutely mullered them. I can see why he's trying to save face.

I agree, and I 100% get why it's irksome to other fans that he is trying to save face. I can completely see why non-Arsenal fans don't like him. However, as an Arsenal fan he has made us feel like we can compete again which buys him an awful lot of goodwill. Obviously that goodwill is not infinite either. 

The point on misrepresentation I was making was he didn't say Arsenal "technically won the last two Premier Leagues" as Devon (who has himself admitted is far from objective on this subject) has stated. Arteta's point, although I agree clunkily made in an attempt to rescue the perception of a pretty torrid season, was clearly not that he thinks we technically won the league the last two years, and an attempt to say that without context feels misleading. 

[Devon Malcolm]

I don't think a dislike of something immediately means that a discussion of that thing is going to be in bad faith, but ok.

I think Arteta is both the cure (got Arsenal contending again; overseeing promotion of excellent young talent) and the problem (Wenger-esque stubborn refusal to strengthen in problem areas; is a real tosspot). I wonder if his methods have reached a natural limit.