Paid Members Egg Shen Posted December 23, 2011 Paid Members Share Posted December 23, 2011 im still interested to read how many people think Brock's going to win this, im willing to bet the house that he gets smashed within two rounds (i'd say 1, but im giving myself a little bit of room for error). Â I don't reallt know what people are basing their judgements on? Brock's had about a minute's success in his past two fights, the rest of the time he's been beaten up pretty bad, the guy's also coming off a 14 month layoff, and he's going in against the most feared striker in MMA. Brock's gonna come in paniced (is that a word?), sloppy and he's gonna get laid out. Brock's fought the same his entire career and coming off such a long lay off he's going to be even worse, especially considering who he's fighting. Â If the Werdum fight hadn't happened i'm liable to think that The 'Reem would be a bigger favorite to win, but his stock unfairly dropped after that fight and everyone's kinda of buying into this shit that he's rubbish on the ground, which he isn't. Â Overeem by destruction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Egg Shen Posted December 23, 2011 Paid Members Share Posted December 23, 2011 just dropped Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Dead Mike Posted December 23, 2011 Paid Members Share Posted December 23, 2011 I'm with you, I can't see anything other than Overeem winning early. Brock could easily get caught in a nasty guillotine going for the takedown or if The Reem manages to stuff a couple of shots & keep it standing it wont take long at all. I'm thinking a highlight reel KO, like a big head kick early doors. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members wandshogun09 Posted December 23, 2011 Paid Members Share Posted December 23, 2011 im still interested to read how many people think Brock's going to win this, im willing to bet the house that he gets smashed within two rounds (i'd say 1, but im giving myself a little bit of room for error). I don't reallt know what people are basing their judgements on? Brock's had about a minute's success in his past two fights, the rest of the time he's been beaten up pretty bad, the guy's also coming off a 14 month layoff, and he's going in against the most feared striker in MMA. Brock's gonna come in paniced (is that a word?), sloppy and he's gonna get laid out. Brock's fought the same his entire career and coming off such a long lay off he's going to be even worse, especially considering who he's fighting.  If the Werdum fight hadn't happened i'm liable to think that The 'Reem would be a bigger favorite to win, but his stock unfairly dropped after that fight and everyone's kinda of buying into this shit that he's rubbish on the ground, which he isn't.  Overeem by destruction.  I'm deffo not ruling out Overeem by destruction cos there's always a chance with a striker of his level to land something. But I'm still picking Brock by stoppage in round 2 or 3.  Here's what I'm basing it on  You're right about Brock having a very rough couple of fights but in my opinion he's been fighting the better opposition at Heavyweight. Before Werdum, Overeem never really had one win over a real top level Heavyweight. Brock's had better wins in his 7 fights at HW than Overeem has in the division.  I've covered the cardio thing before. We've agreed that Lesnar's cardio isn't really 100% proven but we know for a fact Overeem's is shit. He's gassed in fights he's been winning so I think if Brock can put his weight on him for a round or so he'll likely be knackered.  I also don't see Overeem stopping Lesnar's takedowns. This was a man who was taken down frequently at 205 if I remember right. Sure he's bigger now but bigger doesn't neccessarily = great takedown defense. And he's never fought a wrestler as big and accomplished as Lesnar.  Now, on the ground I definitely don't think Overeem's crap. He's got plenty of submissions on his MMA record and done well in grappling competitions so I'd actually say he's a better grappler than people think. But if/when it goes to the ground he's likely to be on bottom with Lesnar on top of him. Mir's probably the best off his back at HW and he couldn't get nowt done under Brock in their rematch. I doubt Overeem's as good as Mir off his back either.  One last thing. Like you say above Brock has been battered in his last 2 fights. He was able to come back from adversity to finish Shane Carwin which says a lot about his heart. I honestly don't recall a time where Overeem has come back from being in deep shit to win. He's probably MMA's best frontrunner imo but when it goes tits up he seems to mentally fold. The fight with Sergei Kharitonov in Hero's is probably the best example of this where he literally just turned away and ran from Sergei when it got rough.  All that aside, I'm by no means counting The Reem out. As dangerous as Mir is early with submissions, Overeem is the striker's equivolent. I could easily see him putting Brock away with strikes or even catching him in his dreaded guillotine. The question of if Brock will panick is valid too. The loss to Mir could be put down to a rookie mistake and he could take comfort in saying "I was winning till I got caught". The Cain loss was different. Be interesting to see how he rebounds.  I'm going by the assumption that they'll both come in at 100% and if that's the case I think Brock will wear him down and win by TKO around the 3rd round with GnP.  We'll see what happens Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CurryAngel Posted December 23, 2011 Share Posted December 23, 2011 If Overeem is clever then he'd have spent the majority of his training on takedown defense. We know his striking is lethal for MMA and I'm also predicting him to probably batter Brock into retirement. Â Is this the last fight on Brocks contract or have I just made that up? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twelve_grand Posted December 23, 2011 Share Posted December 23, 2011 What are the odds on a WCW Steiner style chant of "steroooids, sterooooids" breaking out? It's almost like a Pride show the amount of drugs they're on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shane O' Mac Version 2 Posted December 23, 2011 Share Posted December 23, 2011 Except Lesnar tested clean, as has Overeem. But I'm sure they're just really great at cycling to avoid the random testing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rey_Piste Posted December 23, 2011 Share Posted December 23, 2011 If reem can keep it standing then he'll win, I just don't see it happening. Unless Reem gets an early KO, then he's going to get taken down and smashed into a fine paste. Reem is pretty poor off his back. He's been KOed by Shogun Rua, Chuck Liddell and Little Nog, neither of whom have the power of a guy like Lesnar. The majority of his wins are either in K1 or MMA wins against bums. If this fight was a healthy Carwin vs Reem then it would be competitive, but Brock whilst shit scared of being punched can survive a flurry of Carwin's big ol' paws to the noggin Reem aint going to do shit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Duke Posted December 23, 2011 Paid Members Share Posted December 23, 2011 Except Lesnar tested clean, as has Overeem. But I'm sure they're just really great at cycling to avoid the random testing. Yeah there was nothing fishy about all that testing was there? Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying he is or isn't on anything, but he hardly helped himself. Â and he's going in against the most feared striker in MMA. I wasn't aware brock was fighting anderson silva. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rey_Piste Posted December 23, 2011 Share Posted December 23, 2011 and he's going in against the most feared striker in MMA. I wasn't aware brock was fighting anderson silva. Reem aint no Silva, or Jon Jones or in the heavyweight division, Carwin, JDS, Big Nog or Fedor are guys I would put ahead of Overeem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
METAL ON METAL Posted December 23, 2011 Share Posted December 23, 2011 and he's going in against the most feared striker in MMA. I wasn't aware brock was fighting anderson silva. Reem aint no Silva, or Jon Jones or in the heavyweight division, Carwin, JDS, Big Nog or Fedor are guys I would put ahead of Overeem. Â Nog better at striking than Overeem? I'd even put Overeem above Fedor & Carwin in terms of stand-up, Carwin is so rigid with his technique. Â I'm with you, I can't see anything other than Overeem winning early. Brock could easily get caught in a nasty guillotine going for the takedown or if The Reem manages to stuff a couple of shots & keep it standing it wont take long at all. I'm thinking a highlight reel KO, like a big head kick early doors. Â That'd be the most idiotic thing that Overeem could do, he'll be susceptible enough to the takedown with both feet on the ground - never mind one leg. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rey_Piste Posted December 23, 2011 Share Posted December 23, 2011 and he's going in against the most feared striker in MMA. I wasn't aware brock was fighting anderson silva. Reem aint no Silva, or Jon Jones or in the heavyweight division, Carwin, JDS, Big Nog or Fedor are guys I would put ahead of Overeem. Â Nog better at striking than Overeem? I'd even put Overeem above Fedor & Carwin in terms of stand-up, Carwin is so rigid with his technique. Carwin is a power puncher. I know it's a cliche, but he does have one punch knockout power. Technique doesn't matter a lot when you have raw power like that. K-1 is different to MMA though, because in Muay Thai you have the light tip toe stance, which is no good when there's a chance of being taken down. I'd put Cro Cop and Dennis Siver above Overeem in his stand up when it comes to MMA. The only reason lots of people rate Reem's stand up is because of his success as a kickboxer and his current size, not because he's done that well in MMA. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimufctna24 Posted December 23, 2011 Share Posted December 23, 2011 im still interested to read how many people think Brock's going to win this, im willing to bet the house that he gets smashed within two rounds (i'd say 1, but im giving myself a little bit of room for error). I don't reallt know what people are basing their judgements on? Brock's had about a minute's success in his past two fights, the rest of the time he's been beaten up pretty bad, the guy's also coming off a 14 month layoff, and he's going in against the most feared striker in MMA. Brock's gonna come in paniced (is that a word?), sloppy and he's gonna get laid out. Brock's fought the same his entire career and coming off such a long lay off he's going to be even worse, especially considering who he's fighting.  If the Werdum fight hadn't happened i'm liable to think that The 'Reem would be a bigger favorite to win, but his stock unfairly dropped after that fight and everyone's kinda of buying into this shit that he's rubbish on the ground, which he isn't.  Overeem by destruction. I am not ruling out a Overeem win, I am 50/50 but you are overlooking things.  Brock has taken down everyone he has faced and bar Cain and Couture when he has taken them down he has kept them there, taking down Carwin and Cain who bar Cormier are the best Heavyweight wrestlers in MMA in impressive stuff.  Overeem is not rubbish on the ground but he is a league below some of the fighters Lesnar has mauled like Frank Mir. Mir I would guess is a better wrestler, grappler and submission artist than Overeem, yes Overeem maybe a bit stronger, but when you look at how easily Brock tooled Carwin and Mir when he got on top of them, it does not bode well for Overeem. Unless Overeem has aquired some top level takedown defence like JDS displayed against Carwin, he is in big trouble.  Brock looks in great shape, his trainer summed it up when he said he looked in "Frank Mir 2" shape. He is bulkier and has zero distractions unlike Overeem. Brock will face some scary moments if the fight stays standing, there is little to no chance he can win that game, but unless Overeem can scramble or sprawl when Brock gets him down, he could do serious damage and finish inside two rounds.  Overeem looked like shit compared to his hype in the Werdum fight, the reason? I am inclined to agree with Meltzer that he cannot use PED as much in the States unlike in Japan and Holland, he has to cycle them in order to be caught red handed with testing. He loses a lot of his explosiveness and firepower which he displayed in K1 and Dream.  On the subject of this, the countdown show was the best the UFC has produced ever along with the UFC 100 countdown and Sonnen vs Silva, cracking stuff.  EDIT: Wandshogun summed up the difference in MMA oppenents as well, Werdum is a style made for Overeem and who else has he actually beat in HW MMA? Rogers and Dufee both who are outside the top 20 most likely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twelve_grand Posted December 23, 2011 Share Posted December 23, 2011 Except Lesnar tested clean, as has Overeem. But I'm sure they're just really great at cycling to avoid the random testing. Â And father christmas is the one that delivers your presents. Boxing and mma are disgracefully policed in terms of drug testing. Â In a story that gets stranger by the week, Alistair Overeem Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
METAL ON METAL Posted December 23, 2011 Share Posted December 23, 2011 Except Lesnar tested clean, as has Overeem. But I'm sure they're just really great at cycling to avoid the random testing. Â And father christmas is the one that delivers your presents. Boxing and mma are disgracefully policed in terms of drug testing. Â In a story that gets stranger by the week, Alistair Overeem Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.