AEW Saturday Collision

[RedRooster]

45 minutes ago, LaGoosh said:

 

For me, this is one of the worst things AEW has brought to this forum. People make perfectly reasonable points about wrestler safety, and get met with sarcastic memes in response, in a really dismissive way. I fully appreciate that this might not be the intention here, and I think LaGoosh is a tremendous poster on the whole. and seems like a really nice guy. But I can’t be the only person who is fed up of this kind of thing. There’s room for a range of opinions on these boards, without this kind of response.

(and yes, I know people used memes on here pre-AEW, but it seems to be more prevalent in these threads; often to defend the indefensible)

Edited December 3, 2023 by RedRooster

[Hannibal Scorch]

Yeah, a great episode over all (must be reading here for the inclusion of the Mox promo). Just a decent 2 hours of matches and story progression. A very easy watch. Do feel for Garcia, he’s definitely the Jay Lethal in his group, I hoped he’d at least get a win.

[Chili]

43 minutes ago, RedRooster said:

For me, this is one of the worst things AEW has brought to this forum. People make perfectly reasonable points about wrestler safety, and get met with sarcastic memes in response, in a really dismissive way. I fully appreciate that this might not be the intention here, and I think LaGoosh is a tremendous poster on the whole. and seems like a really nice guy. But I can’t be the only person who is fed up of this kind of thing. There’s room for a range of opinions on these boards, without this kind of response.

(and yes, I know people used memes on here pre-AEW, but it seems to be more prevalent in these threads; often to defend the indefensible)

I'm going to both defend and criticise that in my view it feels like people just give WWE so much slack because they are just there and they'll never be going, plus we're all jaded and with TNA not being TNA anymore, we'd like something to be negs about. I think there are double standards and especially when it comes to people being Lovejoy about things like Flair and Darby Allin or Jay Lethal. I understand and know there are allegations against them, bad ones and yes it's shit and I'm not letting them off, but I'm going to be a cunt and watch AEW still because I do really enjoy having an alternative product, given that I fucked off WWE when the Saudi stuff started, its just too fucking awful. That and stuff like the Ashley Massaro incident, but it's WWE, they'll never be gone. The tribalism is on this forum too but nowhere near the level. But sometimes maybe I'm too emotional and maybe others when AEW is seen as this den of reprobates and horrid shits when the brand leader is an absolute ghoul factory. 

In general I think we're all a bit disappointed that AEW is not what we 'believed' and I hate to throw this this phrase in. We wanted a woke wrestling utopia that was alternative, and we've got it but it's not probably what we wanted per say?

I've not had much sleep so sorry everyone for going off but being tired might have been the best way to articulate how I see it. I nearly left the place again because I find this place an escape and the discourse was miserable at times.

Edited December 3, 2023 by Chili

[andrew "the ref" coyne]

52 minutes ago, Hannibal Scorch said:

Yeah, a great episode over all (must be reading here for the inclusion of the Mox promo). Just a decent 2 hours of matches and story progression. A very easy watch. Do feel for Garcia, he’s definitely the Jay Lethal in his group, I hoped he’d at least get a win.

He will. I reckon he's being setup as a spoiler to knock someone out of the top spot.

[LaGoosh]

1 hour ago, RedRooster said:

For me, this is one of the worst things AEW has brought to this forum. People make perfectly reasonable points about wrestler safety, and get met with sarcastic memes in response, in a really dismissive way. I fully appreciate that this might not be the intention here, and I think LaGoosh is a tremendous poster on the whole. and seems like a really nice guy. But I can’t be the only person who is fed up of this kind of thing. There’s room for a range of opinions on these boards, without this kind of response.

(and yes, I know people used memes on here pre-AEW, but it seems to be more prevalent in these threads; often to defend the indefensible)

It was just a joke. I think everyone, myself included, was in agreement that Danielson wrestling with a broken orbital bone is a terrible idea.

Garcia has been doing great and despite losing he's definitely not in the Jay Lethal jobber spot. It all feels like it's building to one big win - maybe over an overconfident Danielson.

Edited December 3, 2023 by LaGoosh

[RedRooster]

15 minutes ago, Chili said:

I'm going to both defend and criticise that in my view it feels like people just give WWE so much slack because they are just there and they'll never be going

I think your post is a brilliant explanation as to why you feel how you do, but I don’t think it’s like that at all - not on here at least. 

I suppose I can only speak for myself, but for me, WWE’s problems were often the product of a culture created by a problematic billionaire. Everything that you’ve mentioned is truly awful - particularly what happened with Ashley Massaro, which didn’t get anywhere near the attention it deserved. I’m not naive enough to think that WWE is completely ‘cleaned up’ now that Vince is a more distant figure - but it does feel like it’s attempting to, even if it is only for corporate reasons. But when shit happens, WWE deserves to be called out for it. And I’ll never watch a Saudi show. 

On the other hand, when AEW started up, part of its mission statement was progressiveness. Brandi Rhodes promised that men and women would be paid equally if they were on the same position on the card - I’m sure she meant it too. But now AEW has its own controlling billionaire, who has his own set of problems. He’ll overlook sex offences if he is a fan of the wrestler in question; he seemingly does not like women’s wrestling, meaning that equal opportunities will never exist. How many wrestlers of colour have main event we an AEW PPV? It’s a very small number, and as far as I can think, it’s only been in multi-person matches where this has happened. That might change soon with Swerve, but the company is four years old now. 

It’s easy to skip the Saudi shows, but it’s not easy to skip Ric Flair - especially when his face is splashed all over the place due to the deal to promote his energy drink. It would be like a late night US talk show agreeing to promote Kevin Spacey’s new brand because the host really enjoyed Frank Underwood, it’s almost unthinkable. 

So I guess it feels like WWE - though far from perfect - is doing better at being better (again, likely for corporate reasons) whereas AEW has gone against its own mission statement to fall victim to the whims and views of its own dictatorial billionaire. 

Bit of a messy and overly long explanation, but hopefully it gives you something.

[Chili]

Thanks for making your points @RedRooster. I'm not going to debate and sully them because they're good points but I still feel mine stands too and I'm not going to argue any points either side. I gave up WWE because I didn't like the product and if AEW didn't pop up I'd probably just be watching SUMMERSLAM 1991 or something because I'd have fucked it all off. But again, WWE and other promotions are awful with what AEW gets muddied for. Throw in NJPW, who really have had a fucking bizarre approach to women. WWE was forced to adapt after caring about the women a bit until the crowds started rallying online and it got turned into Stephanie McMahon-Helmsley the great leader of the women's revolution.

I think it's bit like music of artists. We're all shy cunts for morals because we'll never listen to certain artists, but if they emotionally affect us in personal ways. If we were all so hard-line on everyone's behaviour we'd be left with just Lance Storm matches and Daniel O' Donnell records.

 

Edited December 3, 2023 by Chili

[SuperBacon]

I have no idea why WWE needs to be bought up when discussing AEW, and AEW needs to be bought up when discussing WWE.

It's bizarre IMO.

[Chili]

3 minutes ago, SuperBacon said:

I have no idea why WWE needs to be bought up when discussing AEW, and AEW needs to be bought up when discussing WWE.

It's bizarre IMO.

Because we're all fucking idiots mate. Honestly we are, it's just a bit more dignified on here than say X, Reddit or the wrestlecrap forums. Some of us appear to have routine normal lives.

[69MeDon]

I think that's probably the strongest set of CC matches in one night so far. Was very up for seeing Garcia get an upset victory at the end of that match, but alas.

[Loki]

4 hours ago, LaGoosh said:

It was just a joke. I think everyone, myself included, was in agreement that Danielson wrestling with a broken orbital bone is a terrible idea.

It’s really difficult to know how well sarcasm comes across in text form.  FWIW I read your initial response to me as agreement but then the Simpsons meme seemed the exact opposite sentiment so taken together I assumed you thought we were making a fuss over nothing.

 Edit: I’m also going to say that what the WWE does or doesn’t do is irrelevant to AEW.  WWE could sell its performers into slavery, or give them all healthcare and pay them a million bucks per bump, and neither scenario would absolve Tony Khan of his responsibilities.

Edited December 3, 2023 by Loki

[CavemanLynn]

Who is Danielson's next match against? Because, although it'd never happen, I'd love it if the match went less than a minute and he lost by stoppage because the opponent just kept smashing the protective shield into Danielson's face.

[The King Of Swing]

SAVE THE CLAMS. 

Really solid episode of wrestling. A couple of fun sprints, decent promo work (even Storm and Blue, were decent) and three strong tournament matches.

House of Black Vs. Daniels and Sydal was also a pleasant surprise. 

Nice video package for Mercedes and Willow. More of that please, Sniff.

[JLM]

Solid opener from Claudio and Brody. Good showcase for Claudio's amazing  feats of strength and a great closing stretch.

Abadon and Kiera Hogan was a decent squash. Crowd always gets into Abadon. I love the gimmick and thought she looked better than usual in ring here. I like the idea of Julia seeking out her next challenger and Abadon obviously makes sense. Presumably Abadon will pick a fairly whacky rule for her challenge to help them get through the match. It'll be tough otherwise as it's the green leading the green. 

So glad they aired Mox's promo on this episode. 

Was already looking forward to Garcia vs Andrade, then we get Daddy Magic on commentary as well? What a treat. LOVED this match. We're all collectively rooting for Garcia in this tournament and it's making for some tremendous heat in his matches. Garcia is game for a fight, he's tough, he's got his serious face on, he is capable of hanging with these guys but he is *juuust* about being bested by them in the key moments. Daddy Magic was fantastic here, adding to the drama brilliantly and showing a serious side to his commentary that we don't often get to see. Andrade and Garcia had great chemistry too, highlighted by that silky smooth finishing sequence. Really good stuff. Can't wait for Garcia to get the big win. He may have the same win/loss record as Jay Lethal but the difference in interest levels in their matches and how credible/strong they look in defeat has been night and day, and rightly so. I'm still calling Garcia to somehow beat Brody King.

I love me some Willie Mack, definitely of the most sympathetic underdogs around. Perfect choice for Wardlow's next victim.

Both Iron Savages and The Kingdom matches are frequently fast forward material for me. However! If they want wrestle at 200mph and condense the whole thing into two miinutes I'm on board.  Waaaay more fun than it should have been. 

I only watch the Athena matches on ROH these days, so I had honestly forgotten Ethan Page existed. Not the next Kenny match I'd have asked for.

HOB vs Daniels/Sydal was another quality little sprint. Build for this feud has been a bit messy but FTR vs Matthews/Black will be a good'un. 

Not sure why they had Schiavone wittering on about standby matches all show. He seemd perplexed by it himself. You don't have to apologise for putting TV matches on the TV show, you silly goose. 

Amusing promo from Toni Storm; stealing Renee's shoe was a great touch. Skye Blue also sounded much better than usual. Still has a loooot of work to do on promos, but better nonetheless. 

Vikingo/Sabian was yet another entertaining sprint.  Vikingo as spectacular as ever. Didn't have too many long instances of setting up spots/the opponent waiting for him to do the next thing, which I appreciated. The finish looked painful though. I know he's a fairly small dude but man he landed flat on his back flush on top of Sabian. Oof. 

Keith Lee back in aloof nerd mode. Bit disappointed by that. Him and Shane Taylor slapping meat for 10 minutes will be good. The hook of who "he" is does not have enough intrigue for it to go on for this long. 

Strong video package for Willow/Mercedes Martinez. 

Not sure what they're doing with Miro and CJ Perry. Would rather see him doing stuff than talking about why he's not doing stuff.

Cracking main event of course. Nobody conveys the need to win better than Eddie in matches like this. I loved Eddie kneeling taking the kicks and then flailing his arm at Danielson in retaliation. Not really a punch or a chop or a hold. Just throwing the arm at him because it was all he had left. Danielson going full prick at the end was perfect as well. None of your handshake/mutual respect business here. Also testament to Eddie that the first "this is awesome" chant actually got drowned out by an "Eddie" chant instead. They got the other chant as well by the end, but wrestling's always better when the crowd desperately wants someone to win.

Much like the recent Dynamites, the Continental Classic matches are hitting for me and they're doing a great job of injecting as much variety and rapid fire pacing into the rest of the show to prevent those matches causing burnout. Good stuff., 

 

Edited December 3, 2023 by JLM

[Chili]

Can we have a chat about Miro and CJ Perry both being proper into cuck scenarios as a kink and playing it over three extremely similar storylines over the years. It used to be said that Vince McMahon was aghast that Miro could bag a lass like Lana but either it's the only storyline they've been capable of pitching. If Miro turned down loads of angles until Khan caved in, hired his wife and then got her a paycheck to play out their funky kink fantasy... I admire the grift.