Minor news items that don't deserve a thread

[Sergio Mendacious]

I never even clocked Ryan "Silverback" Reeves, possibly because I have a workmate with the last name Ryback. Che Ryback.

[AshC]

I can't believe the way things have gone for him. Even as recently as the April tour, there were hundreds upon hundreds of kids with Ryback shirts. The closest I've seen to rivalling John Cena in recent times.

[Onyx2]

The other possibility is that he was clocked being a proper 'bully' heel on Twitter and WWE have dropped the gimmick. Doesn't quite mesh with the "BE A *" promo.

 

His tweet comebacks were pretty good most of the time.

[TheShowOff]

Jeremy Deller, an artist who takes inspiration from Adrian Street' was on Hardtalk on BBC News yesterday. He has done a documentary on Street and that photo is the centre point of his latest exhibition by all accounts too

 

From about 18m 41s in http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b03lt..._Deller_Artist/

 

Excerpt of his Adrian Street Biog: http://vimeo.com/55603074

I saw the documentary in one of the museums in Manchester, they have it playing on a loop alongside a couple of Street's ring robes. Nothing fantastic, but a fun watch.

 

I saw it at Embankment, I thought it was rotten. It looked like it was made on Windows Movie Maker and just had footage lifted from TWC (complete with logo in top right corner). Was cool to see some of the ring gear though, I guess.

[FLips]

Ryback for me will go down as the biggest missed opportunity this generation. He went from white hot to shit within months and it wasn't even his doing.

[Van Dammer]

Whilst I agree with the argument that they wasted the opportunity with Ryback, although you could argue that that white-hot period was only due to them pushing him way too fast, which was ultimately what brought him back down to earth with such a bang.

 

The thing is, does anyone actually believe Ryback could have been a genuine star? Is it possible that he was lucky that they even gave him that short period in the main event? I just dont see anything in the guy that pushes him beyond mid card. He cant talk, he hasnt had a single match that I would consider memorable and all he really has is his size. Is this not just his natural position in the card? A bit like Kane I can see him just having short spells in his career where hes pushed back into the main event and title picture and then dropping back down to be a stepping stone for other talent.

[Vamp]

Whilst I agree with the argument that they wasted the opportunity with Ryback, although you could argue that that white-hot period was only due to them pushing him way too fast, which was ultimately what brought him back down to earth with such a bang.

 

The thing is, does anyone actually believe Ryback could have been a genuine star? Is it possible that he was lucky that they even gave him that short period in the main event? I just dont see anything in the guy that pushes him beyond mid card. He cant talk, he hasnt had a single match that I would consider memorable and all he really has is his size. Is this not just his natural position in the card? A bit like Kane I can see him just having short spells in his career where hes pushed back into the main event and title picture and then dropping back down to be a stepping stone for other talent.

 

With the way the WWE audiences are nowadays you don't get white hot over from being pushed too fast unless you have something about you. Ryback didn't just have his size, he had a connection with the audience too. And that's not easy to get now.

 

Besides, the stupidity (perhaps a little harsh) of the decision was that they didn't have anything to gain from Ryback losing. He barely got to shine before having his heat taken away from him as well. Most of the match seemed to consist of Punk outsmarting Ryback who just looked like an idiot.

[Sergio Mendacious]

Ring Side Confessions Tumblr

 

Has this been roundly mocked here? It's the best.

[IANdrewDiceClay]

The thing is, does anyone actually believe Ryback could have been a genuine star?

All the people who bought that Hell in a Cell PPV seemed to. The reason he got over was because he caught on with the people in a time when they desperately needed a new hero to cheer. Ryback had been on TV since April and getting little reaction outside of the Goldberg chants. He was squashing jobbers and doing nothing. Then this big steroid freak stuck his nose in the top storyline and people went nuts for it. Perception wise and business wise they seemed to have a hit on their hands. And then they beat him for months and now he's just some bald bloke called Ryan on twitter who's only interesting feature is that he stalks Phoenix Marie on there.

 

And comparing him to Kane isn't something you can do. Kane was a monster, became a regular working with the top names of the day and became a part of the furniture. Ryback beat nobodies, got elevated into the main events where he lost all the time and now he's in the dog house. They killed the bloke using every trick you can to tear someones whole character down. He's more comparable to the Shockmaster than Kane.

Edited December 20, 2013 by IANdrewDiceClay

[Van Dammer]

The thing is, does anyone actually believe Ryback could have been a genuine star?

All the people who bought that Hell in a Cell PPV seemed to. The reason he got over was because he caught on with the people in a time when they desperately needed a new hero to cheer. Ryback had been on TV since April and getting little reaction outside of the Goldberg chants. He was squashing jobbers and doing nothing. Then this big steroid freak stuck his nose in the top storyline and people went nuts for it. Perception wise and business wise they seemed to have a hit on their hands. And then they beat him for months and now he's just some bald bloke called Ryan on twitter who's only interesting feature is that he stalks Phoenix Marie on there.

 

And comparing him to Kane isn't something you can do. Kane was a monster, became a regular working with the top names of the day and became a part of the furniture. Ryback beat nobodies, got elevated into the main events where he lost all the time and now he's in the dog house. They killed the bloke using every trick you can to tear someones whole character down. He's more comparable to the Shockmaster than Kane.

 

So, youre saying everyone who bought HIAC bought it because they bought Ryback as the new genuine star? Ryback was irrelevant to the buy rate, it did your average nothing PPV buyrate of 200k or so and it would have done if it was CM Punk vs anybody else that they could have put in that spot purely to deputise for the injured Cena for a month or two.

[Nick Soapdish]

had never seen this until just now!

[TheShowOff]

The thing is, does anyone actually believe Ryback could have been a genuine star?

All the people who bought that Hell in a Cell PPV seemed to. The reason he got over was because he caught on with the people in a time when they desperately needed a new hero to cheer. Ryback had been on TV since April and getting little reaction outside of the Goldberg chants. He was squashing jobbers and doing nothing. Then this big steroid freak stuck his nose in the top storyline and people went nuts for it. Perception wise and business wise they seemed to have a hit on their hands. And then they beat him for months and now he's just some bald bloke called Ryan on twitter who's only interesting feature is that he stalks Phoenix Marie on there.

 

And comparing him to Kane isn't something you can do. Kane was a monster, became a regular working with the top names of the day and became a part of the furniture. Ryback beat nobodies, got elevated into the main events where he lost all the time and now he's in the dog house. They killed the bloke using every trick you can to tear someones whole character down. He's more comparable to the Shockmaster than Kane.

 

So, youre saying everyone who bought HIAC bought it because they bought Ryback as the new genuine star? Ryback was irrelevant to the buy rate, it did your average nothing PPV buyrate of 200k or so and it would have done if it was CM Punk vs anybody else that they could have put in that spot purely to deputise for the injured Cena for a month or two.

 

People sure as hell weren't buying for Kofi vs The Miz. The thing is, unlike the vast majority of PPV's this had something unique about it: somebody new in the main event scene who looked the part. People were intrigued and genuinely interested to see how the match would go, something which can't be said for many PPV events. Calling Ryback "White Hot" is a hell of an overstatement, but he was certainly in a position where a spark could have created a fire. Does this mean him winning the belt? No. But the manner of which the match ended was like a wet fart for him. The booking in the months after was even worse.

[IANdrewDiceClay]

So, youre saying everyone who bought HIAC bought it because they bought Ryback as the new genuine star? Ryback was irrelevant to the buy rate, it did your average nothing PPV buyrate of 200k or so and it would have done if it was CM Punk vs anybody else that they could have put in that spot purely to deputise for the injured Cena for a month or two.

Of course it wouldn't. It was the biggest drawing B show in the US since Cena vs Lesnar. Ryback got the credit because there was a significant spike in terms of what the PPV was expected to do before he became involved. Punk vs Ryback did a few thousand less in the US than bringing back Brock Lesnar. Is that average? Hell in the Cell was looking at doing 110,000 domestically, and that was based on the gimmick alone. It also beat CM Punk vs John Cena from Money in the Bank 2011. How is that average? If CM Punk would have drawn that against anyone, why didn't he draw that number against the companies biggest star, when he was at his height, in his hometown going for the WWE title in a match 50 times more hyped? Ryback came into a PPV with an undefeated streak, hugely over and people bought the PPV to see if he'd win the belt. Were you actually watching wrestling at the time? He had a load of momentum which lead to people buying a pay-per-view.

 

Also it drew 200,000 and it was on Sky Sports. WWE's second biggest market saw it for free. Hardly "average nothing PPV" material.

Edited December 22, 2013 by IANdrewDiceClay

[Van Dammer]

So, youre saying everyone who bought HIAC bought it because they bought Ryback as the new genuine star? Ryback was irrelevant to the buy rate, it did your average nothing PPV buyrate of 200k or so and it would have done if it was CM Punk vs anybody else that they could have put in that spot purely to deputise for the injured Cena for a month or two.

Of course it wouldn't. It was the biggest drawing B show in the US since Cena vs Lesnar. Ryback got the credit because there was a significant spike in terms of what the PPV was expected to do before he became involved. Punk vs Ryback did a few thousand less in the US than bringing back Brock Lesnar. Is that average? Hell in the Cell was looking at doing 110,000 domestically, and that was based on the gimmick alone. It also beat CM Punk vs John Cena from Money in the Bank 2011. How is that average? If CM Punk would have drawn that against anyone, why didn't he draw that number against the companies biggest star, when he was at his height, in his hometown going for the WWE title in a match 50 times more hyped? Ryback came into a PPV with an undefeated streak, hugely over and people bought the PPV to see if he'd win the belt. Were you actually watching wrestling at the time? He had a load of momentum which lead to people buying a pay-per-view.

 

Also it drew 200,000 and it was on Sky Sports. WWE's second biggest market saw it for free. Hardly "average nothing PPV" material.

 

It was the 2nd highest drawing B PPV of the year (although there not alot in it in the middle pack) but the HIAC PPV has generally drawn since it was introduced. Its also been the 2nd or 3rd highest drawing B PPV of the year and was even the highest drawing in 2009 with 300k buys. In other words, theres arguments both ways as to whether it was anything more than an ordinary draw at the time.

 

Yes I was watching at the time, I remember it was generally a pretty exciting time for the WWE with Punks heel turn and his massive title reign starting to break records and the impending return of the Rock at the Rumble and people wondering who he would be facing. I'll never dispute that there was interest in Ryback being thrown into the mix and he was seen as a credible threat to Punks huge reign that nobody could see ending before the Rumble. I believe most of that interest was because they completely backed themselves into a corner and everyone knew they couldnt have Ryback holding the title when The Rock returned. The WWE fucked themselves in one way or the other by putting him in that match and everyone knew it.

 

My original question is whether anyone actually thinks Ryback could have been a genuine star in the long term? You said every single one of the 199,000 people who bought the PPV seemed, I dont believe that.

[IANdrewDiceClay]

Hell in a Cell didn't have Cena on it, who is always in main events. Punk vs Ryback was a new match with two wrestlers who weren't regularly closing shows you expect people to pay for. The fact they drew so many domestic buys is a minor miracle. Its not hard to create genuine stars if you get behind people who are over (which Ryback was). Its just that its been so long since WWE ran with someone without shitting on them, we all have forgot how someone actually becomes on. Fact is, he drew a big buyrate with someone who they didn't have confidence in going on last with anyone who wasn't John Cena. Then he lost his win streak, which was a big reason why he was over. Then he kept losing on PPV and by the time he'd turned heel every aspect of what makes you a genuine star had been exposed. All the signs pointed to Ryback breaking out as a stand alone draw who didn't need Cena on the cards to prop him up. Will we have seen him become a genuine star? I think yes. He likes to travel, he looks like a circus freak and he was over huge. He ticked all the boxes they like in a Ultimate Warrior type attraction. Will we know for certain if he could have been a genuine star? No. Because they fucked him up beyond repair. They should have had Iron Sheik pull a fuck finish on Hogan in 1984. Or had Triple H pedigree Austin and roll Shawn Michaels on him in 1998. Or give Cena a run of semi-main defeats on PPV in 2004. Let's see how they'd have done.

Edited December 22, 2013 by IANdrewDiceClay