The Fortean/paranormal/conspiracy thread

[Egg Shen]

Is there a comprehensive Sandy Hook video? The one i remember watching came out just days after the shooting and cluthed at as many straws as it could. The biggest being the 'actors' brought in to play the victims parents.

[chokeout]

Is that the one that accused the parents of being actors and used footage of them laughing as proof? Snopes did a full breakdown of that video which makes for good reading.

Some of the reports of harassment to families involved in Sandy Hook by people who believe it was a false flag event are shocking. There's a very fine line between 'truth seeker' and having mental health problems in a lot of the cases.

[icke83]

 

Has there ever been a false flag that was actually proven to be such. And I mean openly and reliably by the public proven, not spenks on a forum or Youtube proven.

The Bay of Pigs invasion is a fairly well known one.

 

Germany made several attempts at false flag attacks to make the Polish look like they were a threat to justify them invading Poland in 1939.

 

Operation Northwoods and the Gulf of Tonkin incident also.

[Pinc]

 

 

Has there ever been a false flag that was actually proven to be such. And I mean openly and reliably by the public proven, not spenks on a forum or Youtube proven.

The Bay of Pigs invasion is a fairly well known one.

 

Germany made several attempts at false flag attacks to make the Polish look like they were a threat to justify them invading Poland in 1939.

 

Operation Northwoods and the Gulf of Tonkin incident also.

 

 

Northwoods was only proposed, though. Never carried out. And the Bay of Pigs was known to be a false flag in the days following the attack; it was never intended that the true nature of the attack would be kept secret indefinitely, as the alleged Sandy Hook/September 11 false flags must have been.

[icke83]

Northwoods does demonstrate an intention amongst high ranking US Government and Military officials to cause harm to the American public though. Which is why I don't understand why it is beyond some people to entertain the possibility that 9/11 was perpetrated by these same, or similar, offices within the same government a generation later.

Edited September 30, 2015 by icke83

[Egg Shen]

Is that the one that accused the parents of being actors and used footage of them laughing as proof? Snopes did a full breakdown of that video which makes for good reading.

 

yeh that's the one. The lad i work with who hops on every conspiracy video holds that video as the definitive proof that Sandy Hook was a false flag operation.

 

The same lad was quick to hop on the bandwagon that the plane that came down on the motorway a few weeks back was shot down by a drone...he quickly shut up when it was quickly established that it was just a terrible accident.

 

One of the craziest examples of the people believing anything was shortly after the horrible Lee Rigby murder a few years ago, a video was posted on youtube that accused it of being a staged attack and that no murder had actually been carried out. The video pointed at the strange colour of the blood on the knife and the murderers hands. A lot of comments underneath were from conspiracy nuts who were quick to believe everything they were being fed. The video itself had simply been run through a colour filter than made everything look a strange colour. Just bonkers.

[chokeout]

The Snopes article. Although it is in no way definitive it does show how easy so much of the conspiracy stuff is to debunk.

 

http://www.snopes.com/politics/guns/newtown.asp

Edited September 30, 2015 by chokeout

[icke83]

Would be interesting to see what Snopes has to say about Operation Northwoods/Gulf of Tonkin or other false flags which are in the public record. I read the Operation Northwoods documentation was first released in 1997 and it's interesting that the documentation surrounding the suspicious death of Dr David Kelly is sealed for a number of years. It seems that documentation is sealed until the architects behind the event are dead and cannot be punished.

This is a good article by Thomas Sheridan which asserts that conspiracy theories exist because mainstream journalists neglect their duties of conducting proper investigations http://thomassheridanofficialblog.blogspot.co.uk/2015/01/conspiracy-theory-exists-because.html

My understanding is that the rule of thumb in journalism is/was to find two sources before publishing a story. I find it very hard to believe that is how mainstream news outlets operate nowadays.

Edited September 30, 2015 by icke83

[icke83]

Not so much a conspiracy but more just how my mind works: when I saw that David Cameron said he doesn't have time to attempt to tackle/refute the allegations made about his past initiations involving pigs heads (and whatever else he got up to with his pals at the Bullingdon club) my immediate reaction is that he knows he wouldn't be able to disprove it in a court of law and so want's to limit the damage and not open up that can of worms. I find it hard to imagine he, or his staff, wouldn't pursue these allegations, if nothing else to send a message that they won't be tolerated, if he was able. And surely the guy who wrote the book wouldn't risk bankruptcy if No.10 did challenge it in court?

 

I just think there needs to be more critical thinking. Obviously there are nutcases who peddle ridiculous theories, just as there are comparable people who blindly follow the mainstream media's version of events, but tarring anyone who challenges the mainstream medias version of events, where there is documented proof that our governments don't always (if ever) have our best interests at heart (see also Aspartame approval http://www.rense.com/general33/legal.htm ) is counter productive.

Didn't mean that to sound like a rant, was just a general point

Edited September 30, 2015 by icke83

[Teedy Kay]

At least more than 2 minor injuries.

He was a skinny, sickly kid who wielded a heavy rifle & more ammo than a combat soldier like an expert marksman.

It's unheard of

Even the Coloumbine killers combined didn't have that much success

He was carrying an M4 variant that weighs fuck all and is EXCEPTIONALLY easy to accurately shoot, an M4 variant is the easiest carbine I've fired by a country mile. He also used a Glock, known to be pretty much a simple pistol with sod all kick.

 

Comparing it to Coloumbine is ridiculous, he attacked and killed predominantly 6 year olds being penned into toilets and the like ... fish in bucket comes to mind.

 

Coloumbine was a high school with teenagers who could think for themselves and plus the killers weapons were shit.

 

An expert marksman is trained to hit targets at long distances. Anyone, and I sincerely mean this through experience and knowledge of a magnitude of firearms, can pick up a decent 5.56mm carbine and shoot and hit, consistently, something the size of a small child from distances equating to the size a classroom.

 

Even if they are suffering from malnutrition.

Edited September 30, 2015 by Teedy Kay

[icke83]

Also I recommend checking out www.noagendashow.com it's not a conspiracy show by any means but it seems the best place to put it. Give it a go https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/No_Agenda

[kieranjennings]

Not so much a conspiracy but more just how my mind works: when I saw that David Cameron said he doesn't have time to attempt to tackle/refute the allegations made about his past initiations involving pigs heads (and whatever else he got up to with his pals at the Bullingdon club) my immediate reaction is that he knows he wouldn't be able to disprove it in a court of law and so want's to limit the damage and not open up that can of worms. I find it hard to imagine he, or his staff, wouldn't pursue these allegations, if nothing else to send a message that they won't be tolerated, if he was able. And surely the guy who wrote the book wouldn't risk bankruptcy if No.10 did challenge it in court?

 

I just think there needs to be more critical thinking. Obviously there are nutcases who peddle ridiculous theories, just as there are comparable people who blindly follow the mainstream media's version of events, but tarring anyone who challenges the mainstream medias version of events, where there is documented proof that our governments don't always (if ever) have our best interests at heart (see also Aspartame approval http://www.rense.com/general33/legal.htm ) is counter productive.

Didn't mean that to sound like a rant, was just a general point

The guy who wrote it is a multi billionaire who owns the publisher who published the book. I don't think Cameron would be able to match his funding in a long drawn out court case so fear of bankruptcy is definitely not an issue

[icke83]

 

Not so much a conspiracy but more just how my mind works: when I saw that David Cameron said he doesn't have time to attempt to tackle/refute the allegations made about his past initiations involving pigs heads (and whatever else he got up to with his pals at the Bullingdon club) my immediate reaction is that he knows he wouldn't be able to disprove it in a court of law and so want's to limit the damage and not open up that can of worms. I find it hard to imagine he, or his staff, wouldn't pursue these allegations, if nothing else to send a message that they won't be tolerated, if he was able. And surely the guy who wrote the book wouldn't risk bankruptcy if No.10 did challenge it in court?

 

I just think there needs to be more critical thinking. Obviously there are nutcases who peddle ridiculous theories, just as there are comparable people who blindly follow the mainstream media's version of events, but tarring anyone who challenges the mainstream medias version of events, where there is documented proof that our governments don't always (if ever) have our best interests at heart (see also Aspartame approval http://www.rense.com/general33/legal.htm ) is counter productive.

Didn't mean that to sound like a rant, was just a general point

The guy who wrote it is a multi billionaire who owns the publisher who published the book. I don't think Cameron would be able to match his funding in a long drawn out court case so fear of bankruptcy is definitely not an issue

 

Fair enough. Regardless, still strange response to me given the accusation(s).

[chokeout]

Would be interesting to see what Snopes has to say about Operation Northwoods/Gulf of Tonkin or other false flags which are in the public record.

 

This is a good article by Thomas Sheridan which asserts that conspiracy theories exist because mainstream journalists neglect their duties of conducting proper investigations http://thomassheridanofficialblog.blogspot.co.uk/2015/01/conspiracy-theory-exists-because.html

My understanding is that the rule of thumb in journalism is/was to find two sources before publishing a story. I find it very hard to believe that is how mainstream news outlets operate nowadays.

 

Probably nothing unless someone wrote easily disprovable rubbish about them.

 

The fact that so many people go looking for these elaborate schemes (which seem to have clues or stupid mistakes made so people know they are false flag events) rather than accept the very real problem that a man with mental health issue could legally gain access to a handgun and readily had access to a semi-automatic rifle (apologies if its fully automatic, i'm not massively up on gun models) The jump in logic that events like this are staged to give the government more gun control tells you all you need to know about the majority of people making these claims.

 

As far as the journalism point (FYI 'mainstream media' being used as a dismissive name is just silly, see also 'liberal media') Journalists need to be able to back up what they write legally. Them not reporting on chinese whispers, hearsay and internet lore has been covered in this thread before when Duane was rambling on about coverups. 

[King Coconut]

I don't understand why it is beyond some people to entertain the possibility that 9/11 was perpetrated by these same, or similar, offices within the same government a generation later.

 

I think I can safely say that anybody in this thread who has refuted that 9/11 was a false flag operation has definitely entertained the possibility. This is how critical thinking works. You entertain the possibility, research the allegations, study the evidence and then, and only then, do you dismiss it as bollocks.