The Official UKFF RAW thread (part 2)...

[The Gaffer]

Actually came here to say I was delighted with how Kofi and Woods reacted, so it's nice to see there's some discussion already on it. 

For me, it was nice straightforward heeling. Like three best friends in their young teens, and in a moment of slighted lover's reckoning the band aid rips off all the cool they've been keeping up and they just fall hard and fast into a black hole of sick-of-this-shit. 

Nice counterpart - at least so far - to the usual cinema thing of weeks on end of slowburn Kofi's Dilemma close ups. Nah, you know what? Fuck you. Go back to your girlfriend and your desk job, loser!

[The King of Old School]

Yeah I liked the New Day segment, dunno if E is close to being cleared but for me it works either way.

Opening segment was fantastic too, effortlessly all blended together and also set up the main event.

Gunther is a face now then I'm guessing? Think this could set up Gunther/Drew at Mania if so with Drew hopefully getting a nice title reign.

[DavidB6937]

2 minutes ago, The King of Old School said:

Gunther is a face now then I'm guessing?

Not sure it's as clear as that. I don't think he should be anyway. He should just be a fighting champion who won't take shit from anyone, no matter face or heel.

[The King of Old School]

15 minutes ago, DavidB6937 said:

Not sure it's as clear as that. I don't think he should be anyway. He should just be a fighting champion who won't take shit from anyone, no matter face or heel.

Yeah it could be that he gets slightly tweaked depending on who he's facing, but it does feel like it's been going that way for the past few weeks though with Ludwig. Plus they already have Bron as tweener champion too.

I think by the time Raw on Netflix comes around he will be a fully fledged face, which I think is a mistake as the heel side is a little low at the min.

[RedTwoster]

12 minutes ago, The King of Old School said:

Yeah it could be that he gets slightly tweaked depending on who he's facing, but it does feel like it's been going that way for the past few weeks though with Ludwig. Plus they already have Bron as tweener champion too.

I think by the time Raw on Netflix comes around he will be a fully fledged face, which I think is a mistake as the heel side is a little low at the min.

I don’t think he will be - I’d be very surprised if Gunther wasn’t what stands between John Cena and a potential final title reign. Cody/Cena is more interesting to me, but it sounds like the bulk of Cena’s final run will be on Raw.

[Supremo]

Triple Threat at Wrestlemania.

[Guest]

There were three things I wanted to highlight about the New Day segment:

1) When they were getting ready to announc the split, Xavier and Kofi were talking to the crowd like they were parents getting a divorce. Doing the exact opposite of WWE heel turns by telling the fans "it's not your fault". Absolutely hilarious, and it felt a lot like they were going out of their way to not do the sterotype of a heel turn.

2) As we've already picked up on, claiming that the reason they've been so stale for so long is because they've been waiting for E. Keeping things warm for him. And he just keeps leaving them hanging. He's the reason they're in this spot, they're so frustrated that they're taking it our on each other, but really, E's the problem. There probably is some backstage truth to it. We don't want to break up the New Day because we've got the big reunion when E gets back, so keep treading water, yeah guys? That he never asked them to do any of that is of course, not the point.

3) This is the first time, I think, that I've seen a WWE heel turn with 0 physicality. Absolutely added to the whole thing, because it made you go "crap, maybe he is never getting cleared if he can't even take a trouble in paradise". And again, felt like a deliberate attempt to avoid the trope.

When New Day first started, they talked about how they wanted to avoid the stereotype gimmicks, African savage, break dancer, or angry black man (which obviously got screwed up when they ended up in an entirely different stereotype). It's great that they ended the trio in something that avoided the standard tropes and played into something that felt more real.

[mim731]

I think it's also worth mentioning, longer term how much bigger and cathartic a New Day babyface reunion could now be if they eventually get there, rather than a shoehorned anniversary after a few weeks of build. There's a larger, more nuanced story to be told there and it could be absolutely huge if that's the overall direction they plan to go. This certainly gives them options, rather than a one-night pop and slipping almost instantly back into midcard obscurity.   

[BomberPat]

I went out of my way to watch the New Day segment, which I rarely do for anything WWE.

My girlfriend immediately laughed at how much they were talking like a divorcing couple, so not just @Duke picking up on that. 

I think Eddie Kingston has ruined wrestling promos for me, because I can't take "emotional" arguments seriously any more when everyone involved is taking it in turns to say their bit over a microphone, rather than just furiously shouting over each other. So the best bit was Big E, off-mic, pleading and asking if that was really it. That felt genuinely real, while Kofi and Xavier's put-downs still felt very wrestling, still felt like they were delivered at the right time and the right pacing to elicit a big Saved By The Bell "ooo-ooooh!" response from the audience. 

So it's still, as a product, not really for me, but this is one of the few times that I've seen WWE stuff since Triple H took over where I've really noticed the difference that people are talking about, rather than just seeing competently booked wrestling after years of being starved of that. They properly acknowledged their history, they acknowledged someone who works for a different company now (and not just doing it to fish for a "shock" reaction), they didn't treat the audience like idiots, and they gave heels some plausible, emotional motivation, rather than a hundredth variation on "YOU PEOPLE" or "RESPECT".

It felt, inasmuch as a very stagey WWE promo can, like old friends being pushed into opening up some old resentments - these two might have been bickering between themselves, but now you've shown up and stuck your nose in once they're already all worked up, actually, they're remembering how they don't like your new girlfriend and how they never see you any more, and they both turn on you. I bet Big E was booted from the group chat the moment he got backstage.

[DavidB6937]

Double post

Edited December 3, 2024 by DavidB6937
Don't you dare be sour

[DavidB6937]

 

Drew has competition on social media for his savageness.

[Doog]

As much as I enjoyed this show, and am enjoying WWE in general, it really irked me that the World Championship isn't the focal point of the show.

I always feel like your shows should be built about the World Champion/Championship. He should be in the main stories and the show revolves around him. Gunther hasn't been in a main event in months, if you were new to WWE you wouldn't even think being World Champion was that big of a deal. It should be and it should feel like it. Now he's heading into another secondary feud with Finn Balor. It's so depressing.

Even on Smackdown, Cody isn't the focal point of that show either anymore. If you're biggest stars are Reigns and Punk, then get the belts on them on each show and build the shows and stories around them.

Maybe it's not that big a deal for anyone else, but I just cannot stand the World Title not being the be all and end all of the shows 

[DavidB6937]

1 minute ago, Doog said:

Maybe it's not that big a deal for anyone else, but I just cannot stand the World Title not being the be all and end all of the shows 

But then you'll get people moaning that it's on a guy like Reigns who only defends it sporadically and is involved in a storyline that is far beyond a title. 

I don't think that the belts necessarily get devalued by not being EVERYTHING on a show. You'll always get stories that are more personal and don't need the belts. And it won't always be your biggest stars holding the belts.

It's definitely possible to present the main belts as important even if they're not the main focus every single show.

[d-d-d-dAz]

The problem WWE have, which is a good problem to have, is they have a small handful of absolute megastars who - if you stick to that rule - the only main events we'd ever get would be Roman v Cody, with occasionally Rock, CM Punk or John Cena popping in for a hello.

As long as the opposition is Finn Balor, I'm happy for Gunther to bide his time lower down the card whilst he waits for one of the big names to look his way.

 

Edited December 3, 2024 by d-d-d-dAz

[Rockbus2]

I took Adam Pearce's comments to Finn as meaning he's pulling double duty at SNME. Tell me you wouldn't enjoy him being smacked around a bit by Gunther and then having to defend the tag titles straight after?