Loki Posted February 12 Share Posted February 12 Don't worry Keith, I've posted numerous times here that I think what the IDF are doing in Gaza is barbaric, and the overnight strikes in Rafah are deeply worrying. If people choose to ignore that, that's their business. Â I don't see compassion as a zero sum game, having compassion for innocent civilians in northern Israel shouldn't have to always be qualified with a similar statement on what's happening to the south. Â This being a news/current affairs thread, any other member of the forum is free to start a discussion on Rafah, and I won't immediately accuse them of antisemitism. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperBacon Posted February 12 Share Posted February 12 I saw someone say yesterday that Jeremy Corbyn is a zionist as he advocates for the same thing that a zionist does, a two state solution. I can't quite get my head round this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith Houchen Posted February 12 Share Posted February 12 Just now, SuperBacon said: I saw someone say yesterday that Jeremy Corbyn is a zionist as he advocates for the same thing that a zionist does, a two state solution. I can't quite get my head round this. Do you remember when Ken Livingstone was expelled from Labour for saying Hitler was a Zionist? Livingstone’s reasoning was Hitler wanted Jews to have their own land so they wouldn’t be in his. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Chest Rockwell Posted February 12 Moderators Share Posted February 12 55 minutes ago, Loki said:  I don't see compassion as a zero sum game, having compassion for innocent civilians in northern Israel shouldn't have to always be qualified with a similar statement on what's happening to the south.  I don't doubt your compassion or that you believe this, but I disagree wholeheartedly with this framing. It's ignorant to the context that the remarkable amazing military technology being discussed is facilitating genocide. It doesn't matter that the iron dome is defensive, if Israel couldn't hide behind it they wouldn't be able to do what they are doing. What is happening would not be possible without the heavily lopsided military capabilities of the two sides involved in the conflict. Which is where the complicity of the West lies, and also what makes it quite tasteless as a discussion point. I would hope that anyone that has read the thread to date and your contributions doesn't think you're cheering for the deaths of Palestinians and I don't doubt your intentions. I don't think there's any need for Keith to get defensive on your behalf, but I do think you're wrong on this and would urge you to reconsider your position. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loki Posted February 12 Share Posted February 12 (edited) You make an interesting point @Chest Rockwell.  I'm not sure I agree that Israel wouldn't still be doing what they are doing (after all, they have fought the Palestinians in Gaza, West Bank and southern Lebanon long before the Iron Dome existed) but I can see what you're driving at in terms of asymmetric warfare.  I wasn't seeking to glorify any aspect of this, but I am still glad that we're not seeing more Israeli casualties making their government even more intransigent. On the flip side, I see no evidence of Netanyahu backing down and unless internal opposition solidifies against him, one of those Western powers is going to have to intervene, surely. Edited February 12 by Loki Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith Houchen Posted February 12 Share Posted February 12 (edited) 9 minutes ago, Loki said: I'm not sure I agree that Israel wouldn't still be doing what they are doing (after all, they have fought the Palestinians in Gaza, West Bank and southern Lebanon long before the Iron Dome existed) Same here, they’ve been butchering and murdering before 2011 or when it became operational. Chest does make a good point about modern warfare changing the landscape and if it enables genocide. For me, it saves innocent lives and that’s never anything but good. As I said, I wish the Palestinians had one too and I can’t imagine anyone would wish Israel didn’t have it Edited February 12 by Keith Houchen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Hannibal Scorch Posted February 13 Paid Members Share Posted February 13 42 minutes ago, Keith Houchen said: Same here, they’ve been butchering and murdering before 2011 or when it became operational. Chest does make a good point about modern warfare changing the landscape and if it enables genocide. For me, it saves innocent lives and that’s never anything but good. As I said, I wish the Palestinians had one too and I can’t imagine anyone would wish Israel didn’t have it Do you think the IDF would have continued this long if they didn’t have it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith Houchen Posted February 13 Share Posted February 13 1 hour ago, Hannibal Scorch said: Do you think the IDF would have continued this long if they didn’t have it? Yes, of course they would. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith Houchen Posted February 13 Share Posted February 13 15 hours ago, Chest Rockwell said: Which is where the complicity of the West lies Don’t know if you heard this.  Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loki Posted February 16 Share Posted February 16 (edited) He's obviously bored in retirement. Edited February 16 by Loki Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperBacon Posted February 19 Share Posted February 19 Ash Sarkar asked Bernie Sanders if he thinks what is happening in Gaza is genocide. Â Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Devon Malcolm Posted February 19 Paid Members Share Posted February 19 Even the supposed American socialists can't say it. Fuck Sanders. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Merzbow Posted February 19 Share Posted February 19 The Yemeni armed forces have apparently sunk a British cargo ship in the Gulf of Aden in the past few hours. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loki Posted February 19 Share Posted February 19 (edited) 17 minutes ago, Merzbow said: The Yemeni armed forces have apparently sunk a British cargo ship in the Gulf of Aden in the past few hours. Yemeni military? Â Jesus, that's serious friendly fire. Â Are you sure it wasn't the Houthi rebels? Edit: a quick google suggests the Houthis are claiming they did it https://www.cnbc.com/2024/02/19/houthis-claim-catastrophic-attack-in-red-sea-as-crew-abandons-ship.html Edited February 19 by Loki Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Devon Malcolm Posted February 20 Paid Members Share Posted February 20 So cold I just caught the flu. Â Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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