Mr_Danger Posted April 9, 2021 Share Posted April 9, 2021 3 hours ago, quote the raven said: Ok I have a real issue with falcon and the winter solider it’s going to contain spoilers including this weeks eps so I will stick it the box Hide contents So everyone is horrified that zemo killed the scientist, and that new cap kills the terrorist/freedom fighter.....however in eps1 Sam killed like 20 guys kicking them out of helicopters, blowing up said helicopter. Shooting them dead . They all killed a bunch of guys outside the storage locker in lots of different ways no one cares. It’s bugging the shit outa me now. Spoiler You’re right to an extent and they should never make an issue out of henchman getting killed by the good guys because of the obvious hypocrisy but knock off Cap’ bludgeoning a cowering man with the shield is a bit different from Sam killing bad guys in active combat. Zemo (the shows MVP) killing anyone is on Sam and Bucky for breaking him out so has a bit more consequence. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members quote the raven Posted April 10, 2021 Paid Members Share Posted April 10, 2021 (edited) 8 hours ago, Mr_Danger said: Reveal hidden contents You’re right to an extent and they should never make an issue out of henchman getting killed by the good guys because of the obvious hypocrisy but knock off Cap’ bludgeoning a cowering man with the shield is a bit different from Sam killing bad guys in active combat. Zemo (the shows MVP) killing anyone is on Sam and Bucky for breaking him out so has a bit more consequence. Spoiler So if he had beheaded him with his shield 5 minutes earlier during the fight it would have been fine. Yet the show try’s to make you feel bad for him as he might have had a valid reason for being a bad guy. All the while Sam is murdering multiple people without even giving it a thought due to him deeming them as definitely bad guys. The same goes for Bucky, he killed 7 guys while under mind control classes them as fodder as they where “bad” then he shots one guy he deems as an innocent and has a breakdown. It would lead you to believe that once he broke his programming he remembered doing it and traced the guys dad. So by that logic he must have traced all the guys in that scene and been "meh" they where bad guys. Or didn't even bother on account they had guns, They lose any moral high ground in condemning anyone. Also in civil war was stark not ready to kill a downed injured and armless bucky? for the death of his parents? Had cap not stopped him? Edited April 10, 2021 by quote the raven Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Hannibal Scorch Posted April 10, 2021 Paid Members Share Posted April 10, 2021 55 minutes ago, quote the raven said: Reveal hidden contents So if he had beheaded him with his shield 5 minutes earlier during the fight it would have been fine. Yet the show try’s to make you feel bad for him as he might have had a valid reason for being a bad guy. All the while Sam is murdering multiple people without even giving it a thought due to him deeming them as definitely bad guys. The same goes for Bucky, he killed 7 guys while under mind control classes them as fodder as they where “bad” then he shots one guy he deems as an innocent and has a breakdown. It would lead you to believe that once he broke his programming he remembered doing it and traced the guys dad. So by that logic he must have traced all the guys in that scene and been "meh" they where bad guys. Or didn't even bother on account they had guns, They lose any moral high ground in condemning anyone. Also in civil war was stark not ready to kill a downed injured and armless bucky? for the death of his parents? Had cap not stopped him? How do you feel about Man of Steel then? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr_Danger Posted April 10, 2021 Share Posted April 10, 2021 Or every superhero film ever. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members quote the raven Posted April 10, 2021 Paid Members Share Posted April 10, 2021 (edited) 1 hour ago, Hannibal Scorch said: How do you feel about Man of Steel then? Superman killing loads of people by proxy fighting zod? or him killing zod? However if you want to ask about batman killing in BVS? I have no issues with it until you work out that joker killed robin in that timeline and batman let him live Which then makes no sense what so ever. Spoiler I have no issues with heroes killing bad guys at all. The issue i have is they are making a huge deal that new cap just killed a wanted terrorist that had a hand in killing loads of people in a factory that was also a pumped up super solider and how utterly evil it is and how hes now a super bad guy. When the heros have been butchering every bad guy they have meet since the start. The only difference is possibly this guy might have a semi decent motive for being a bad guy and people where around to see him killing him. I dont think any other superhero movie has done it like this but happy to be corrected. Edited April 10, 2021 by quote the raven Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr_Danger Posted April 10, 2021 Share Posted April 10, 2021 (edited) Spoiler Come on, the guy was laying defenceless and Captain America caved his skull in. That’s not even the ‘killed by collateral damage’ that people might have a problem suspending disbelief for. The good guys don’t do that. Killing people actively trying to kill other people is an accepted standard in that universe. @quote the raven Edited April 10, 2021 by Mr_Danger Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith Houchen Posted April 10, 2021 Share Posted April 10, 2021 6 hours ago, Hannibal Scorch said: How do you feel about Man of Steel then? It’s absolute garbage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DavidB6937 Posted April 10, 2021 Share Posted April 10, 2021 11 minutes ago, Keith Houchen said: It’s absolute garbage. The best thing about Man of Steel was the trailer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr_Danger Posted April 17, 2021 Share Posted April 17, 2021 (edited) Weird damp squib of an episode this week for the Falcon and the Winter Soldier. Seemed like it was an exercise in ticking off boxes. Naughty Captain America,Zemo, tie up racism stuff, fix up boat, become mates, training montage. None of it felt like it wasn’t crowbarred in either. Anthony Mackie has been very good throughout though and if nothing else this series has peaked my interest in his take on being Cap’. Oh yeah, Julia Louis-Dreyfus! Edited April 17, 2021 by Mr_Danger Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members chokeout Posted April 17, 2021 Paid Members Share Posted April 17, 2021 It's the drawback of trying to structure it more like a 6 hour film than a TV series, you aren't getting build up to a finale every episode.the opening fight was great and Wyatt Russell is showing some great acting chops but the change in pace was very jarring, I'm assuming next week will be the big fighty marvel ending, with a tease at the new lad becoming Falcon 2 and the mentions of the Raft have to be leading to Thunderbolts at some point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Hannibal Scorch Posted April 17, 2021 Paid Members Share Posted April 17, 2021 I didn’t think any Marvel show would do a more 80’s inspired episode better then Wandavision. But between the dynamic between Sam and Bucky and the training montage, they did. I actually thought this was a better episode then 2 & 3 and am now invested in the season finale. But to be honest, I’m most looking forward to Loki still Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr_Danger Posted April 17, 2021 Share Posted April 17, 2021 No way was it better than episode 3! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CavemanLynn Posted April 17, 2021 Share Posted April 17, 2021 8 hours ago, chokeout said: It's the drawback of trying to structure it more like a 6 hour film than a TV series I slate Zack Snyder for not editing things down but at least he dumps the whole thing out as one package rather than stretching things even thinner and trying to call it a series. There's a really solid 2-3 hour made-for-streaming movie in Falcon and Winter Soldier, but it's buried somewhere in a 6 hour run time. Apart from the opening fight which was really quality, the most bonkers part of this episode was that the opening recap played scenes out of broadcast order and everything made SO much more sense. This show should've been Zemo breaking himself out of prison after seeing Walker given the shield by the US government, then Sam and Bucky chasing him all over Madripoor with Sam trying to stop him killing people on the way to the uncovering the history of the serum while Bucky tried to stop himself killing people. Instead it's been a drawn out illogical slog, with muddy motivations, inconsistent time-line, random tonal shifts, tell-not-show exposition and literal Big Theme discussion, and underwritten or rewritten side characters. And worst of all, it just hasn't been fun. For all the hype about it being a Marvel take on the buddy cop theme, it's been really dour and anemic. Everyone seems really tired or confused. Definitely a Marvel misfire, for me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members chokeout Posted April 19, 2021 Paid Members Share Posted April 19, 2021 (edited) Not the best first trailer but colour me intrigued to see how they retcon the Mandarin stuff after Iron Man 3 and the one shot. Also. I'm not one for OTT fan theories but this video raises some very good points about re-edits to remove a plot line From Falcon and the Winter soldier which would explain some of the crappy reasoning to the Flag smashers and some of the dodgy pacing issues. Edited April 19, 2021 by chokeout Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members BigJag Posted April 21, 2021 Paid Members Share Posted April 21, 2021 I just startedd watching this. Going into it cold. Unfamiliar with the characters. Has anyone else been watching it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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