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Bellenda Carlisle

Comic Book and Superhero movie & TV discussion.

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Danger summed it up for me. It didn’t need to called joker at all. If you called it bob about a sad clown removed any trace of joker would the film be any less? 
 As a film is great, as a joker movie not so much for me 

Edited by quote the raven

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Funnily enough to my girlfriend it was just a dark film about a sad clown because she knows nothing about Batman or any of that shit and she liked it more than me. Might try her out with Taxi Driver next.

Edited by Mr_Danger

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I was proper disappointed with Joker. Didn’t help that 2 friends told me it was a masterpiece/best film they had ever seen. It was like Taxi Driver mixed with American Paycho but with a tedious Bat-Man tie in. Phoenix was great but the film wasted others massively. Especially Beatz and Marron. Had this not been a DC Film it would have been a decent character study, instead you have all these naff comic book tie ins. Proper disappointing 

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I was also disappointed by Joker. The story I thought was poor and was saved by a cracking performance. Went in expecting a 9/10 and came out struggling to justify marking it as a 7/10 on my IMDb list. Just felt really lacking something 

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The final act really saved it imo, up until then point I thought it was a bit of a slog. 7/10 is about right.

I like that it was pretty vague in the end as to what was real and what was just a fantasy. Though I saw the neighbor romance being fantasy coming a mile away.

Wouldn't be opposed to seeing that particular interpretation of the Batman universe explored further.

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Yeah good choice. Rumours that this is going to be close to THE LONG HALLOWEEN with a number of villains. Not sure how I feel about that even though I like that story a lot (also Nolan used it as a basis for Two Face in TDK)

One thing JOKER did show is you really don't need to spend huge amounts on some of these movies. A black and white, noir Batman detective film for 50 million would probably be pretty sweet.

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Someone mentioned it on here, but I’d have totally been on board with Michael Keaton coming back and playing an older Bruce Wayne in a Dark Knight Returns type movie. Keaton will always be the best Batman not voices by Kevin Conroy, and with the resurgence that Keaton has had in the last few years, revisiting Batman could’ve been really fun with the right director

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Didn't think much of Joker at all, think even less of it as a Joker origin story. It just felt like a mess of Angry White Male tropes, all of which have been done before and better, with no consistent through-thread to make it remotely believable, or for me to recognise any version of the character the Joker would become in the character as depicted in this film. Maybe it would have been better without the Joker name, but not by much, as it would still be a poor man's Taxi Driver/King of Comedy.

It was Phoenix being very good in a mediocre film, which maybe elevates it somewhat.

 

In terms of the Joker in general...I'm not a fan of Christopher Nolan's Batman films, but I think what he got absolutely right is not giving the Joker an origin story. He's much scarier as a character who just exists. We don't need to know everything. 

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24 minutes ago, BomberPat said:

In terms of the Joker in general...I'm not a fan of Christopher Nolan's Batman films, but I think what he got absolutely right is not giving the Joker an origin story. He's much scarier as a character who just exists. We don't need to know everything. 

Not a comment on the Joker film in general, but I think this is correct in two ways - either via Nolan's route of not giving him an origin, or the DC route of giving him multiple origins, of which nobody knows what is true, or if any of it's true, as it's almost the same thing.

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One thing that disappointed me about Joker was that it didn't really have any surprises, if I had written how I thought the film would be just before watching it it would have been 90% accurate. 

I think it would have had more to say if Gotham (TV series) had never existed. Showing a deeper look at Gotham city when Batman is a kid while a different interpretation of a famous Batman villain causes trouble is enough of a tenuous tease as it is, never mind the fact that they did it for years on a shit TV show.

I don't think making it nothing like the comics is as clever as Todd Phillips thinks it is either and I also really hate the normal name and backstory thing to begin with. I love mysterious characters and I think they could have come up with something much more wild and imaginative to showcase the Joker.

Phoenix was great though, would be cool to see him play a version of The Joker that gets to fight Batman.

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I think the problem both with Gotham and Joker is a bit of a chicken and egg scenario.

The generally accepted story of Gotham City is that it was corrupt and crime-ridden, but the "costumed villains" didn't really start showing up until after Batman became a vigilante. The suggestion of some inherent need for balance, in which the very existence of Batman creates ever more elaborate villains - with The Joker in particular generally being seen as his exact opposite.

Telling origin stories as existing in a time before Batman just messes with things, and throws out the timeline. The Joker being around before Batman was just doesn't really ring true to me.

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Someone mentioned it on here, but I’d have totally been on board with Michael Keaton coming back and playing an older Bruce Wayne in a Dark Knight Returns type movie.

Take this with a huge grain of salt, but there's rumours that Keaton is wanted for BATMAN BEYOND, which is apparently in the works. Whether he wants to do it is another thing

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