Chyna

[garynysmon]

I'm not sure if I'm alone on this, but actually stepping in the ring against men killed Chyna's credibility for me.

Harking back to her debut and manhandling Marlena etc, she was a genuine amazon of a woman and was clearly capable of interfering on Triple H's behalf. I couldn't stand her and (don't judge me, I was 13) was desperate for one of the stars to knock her block off.

But once she started actually competing with men, despite being way bigger than the women, she was noticeably smaller than the men. It didn't help that she also started losing some of her muscle mass to appear more feminine, and had a few operations shall we say.

She had a longer shelf life steamrolling whatever masqueraded as a women's division at the time, and became badly exposed when competing in the Intercontinental title mix imo. 

Edited January 15, 2021 by garynysmon

[The Gaffer]

Her peak for me was with DX in 98. She was quietly getting over all year as a cool as fuck enforcer without being too exposed yet. That monster pop Triple H got in the SummerSlam ladder match - for me - was a pop for the pair of them, considering it was Chyna hitting Rock in the nuts that allowed the least cool member of DX to climb the ladder. I didn't mind her in 1999. She was clearly still getting over and was a huge part of their shows. But once she joined the Corporation and started speaking on the mic with that voice of hers, I was off it. 

I remember loving her winning the women's title at X-Seven in that Ivory squash. I was 10 and it felt like a proper logical, feel good moment. On that night you'd assume she'd just Goldberg the women for the next ten years, but that was the end of it.  

There was very little I thought was cooler than her theme tune, back then. Again, I was 10, and used to sing the lyrics around the house. "Don't treat me like a woman, don't treat me like a man." My dad must have thought I was mental. 

[wandshogun09]

29 minutes ago, Gay as FOOK said:

Again, I was 10, and used to sing the lyrics around the house. "Don't treat me like a woman, don't treat me like a man." My dad must have thought I was mental. 

I’m guessing your dad chose your username then? 

[IANdrewDiceClay]

1 hour ago, BomberPat said:

but by mid-2001 and with WCW done and dusted, she already wasn't the star she had been, and there wasn't much left for her to do that would have made for a return on that investment. 

This is a great point. Few suffered more than Chyna with WCW going under. With her deal coming up, had Fusient Media Ventures bought WCW, they'd have wanted "name" recognition. Lawler and Chyna would have been two you'd think would have gotten great deals from them.

[Joe Blog]

"What's Beijing doing in WCW"

[SaitoRyo]

7 minutes ago, Joe Blog said:

"What's Beijing doing in WCW"

They already had Asya!

[CL Punk]

16 hours ago, wandshogun09 said:

I listened to a clip of Jim Ross and Conrad (I know, my own fault) recently on the subject of Chyna’s departure from the WWF and the whole Triple H/Stephanie thing. And surprise, surprise, Good Ol’ JR came across as a right arsehole. He was on about Chyna basically having a bit of a breakdown and crying to him about her breakup with Triple H and was taking the piss about how she was crying and all sorts. It’s funny Ian mentioned Herman Munster because JR said something like ‘she sounded like Fred Gwynee when she cried’. Then seconds later he was saying it really effected him to see how crushed she was. She wasn’t without flaws obviously, and Ross also claimed she was demanding Steve Austin money or something before she left. But he sounded like a right horrible bastard mocking her like that. 

I have to ask, was Jim Ross always an asshole or is it a more of a recent development?

[IANdrewDiceClay]

Anyone see Chyna on the Surreal Life? X-Pac showed up halfway through and was painted out as an abusive boyfriend who got her on drugs. Which is obviously not the case to anyone who followed Chyna's career. She was doing shit long before she met Waltman. The bloke from the Brady Bunch was portrayed as this man of the house who would sort Waltman out if things got messy. X-Pac would have fucking killed this cunt, without getting up from those shitty inflatable chairs. Peter Brady vs Sean Waltman in a real fight for fucks sake. His eye would be on the floor.

[Chili]

4 minutes ago, IANdrewDiceClay said:

Anyone see Chyna on the Surreal Life? X-Pac showed up halfway through and was painted out as an abusive boyfriend who got her on drugs. Which is obviously not the case to anyone who followed Chyna's career. She was doing shit long before she met Waltman. The bloke from the Brady Bunch was portrayed as this man of the house who would sort Waltman out if things got messy. X-Pac would have fucking killed this cunt, without getting up from those shitty inflatable chairs. Peter Brady vs Sean Waltman in a real fight for fucks sake. His eye would be on the floor.

I remember watching that and it being the first time seeing how she was doing after hearing the stories and it wasn't pleasant was it. I have this mad hazy memory of Power Slam noting she caused a scene somewhere by climbing in a giant fish tank, might have been in a nightclub. I'm certain that's not a fever dream.

Chyna for me in retrospect peaks around early 1999. She HAD to be in the Rumble and get that spot, big thing at the time, plus the angle with Mark Henry was really important in humanising Chyna a bit, that was needed too. Plus Mizark was the absolute business in that bits.

Looking at it though, it's interesting to think that she seemingly had no more stories to tell as a character, nor none of us can come up with a solid or new one either. 

[Jackpot]

She got on Whose Line Is It Anyway? in 2002 and that's as good as it gets for anybody! 

Drew introduces her as Joanie Laurer, better known as Chyna from the WWF.

Edited January 15, 2021 by Jackpot

[SaitoRyo]

9 minutes ago, Chili said:

Looking at it though, it's interesting to think that she seemingly had no more stories to tell as a character, nor none of us can come up with a solid or new one either. 

She was definitely past her peak but there was still some stories to tell, or at least there should have been. 

She was an attraction and had a huge following. If she didn't want to wrestle the other women and felt like she should have been booked against Steve Austin rather than Ivory, that's one thing, but 'creative had nothing' is weak when you think about what they had in Chyna. 

Especially with the Invasion on the horizon and the likes of Jazz coming in, Trish improving as a worker, Victoria not too far behind. There'd have been a lot for her to do, if the circumstances and timing had been right. 

Fuck it, have her steamroll through members of the Alliance if you want, just for shits and giggles. I bet Vince would've gotten a kick out of Kanyon being powerbombed and pinned with one foot on his chest by a lass. 

The main problem was obviously her personal problems and not being able to cope with the HHH/Stephanie fallout. Hard to blame her too much for that. Can't have been a fun working situation, really. 

[Chili]

The personal stuff absolutely was obviously the undoing, and she got proper fucked over there as well which mentally and in her position wasn't gonna do gangbusters for her.

Fantasy booker hat on but as a guess I think she was going heel and probably aligned with Eddie Guerrero again. Timing seems right, Eddie had a thing with the Hardyz going that no way you sliced it would have been a heel turn if The Invasion didn't change plans and Eddie wasn't a mess. I reckon they might have gone back there, but now with them as more heels backing each other up with a past. Lita was taking that belt at some point and Matt Hardy was probably dropping the Euro Title back to Eddie before 'plans changed.'

[Factotum]

I assume that she probably was ready to leave about that time anyway as she had mainstream recognition and was being linked to all sorts of things. I suppose what fucked her was the the WWF wouldn't allow her to trade on the Chyna name.

They could easily have signed her to a part time contract with sporadic appearances while backing her to get into TV etc and taking a cut (like they did originally with The Rock) . I think that's where her bitterness stemmed from rather than the wrestling side.

[Liam O'Rourke]

34 minutes ago, SaitoRyo said:

'creative had nothing' is weak when you think about what they had in Chyna.

That's just it for me - what they had was a novelty act, and one that didn't have the talent to excel beyond that novelty. It had been played out for four years, and they'd squeezed every bit of life out of her as a wrestler that they could while maintaining the novelty, but the shelf life was up. Her solution was to be pushed harder than ever, a horrendous proposition. 

A lot of this I think has to do with modern eyes too. We're used to guys who have long outlived their usefulness milling out years after their sell by date in WWE now, whereas back then, somebody having a ten year run deserved its own t-shirt. The cycle of a wrestler's lifespan had a faster churn because their impact on the metrics mattered more to the success of the company. Once Chyna had outlived the benefit of the novelty, there's nothing else to do, and she is no longer a massive priority because you have one of the best rosters ever, then the attitude problem makes it an easy cut considering what she was probably making.

Edited January 15, 2021 by Liam O'Rourke

[Surf Digby]

1 hour ago, Chili said:

I have this mad hazy memory of Power Slam noting she caused a scene somewhere by climbing in a giant fish tank, might have been in a nightclub. I'm certain that's not a fever dream.

I remember that story too, and can specifically remember the picture that accompanied it as it was the first real indicator of just how terrible she looked.

 

1 hour ago, SaitoRyo said:

She was an attraction and had a huge following. If she didn't want to wrestle the other women and felt like she should have been booked against Steve Austin rather than Ivory, that's one thing, but 'creative had nothing' is weak when you think about what they had in Chyna. 

Especially with the Invasion on the horizon and the likes of Jazz coming in, Trish improving as a worker, Victoria not too far behind. There'd have been a lot for her to do, if the circumstances and timing had been right. 

If she's bitching about the women and wants to wrestle guys again, then that is the story. For that though, she needed to keep some size and not slim down to her WM-X7 physique. Stick her against some light heavyweights, showing that she can match them in strength and athleticism, whilst bitching about how the women should be able to offer her some competition the way the guys could. This then paves the way for bigger stronger women like Jazz and Victoria to come in as the "next generation".