Random thoughts thread v2 *NO NEWS ITEMS*

[tiger_rick]

Thought I’d stick with 2002 Smackdown after enjoying the first show of Steph’s reign so much. The next one was August 1^st 2002.

 

It started with a shit-hot opener between Mysterio and Tajiri. It holds up really well. You get matches this good all the time these days but they don’t feel as good as this because this is between two guys you can really buy into. The commentary is noticeably good too. Cole and Tazz were a great duo and Cole in particular is so much better than the shill machine we hear these days.

 

Lesnar destroys Mark Henry who is a smiley babyface. Then it’s Hogan vs. Angle just for the right to meet Lesnar. Imagine that these days? Someone being over enough that two other guys fighting for a shot at him feels important. Angle drags a decent ten minuter out of Hulk who holds up his end well in fairness. Before the match Lesnar tells both guys he hopes they win. Noticed that Heyman is very much in the background here. Not like now. In some nice subtle heel work, for all his bluster, Lesnar makes sure he’ll face Hulk. This keeps Angle & Lesnar apart too. Smart stuff.

 

Running through the show is the Raw vs. SD dynamic. It’s revealed that last week’s cliffhanger ending of someone defecting was Jericho & the Unamericans. No loss. The corresponding Raw is missing from the Network for some reason. Bischoff turns up and gets thrown out. Stacy Kiebler, who is fucking stunning, gets a bollocking from Steph and then smiles cunningly when Steph leaves.

 

Couple of throwaway matches before the main event. Rikishi beats Rev. Devon despite tons of interference. Devon was never getting over strong here. Batista batters Rikishi after the bell. Nice spot where Devon does the “Wassup” headbutt and Rikishi just lifts his leg and lets him dive into his giant arse. Cena vs. Rico is painless. Cena’s wearing baby blue despite being in the midst of a bit of a push. He’d somehow survive the curse.

 

Before the main event which has been very clearly teased as Edge vs. The Rock, Steph says she meant Edge AND The Rock. Bischoff has made his way to ringside with a ticket and has a front row seat as Steph announces she’s stolen Eddie G and the IC Champ Death Row Chris from Raw. Bischoff goes apeshit and security dragging him off. Eric is gold here.

 

In an eerie line, with hindsight, Cole says “Bischoff looks like he’s seen not one but two ghosts” as Guerrero and Benoit walk down the ramp. Eddie’s mullet with highlights is fucking epic. He’s noticeably pumped from his WCW days but not as jacked as he’d be a couple of years later when he was in the World Title picture. Lesnar gets involved in a distraction and The Rock taps out to Benoit. Unlike Seth Rollins getting beat every week as champ, this felt big.

 

Another cracking show.

Edited November 9, 2015 by tiger_rick

[DraxSpago]

I remember The Rock tapping as Lesnar smiles at him from outside the ring as being a great moment, just one of those little things WWE has always done really well

 

Surprised D-Von was losing to Rikishi though, wasn't it not long before this he beat Triple H (admittedly with interference)?

[Statto]

Cena’s wearing baby blue despite being in the midst of a bit of a push. He’d somehow survive the curse.

 

Back in the day when Cena had tonnes and tonnes of different sets of gear in different colours, he'd often wear colours corresponding to a local sports team, one I remember vividly was a purple & gold set in Minnesota.

 

A quick Google tells me that Smackdown was in Charlotte, NC - the University of North Carolina Tar Heels wear a sky/baby blue (Carolina blue, technically) and white uniforms.

 

I wonder what happened to all of Cena's gear? He must have spent an absolute fortune on stuff that was worn once or twice on TV, then dumped it all when the rapper gimmick came along.

Edited November 9, 2015 by Statto

[Your Fight Site]

I wonder what happened to all of Cena's gear? He must have spent an absolute fortune on stuff that was worn once or twice on TV, then dumped it all when the rapper gimmick came along.

 

In the back of his walk-in closet I imagine.

[tiger_rick]

 

Cena’s wearing baby blue despite being in the midst of a bit of a push. He’d somehow survive the curse.

 

Back in the day when Cena had tonnes and tonnes of different sets of gear in different colours, he'd often wear colours corresponding to a local sports team, one I remember vividly was a purple & gold set in Minnesota.

 

A quick Google tells me that Smackdown was in Charlotte, NC - the University of North Carolina Tar Heels wear a sky/baby blue (Carolina blue, technically) and white uniforms.

 

I wonder what happened to all of Cena's gear? He must have spent an absolute fortune on stuff that was worn once or twice on TV, then dumped it all when the rapper gimmick came along.

 

 

I've not seen the whole of the next episode but Cena was in the opening match in the baby blue again. Richmond, Virginia. Does that fit?

[Statto]

No, not so much... There's no professional sports in Virginia, and the major college sports teams would be the Virginia Cavaliers, who wear orange and blue or Virginia Tech Hokies, who are maroon and orange...

 

A couple of the more minor colleges (Richmond Spiders and Old Dominion Monarchs) wear DARK blues... but it's still a no.

 

Just as an addition, it's made me recall noticing when I went to a couple of WWE events a few years back that they sold the basic plastic Rey Mysterio masks (the elastic-round-the-back type) in local colours - in Birmingham, AL the choice was crimson & white (for the Crimson Tide) or orange & blue (for Aub*rn), and in Memphis it was orange & white (for the Volunteers) or dark & light blue (for the Tennessee Titans). Always thought that was clever.

[Mr.Showtime]

I've been working through the 2003 SmackDowns which are just great. Three SmackDown episodes in a row, you get all this: a rough and bloody Cena/Eddie match in El Paso, a Big Show/Lesnar/Taker triple-threat #1 contendership, Angle vs the winner, Vince forcing his own daughter into a match with Brock Lesnar, Lesnar kidnapping Zach Gowen, the Cena/Eddie parking lot brawl, Rhyno goring Benoit through a locker room door outta absolute nowhere, and the Angle/Lesnar 60-minute Iron Man match. And plenty of Torrie Wilson, Sable and Dawn Marie. Just brilliant.

[tiger_rick]

Just been reminded in another thread of a bit I missed from my comments on the 01/08/02 Smackdown. Jamie Noble comes out with his newly won Cruiserweight title and cuts a good cheap heat promo. then has Nidia sexually assault Michael Cole so they'll get favourable commentary. It's brilliant. Noble was so good in that character. Him saying "We don't mess with Tazz because he's one of them there street thugs" cracked me up.

[Mr.Showtime]

Jamie Noble and Nidia were amazing, I almost tuned in every week just to see what they'd say next. He barely had a below-average match either, given the short times the cruiserweights would often get.

[FUM]

It surely can't be just me who notices a lisp whenever they have a panel on pay per views?

[tiger_rick]

Smackdown August 8th 2002

 

Cena vs. Angle right out of the blocks. One of thos matches booked just so they can turn it into a six man tag later. It leads in the second hour to Benoit, Guerrero and Angle vs. Mysterio, Cena and Edge. It's the original Smackdown six! Before they lost interest in Cena. The six man is standard tag team fare with the heels getting all the heat before  hot tag to Edge who was definitely the guy at this point. They then all hit a bunch of big moves, dives and finishers in a shit hot two or three minutes. Guerrero's brain buster is absolutely beautiful. Rey pins Angle who throws a brilliant tantrum and then cuts his magnificently distraught "I just got pinned by a freaking twelve year old" promo backstage.

Devon gets beat by Mark Henry. Same formula. Batista interferes but Devon loses anyway. Batista batters Henry. Only this time Rikishi comes down setting up an impromptu match with Batista. Big 'kish wins after Devon decks Big Dave. No idea how these two didn't get over? Tazz says Mark Henry can dunk a basketball. His one bit of info on MH!

Lesnar goes into Hogan's dressing room and ends up turning the main event into a match for his title shot. There are signs that Heyman can't contain Lesnar with Lesnar asking if he trusts him. Just little stuff that would eventually lead to Heyman's turn. The camera swings from Hogan's dressing room straight into a Nidia/Torrie Wilson catfight. I miss this backstage stuff.

Hurrican & Moore beat Billy & Chuck. Boring filler. Another observation versus the modern day though. Rico enters the ring and gets chucked over the top rope but there's no DQ. Same happened with Batista last week. Certain that would be a DQ these days. Then i was OK to cause a major distraction if you didn't hit the other guy.

It's confirmed that Kiebler is on Bischoff's side as she connives to get some documents off Dawn Marie. Stacey is really good here as she was last time with her wicked smile. Sadly it's one of those dodgy "no one on the show watches the show" angles as Steph apologises for the previous week when she should have been even more wary. I hate this.

 

Nidia & Noble beating Kidman & Wilson is filler shite. Nidia's fucking great isn't she? Not pretty but not ugly and absolutely filthy. You would.

Hogan vs. Lesnar feels like it should be on PPV. The stare down is tremendous. I don't think I'll ever get used to the thirty years Hogan ages as soon as the bandana falls off though. This is a terrific match. It's the absolute beauty of pro-wrestling. There's barely a bump but it's fascinating and Lesnar nicely puts Hogan on his level before taking over with some cheating. I've never found Hogan an interesting watch in the ring but matches like this are why you could never say he isn't a great worker. This is the show where Lesnar leaves Hogan a bloody mess. So unusual at the time. This made Lesnar for me.

Couple more observations vs. modern day. The first one isn't mine, someone on here mentioned it a while ago but there are so many heel tactics on display compared to modern shows. Almost every heel has a manager or an enforcer which leads to loads of distraction and intereference and in general there is just so much more dirty work. That really helps with the crowd heat.

 

Secondly, they aren't afraid to book heels strong. Last week, The Rock tapped to Benoit. This week Lesnar squeezed the life out of Hogan and Hulk's arm dropped three times. Thy wouldn't do that now and if they did, the face would win the post-match brawl. Here Lesnar beat Hogan with a bear hug after an F5 and then bloodied him afterwards. So much heat on the big bastard.

[Powerful_Fox]

Kurt Angle did an interview with the Nottingham post (source), one of the things discussed was his idea of kayfabe needing to return to wrestling

 

"I think it would be good to go back to kayfabe. When you lifted the curtain and showed people backstage it was new and intriguing, but if you go back to how it was, it could be the change wrestling needs.”.

 

It got me wondering if he was being a bit naive or if other people believe it is possible to go back to this methodology? I personally think that it is surely a case of closing the door before the horse has bolted. Especially in this day and age with the modern outlet of news, media etc. People are no longer relying solely on dirtsheets, which were in limited circulation. How could people just unlearn everything? It would take at least a whole generation, and would it even be worth the effort?

[MVP RULZ]

Kayfabe is dead and there is surely no way wrestling can return to the sort of secrecy it had back in the past up till the mid90's before the curtain was starting to fall down and now with social media and the internet there can be no way to return to those days, unless every wrestling fan got amnesia and just forgot everything we've learned.

 

Kayfabe these days is just for the kids more then anything, whilst some adults obviosuly know more about the backstage goings on etc then just the casual adult watching but even they know its scripted and what they are watching is a form of entertainment as opposed to a real fight

[tiger_rick]

You'll never get Kayfabe back but I think they could make more of an effort to decide what they are. If they're a TV show, then they shouldn't be running house shows, the talent shouldn't be running their own Twitter accounts and the characters in the show should be completely separate to the people.

 

If they're not, then they should be presenting realistic characters based on people's real lives that they live and breath day in and day out.

 

I don't think you can have it both ways in the modern world. You can't have a self contained TV show in front of a live audience where the characters also work in front of other live audiences but also Tweet, go on TV and are featured on the Network, etc out of character. It's a right mess. Although it's plain to see why they'd rather have a right mess than have people on TV using their real persona. *cough* Benoit *cough*

[Ant]

Imagine a show with the wrestlers really being themselves. Itching for an end to the wellness policy, at least for recreationals, chasing questionable skirt, stabbing each other in the back.