Paid Members air_raid Posted January 21, 2022 Paid Members Share Posted January 21, 2022 8 hours ago, jazzygeofferz said: So they find Mustafa Ali who hasn't been on TV in months more important to them than Toni Storm who had wrestled Charlotte on the Friday on Smackdown and asked for her release following a house show on the Monday? That makes sense. 8 hours ago, d-d-d-dAz said: I mean, considering how utterly toxic that work environment must be (even moreso at the minute), it doesn’t surprise me that they don’t want to signal you can just ask to leave and then go. They’d be left with no one but Charlotte, Roman and Orton. What do you make of this, @Keith Houchen? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith Houchen Posted January 21, 2022 Share Posted January 21, 2022 11 minutes ago, air_raid said: What do you make of this, @Keith Houchen? I hope that none of them get damaged. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The King Of Swing Posted January 21, 2022 Share Posted January 21, 2022 I was going to say that Ali should just go to Vince's office, drops his pants and shit on Vince's desk. But Vince would probably find that hilarious. Mad old cunt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slapnut Posted January 21, 2022 Share Posted January 21, 2022 5 hours ago, The King Of Swing said: I was going to say that Ali should just go to Vince's office, drops his pants and shit on Vince's desk. But Vince would probably find that hilarious. Mad old cunt. THAT’S SUCH (a) GOOD SHIT Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
patiirc Posted January 22, 2022 Share Posted January 22, 2022 Bit out of the loop, but where does being an independent contractor vs employee fit in here? Surely Ali can go tell WWE to fuck off xx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simonworden Posted January 22, 2022 Share Posted January 22, 2022 4 hours ago, patiirc said: Bit out of the loop, but where does being an independent contractor vs employee fit in here? Surely Ali can go tell WWE to fuck off xx That always baffles me as well. I assumed it was either that you CAN leave but not wrestle for the time period or even simply can't work. Perhaps it's a out people's financial situation as well. If he needs money coming in he might be less inclined to leave than say Pac who may have had a bit saved up or conned his way into getting a giro once he got back to the UK. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members air_raid Posted January 22, 2022 Paid Members Share Posted January 22, 2022 6 hours ago, patiirc said: Bit out of the loop, but where does being an independent contractor vs employee fit in here? Surely Ali can go tell WWE to fuck off xx You sign a contract, you’re signed. You can no more tell WWE to “fuck off” than you can your landlord over your tenancy agreement. You’re in for the terms signed for, for the duration, unless the company agrees to early release. Or you can put yourself in a legally precarious position. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
patiirc Posted January 22, 2022 Share Posted January 22, 2022 3 hours ago, air_raid said: You sign a contract, you’re signed. You can no more tell WWE to “fuck off” than you can your landlord over your tenancy agreement. You’re in for the terms signed for, for the duration, unless the company agrees to early release. Or you can put yourself in a legally precarious position. Thanks for that. So he can basically do the minimum required to honour that contract, or actively rebel and get rinsed in court? Not that different to a football contract then. He could retire and get out that way, no?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andrew "the ref" coyne Posted January 22, 2022 Share Posted January 22, 2022 2 hours ago, patiirc said: Thanks for that. So he can basically do the minimum required to honour that contract, or actively rebel and get rinsed in court? Not that different to a football contract then. He could retire and get out that way, no?? That's actually how AJ Lee got out of her contract by retiring. But you can't just "unretire" straight after. There would be consequences. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Jesse Posted January 22, 2022 Paid Members Share Posted January 22, 2022 I'm not familiar with employment or contract law, especially in the US, but it does seem like talent are contracted in and locked for that period but that WWE can also terminate that contract whenever they want (rather than simply not renew it). I'd love to know what the break clauses they have are, because from an outside perspective it seems incredibly one-sided. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Statto Posted January 22, 2022 Paid Members Share Posted January 22, 2022 44 minutes ago, Jesse said: I'm not familiar with employment or contract law, especially in the US I'm believe a worryingly large majority of employees in the US exist in a world where their boss can come over to their desk on Friday afternoon and say "Hey, sorry but we're not going to need you anymore after today. Best of luck in whatever you do next though" and that's that. It's commonplace over there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members air_raid Posted January 22, 2022 Paid Members Share Posted January 22, 2022 3 hours ago, andrew "the ref" coyne said: That's actually how AJ Lee got out of her contract by retiring. But you can't just "unretire" straight after. There would be consequences. Funny thing being that’s exactly how Nash got out of WCW when he was Vinnie Vegas, by asking for his release to say he was jacking in wrestling and going to go back to bouncing. But actually he’d already been approached to come in as Shawns muscle/heater, recommended to HBK by the Steiners, if I recall. The first time Nash pretended to retire, but not the last. 1 hour ago, Jesse said: I'm not familiar with employment or contract law, especially in the US, but it does seem like talent are contracted in and locked for that period but that WWE can also terminate that contract whenever they want (rather than simply not renew it). I'd love to know what the break clauses they have are, because from an outside perspective it seems incredibly one-sided. Funny thing about contract law, as long as there’s consideration (e.g something in it for both parties, in this case the talent gets a wage for their work) then “one-sided” doesn’t matter if the talent signed it. Stuff like “creative doesn’t have anything for you” or a cost cut at the company’s discretion is no doubt written in, in similar terms to (not to use an employment term, heaven forbid) redundancy. They can let someone go because their role in the show is deemed to not exist any more, so as much as fans can get in an uproar about “But why is X still there then but they don’t have anything for Y” …. goes back to discretion and however unfair or one-sided it sounds, it’s what the talent signed on for, so it’s legally enforceable unless there are other legal grounds to invalidate the contract. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
d-d-d-dAz Posted January 22, 2022 Share Posted January 22, 2022 My notice period when I worked in New York was ‘at Will’. When I handed my notice in, security were sent to escort me from the building. Strange place. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Jesse Posted January 22, 2022 Paid Members Share Posted January 22, 2022 For the 'At will' stuff my understanding of that is that it is even. Your employer can get rid of you at any time for any reason (unprotected classes notwithstanding) but in that terminology you can do the same. If WWE is providing their contractors with contracts that exist over a fixed term (which they seem to be as we have contract renewals and wrestlers asking for their release instead of just quitting) then that fixed term would also apply to the company - where we'd see wrestlers not getting their contracts renewed, but also not just cut seemingly whenever WWE feels like it. As someone unfamiliar with it I'm just curious as to how that works in terms of WWE's contracts (and the US in general). My time as a fixed-term contractor in the UK had a renewal clause that they could extend it for another 6 months at the same rate without renegotiation but also a break clause - that either myself or my employer could choose to end the contract but with a 6 week notice period. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members air_raid Posted January 22, 2022 Paid Members Share Posted January 22, 2022 (edited) 1 hour ago, Jesse said: If WWE is providing their contractors with contracts that exist over a fixed term (which they seem to be as we have contract renewals and wrestlers asking for their release instead of just quitting) then that fixed term would also apply to the company - where we'd see wrestlers not getting their contracts renewed, but also not just cut seemingly whenever WWE feels like it. Again, discretion. The company can let you go whenever they want if you’ve signed for it. Forbes did an article about WWE contracts back in 2015 and anyone who’s signed since 2000 has basically agreed to 90 days notice of release for any reason. Interestingly the one year extension Lesnar signed in 2003, he negotiated for six months notice. Ironic. https://www.forbes.com/sites/chrissmith/2015/03/28/breaking-down-how-wwe-contracts-work/ Edited January 22, 2022 by air_raid Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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