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It's today then ... (Trump thread)


mikehoncho

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The whole fucking country was looted from the natives. Museums filled with 'artifacts' from other countries, black neighbourhoods ploughed to rubble to make room for another Starbucks, where police are beating and murdering the descendents of people who were looted from Africa. Yeah, opportunism.

Edited by Astro Hollywood
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You get the distinct uneasy feeling that America is about the explode. You can feel the tension coming off your screens.

I've always agreed with the thinking that racism will only end when people stop earning money off of it. People really do need to be prepared to walk away from systems that hold it in place. That's a massive thing to do and involves more than posting a black square (not a criticism of that, just an observation)

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16 minutes ago, Factotum said:

You get the distinct uneasy feeling that America is about the explode.

Hopefully it'll take this country with it too, which is just as shit and racist.

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28 minutes ago, Sergio Mendacious said:

You're right, I've been up since 1am in bits thinking about poor Gucci having to pick up his business after this.

If it were only large, multimillion dollar enterprises such as Gucci and Apple being ransacked, then it wouldn't be as much of an issue (although certainly no less criminal). It isn't though, it's also small, family-run businesses being destroyed, mostly by people who have seen the protests and unrest as perfect cover for their criminal actions.

Regardless of anyone's stance on the entire situation, surely we can agree that smashing up the livelihoods of small businesses is not a good thing? It also shouldn't be explained away.

Obviously the protesting is an entirely different matter altogether, despite media attempts to marry both in order to shine a negative light on the protesters.

16 minutes ago, Astro Hollywood said:

The whole fucking country was looted from the natives. Museums filled with 'artifacts' from other countries, black neighbourhoods ploughed to rubble to make room for another Starbucks, where police are beating and murdering the descendents of people who were looted from Africa. Yeah, opportunism.

I assume from your comments that you're under the belief that the destruction of small businesses is being done by those who are protesting the police brutality then? I'm not so sure it's the same people who are involved.

I think it's being done by people who don't give a flying fuck about any of the things you've mentioned in your post. They're not protesting to change how things are, they're just thieving arseholes taking advantage of some chaos. There's a difference.

Edited by David
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@David What are your views on the police and far right protesters who have lit the fires or started the looting to get others to follow? Also, whay about the cars that have been purposefully dumped for protestors to attack, and the pallets of bricks which have been placed outside buildings for no real reason, but as an attempt to arm protestors?

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1 minute ago, Hannibal Scorch said:

@David What are your views on the police and far right protesters who have lit the fires or started the looting to get others to follow? Also, whay about the cars that have been purposefully dumped for protestors to attack, and the pallets of bricks which have been placed outside buildings for no real reason, but as an attempt to arm protestors?

I don't think that's really got anything to do with what David's saying. He's talking about small businesses and how protests have been co-opted by an element looking to just cause damage and steal stuff.

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4 minutes ago, Hannibal Scorch said:

@David What are your views on the police and far right protesters who have lit the fires or started the looting to get others to follow? Also, whay about the cars that have been purposefully dumped for protestors to attack, and the pallets of bricks which have been placed outside buildings for no real reason, but as an attempt to arm protestors?

My views are pretty much the same as every other intelligent person on the planet. That the far-right are scum, the police in the States have had this coming for a long time, and that the protesters are completely in the right to be fighting against a system that isn't fair in the slightest.

I don't really think that's up for debate though, is it?

The point I was making was that the opportunists who are using the current unrest to loot shops and cause trouble are not, despite attempts by the media, part of the protests for the most part. You're right, there are bricks and suchlike being left in strategic areas to try and entice protesters into causing damage. The government hopes that if they can pin the protesters with destroying innocent people's businesses etc they'll slowly turn public opinion against them. 

Hell, I wouldn't even put it past the people leading the looting being on the payroll of government to try and lead people in that direction. 

I've seen video footage on Twitter of protesters trying to get people to stop smashing up small businesses, and I've seen people of all backgrounds come together to try and help clean up the mess caused to the smaller businesses who have been affected.

The truth is, just because I agree whole-heartedly with the protests against the police and the US government doesn't mean I'm going to turn a blind eye and hand a pass to some cretins using the situation to score some free swag. Fuck those people who are taking advantage of the situation. 

Edited by David
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19 minutes ago, David said:

Obviously the protesting is an entirely different matter altogether, despite my attempts to marry both in order to shine a negative light on the protesters.

Fixed.

Seriously, deflecting the conversation about the protests in order to primarily talk about the looters, then complaining that the looters are deflecting from the protests, is some pretty weak sauce.

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Just now, Chris B said:

Fixed.

Seriously, deflecting the conversation about the protests in order to primarily talk about the looters, then complaining that the looters are deflecting from the protests, is some pretty weak sauce.

Come on now, that's a pretty desperate reach. 

I'm not "deflecting" anything. The looting, which the media and government are doing their utmost to pin on the protesters, is part of the discussion. I mean, it's obviously working when you have the likes of Astro going all Malcolm-X in an attempt to explain why protesters would smash up small businesses.

The problem is, for every Astro there are far more people who'll see these reports claiming protesters are looting shops and think "fuck these protesters, destroying people's livelihoods."

I watched Andre Taylor, one of the founders of Not This Time say in interviews over the past few days that the trashing of small businesses and enterprise is not what the protests are all about. He's absolutely right, and having people offer the looters and vandals a pass is only playing into the hands of those who wish to paint the protests and those leading it in a bad light.

I say it again, fuck the looters and the opportunists. They're actually counter-productive to the protests and the message of the protesters. 

 

 

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Every time I go on Reddit there's another dozen videos of innocent peaceful protesters being tear gassed, shot, attacked. The ones that stood out to me this morning were;
A cop forcing a black man's hand onto a stick so he had an excuse to punch him in the head, even though the man tried to move his hand anywhere else.
A cop pushing a photographer into a fire for no reason.
A group of cops responding to a small business owner's call to stop looters turning up and arresting both the store owners on sight because they were black, despite protests from bystanders telling them they own the store.
A peaceful protest being broken up by a cop needlessly tear gassing a woman holding a pink umbrella, then giving the excuse for the other cops to open fire on the crowd with more gas and shots.
A good handful of videos of cops deliberately kneeling on necks of protesters until another cop is forced to stop them.
A cop falling off his own riot van, hundreds of meters from anyone else and instinctively just spraying his tear gas everywhere.

They'll all get away with it, with at most a slap on the wrist. That orange idiot has called in the army now like I'm sure he wanted all along so the only way now is down. I think it's going to end with the massacre of a bunch more innocent people or a civil war will erupt.

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5 minutes ago, David said:

Come on now, that's a pretty desperate reach.  

Your first comment about the protests was a crack about COVID and your second was 'Well, I'm sure that's a great comfort to business owners'. And you deflect other conversation with 'well, I'm not sure that's up for debate'. The looting is clearly the conversation you want to have instead. So well done. But don't whine about that being pointed out.

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1 minute ago, FelatioLips said:

That orange idiot has called in the army now like I'm sure he wanted all along so the only way now is down. I think it's going to end with the massacre of a bunch more innocent people or a civil war will erupt.

For Trump the main aim will likely be to try and put off the election this year. He's been angling for that for a while now, crying about how postal voting can be tampered with and so on. In the space of a few Covid-19 affected months he's went from a fairly strong favourite to defeat Biden in the election to someone fighting to maintain a hold on his current term, never mind the next term.

A civil war, for him, would likely be preferable to having to face an election he's going to lose.

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9 minutes ago, Chris B said:

Your first comment about the protests was a crack about COVID and your second was 'Well, I'm sure that's a great comfort to business owners'.

That wasn't a crack, that was me being honest. I've seen people on social media and on the news say "what about these people who are breaking all the protocols and could be spreading Covid?" At least they're wearing masks, and many of them are even organising themselves into distanced groups while they were marching. It was pretty well-handled considering the circumstances we're all living under right now, wouldn't you agree? I'd maybe make an exception for the London protest, that was a free-for-all from what I saw. Absolutely insane.

And my second comment is what I've mentioned in the past page or so. This notion that the protests against the police and a system of racism is justification for absolute fucking anarchy is nonsense. Surely when you have the people leading the fucking protests telling you this it should register, no?

9 minutes ago, Chris B said:

And you deflect other conversation with 'well, I'm not sure that's up for debate'.

Did you read the post I was replying to? It was asking what I thought of the right-wing violence and the police brutality? I replied with:

"My views are pretty much the same as every other intelligent person on the planet. That the far-right are scum, the police in the States have had this coming for a long time, and that the protesters are completely in the right to be fighting against a system that isn't fair in the slightest."

I don't think that's up for debate, do you? Do you want to argue against that statement? 

9 minutes ago, Chris B said:

The looting is clearly the conversation you want to have instead. So well done. But don't whine about that being pointed out.

The looting is part of the fucking conversation, you dimwit. We're seeing widespread looting from opportunists and thieves who are taking advantage of the current situation, and the media and government are pinning it on the protesters to try and dilute their message and reduce support for their cause.

That's a huge part of the conversation.

Edited by David
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