Wrestling #MeToo #SpeakingOut

[BomberPat]

2 hours ago, Yakashi said:

It doesn’t help that meltzer is out there in public saying that Polly has zero credibility. A too large portion of the minuscule wrestling fandom remaining seem to make their decisions based on what he says so that’s never good.

 

Meltzer's never been good with this sort of thing at all, but it is true that Pollyanna apparently wasn't/isn't well-liked by a lot of women to the point that a lot were reluctant/outright refused to work with her even before any allegations of blacklisting. That side of things has become almost impossible to talk about, because now anyone who might be trying to make a reasoned criticism of Pollyanna's behaviour during her career, or putting their own story out there, will come across as attacking Pollyanna as a victim, and that's not a position anyone wants to find themselves in. And a lot of the women who will have worked with her and maybe have something to say - either in support or in defence - are now with WWE, and probably very heavily discouraged from saying anything.

All of that said - I'm (and I don't think anyone else is) not suggesting that Pollyanna has lied about being assaulted, or how Ospreay dealt with that, I'm just speculating about where the sense of "zero credibility" or whatever has come from, aside from Meltzer's own misogyny and playing favourites. And I'll admit that there are other women I'm aware of taking liberties with talent and being nightmares to work with that haven't had the Pollyanna treatment.

Edited August 12, 2020 by BomberPat

[Yakashi]

This was his response when questioned why he reported on the story without ever bothering to try and speak to her.

 

“As I was told by the top sportswriter I know when I brought this up, the minute someone involved in the story claims you are part of the conspiracy to get them, they've ruined their credibility and talking to someone that you know going in has no credibility makes you a fake in your field.

You want to cling to someone when they've already outed they have no credibility, you must really have a hell of an agenda.”

 

I believe this is because Pollyanna has said that Dave wasn’t doing enough with her individual story or was purposely protecting Will because they’re friends/good moves and flips. Something like that anyway.  
 

There’s multiple ways to take that quote of course but It seems like a massive cop out excuse to me. He has a habit of protecting his friends and favourites (racist homophobe disease spreader piece of shit Chris Jericho being a prime example) but I can understand it’s tough situation. If he’s a real journalist though as he claims, he really should make the effort to speak to the involved parties before labelling them as having no credibility and calling anyone that sides with her as having an agenda. I think he has covered the whole movement story really well, but this one wasn’t a win.

[Guest]

22 minutes ago, Yakashi said:

racist homophobe disease spreader piece of shit Chris Jericho

This has doubtless been covered elsewhere on the forum, but would anyone mind summarising or linking to what this is all about? I've seen references to it before but missed what it actually relates to. Ta.

[Chris B]

40 minutes ago, Yakashi said:

This was his response when questioned why he reported on the story without ever bothering to try and speak to her.

 

“As I was told by the top sportswriter I know when I brought this up, the minute someone involved in the story claims you are part of the conspiracy to get them, they've ruined their credibility and talking to someone that you know going in has no credibility makes you a fake in your field.

You want to cling to someone when they've already outed they have no credibility, you must really have a hell of an agenda.”

 

I believe this is because Pollyanna has said that Dave wasn’t doing enough with her individual story or was purposely protecting Will because they’re friends/good moves and flips. Something like that anyway.  

According to Bix, she said he wasn't doing enough and was trying to hush down the allegations after he had dismissed the company that confirmed her story about Ospreay blackballing her, on the basis that it was a small company. So, basically, she didn't attack him until after he'd tried to discredit her story.

 

Edited August 12, 2020 by Chris B

[RedRooster]

1 hour ago, Yakashi said:

This was his response when questioned why he reported on the story without ever bothering to try and speak to her.

 

“As I was told by the top sportswriter I know when I brought this up, the minute someone involved in the story claims you are part of the conspiracy to get them, they've ruined their credibility and talking to someone that you know going in has no credibility makes you a fake in your field.

You want to cling to someone when they've already outed they have no credibility, you must really have a hell of an agenda.”

 

I believe this is because Pollyanna has said that Dave wasn’t doing enough with her individual story or was purposely protecting Will because they’re friends/good moves and flips. Something like that anyway.  
 

There’s multiple ways to take that quote of course but It seems like a massive cop out excuse to me. He has a habit of protecting his friends and favourites (racist homophobe disease spreader piece of shit Chris Jericho being a prime example) but I can understand it’s tough situation. If he’s a real journalist though as he claims, he really should make the effort to speak to the involved parties before labelling them as having no credibility and calling anyone that sides with her as having an agenda. I think he has covered the whole movement story really well, but this one wasn’t a win.

Right of reply is one of the most basic elements of journalism, this is incredibly poor.

If anyone’s credibility has taken a bashing in recent years, it’s Meltzer. 

[Magnum Milano]

Just now, Chris B said:

According to Bix, she said he wasn't doing enough and was trying to hush down the allegations after he had dismissed the company that confirmed her story about Ospreay blackballing her, on the basis that it was a small company. So, basically, she didn't attack him until after he'd tried to discredit her story.

 

Should've known Bixentwat would've stuck his nose in. 

Edited August 12, 2020 by Magnum Milano

[Snitsky's back acne]

7 hours ago, Yakashi said:

It doesn’t help that meltzer is out there in public saying that Polly has zero credibility. 

 

Wow, he actually said that? How the fuck would he know!?
I mean I know he blows Ospreay any chance he can get but... seriously!?
 

[mikey]

DavidB is right about how some on social media have reacted.  There has been an especially stark divide between the US and UK and between WWE and indy fans.  Look at Matt Riddle, who was clearly lying about not having an affair with Candy Cartwright from the very start and yet people have yelled "exhonorated" every time something comes along which confirms their biases that he's innocent and she's a lying whore.  It seems fairly obvious to me that her version of events - which hasn't changed since day one - is far closer to the truth than his.  However, right now, he has some form of plausible deniability, unless one of the guys in the van says "I only pretended to be asleep, he mouth-raped her".

I have thoughts on the Pollyanna/Ospreay thing but I'm not sure I dare.

[Chris B]

59 minutes ago, Magnum Milano said:

Should've known Bixentwat would've stuck his nose in. 

Based on the Ashley Massaro story, he was the only person actually digging into the story at the time, and he's generally been pretty good at pointing to allegations and keeping facts reasonably straight. Out of everyone in this story, how come he's the one you're pissed off at?

[RedRooster]

Meltzer’s reporting seems to be tainted by his own biases, affecting who he believes and how he portray things. 

Wrestling journalism should be held to a higher standard than this.

There are so many stories that would have made a huge impact in literally any other form of entertainment that fail to land in wrestling.

That, to a large degree, is down to the standard of wrestling journalism over the years which should be leading the charge rather than actively avoiding it. 

Bixenspan, on the other hand, does an excellent job.

[mikey]

21 minutes ago, RedRooster said:

Meltzer’s reporting seems to be tainted by his own biases, affecting who he believes and how he portray things. 

Meltzer is of the school where you don't report allegations.  He was trained in the late 70s IIRC, you'd go nowhere near a story like these, even with all these allegations, until it hit a courtroom.  There would need to be a lawsuit or an arrest or somebody would need to get charged.

For instance, he reported that Pollyanna wasn't credible because he was told that Pollyanna wasn't credible, which is where the frustration lies.  He'll offer the courtesy of credibility to the accused but not the accuser.

[Chris B]

Meltzer also cast aspersions on Ashley Massaro's account, and clearly wanted to go nowhere near it. This kind of thing is not his strong suit.

[RedRooster]

Accountability in an industry relies on strong, unbiased journalism which wrestling, unfortunately, doesn’t have enough of. I’d go as far as to say Meltzer has done more harm than good by dismissing allegations which merit further examination. It’s a real shame. 

[mikey]

1 hour ago, Chris B said:

Meltzer also cast aspersions on Ashley Massaro's account, and clearly wanted to go nowhere near it. This kind of thing is not his strong suit.

You're right. Rather than give him the benefit of the doubt, I'm defending the indefensible. 

[Chris B]

3 hours ago, mikey said:

You're right. Rather than give him the benefit of the doubt, I'm defending the indefensible. 

I thought your point about 'offer the courtesy of credibility to the accused but not the accuser' didn't come across as defending or anything - it's a very fair point. I wasn't disagreeing with you - more expanding on the point.

Edited August 12, 2020 by Chris B