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Who Killed WCW?


Merzbow

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Posted (edited)

So the first episode of this Dark Side adjacent show had been out for a few days now and every fucker not named Bret Hart is bullshitting on it for dramatic effect or to get themselves over even though their wrestling careers were over decades ago. But there's one person who's going to have me coming back each week and that's Brad Siegel! They've managed to get him as one of the talking heads and he's hilarious, they've also got Dick Cheatham and Teddy Turner, the son of Ted. These are the names I want to hear from, those behind the scenes in some way and who weren't part of the wrestling crowd.

Goldberg just blurting out that it was Russo who killed the company was a laugh though, as shit as I think Vince is he's probably not even in the top 20 reasons why.

Edited by Merzbow
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Posted (edited)

I heard the Lapsed Fan having a quick talk about the episode w/ the Nitro book guy which really heightened my interest a bit beforehand, and yeah same re the execs, had no idea they managed to get any of them so i'll be keeping with it. Don't think i'd have bothered if they hadn't got the 'outside' names. Negative interest in hearing Konnan, Nash, Booker or Count Bischoff talk. Was excellent seeing that old photo of Sonny Onoo though, and Bischoff trying on that stupid Ninja costume.

Loved Siegel's "they're ALL pathological liars!" introduction the most. Hoping there's a lot more of those rather than more Russo.

Edited by Cannibal Man
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Bret’s, “thanks for nothing, go fuck yourselves,” line was iconic. It must be exhausting always being so right about everything. And he was on Simpsons.

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6 hours ago, Cannibal Man said:

re The Rock, we need a talk about what he's got going on on his bottom half, I couldn't take him seriously knowing this was off camera

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Richard Herring there about to ask him whether he'd prefer to have a hand made out of ham or an armpit that dispenses suntan lotion.

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13 hours ago, Supremo said:

Bret’s, “thanks for nothing, go fuck yourselves,” line was iconic. It must be exhausting always being so right about everything. And he was on Simpsons.

I legit laughed out loud when Bret said that. I mean you could argue that Bret is a bit of an ingrate considering he was paid a fortune during his almost three years with the company but he nailed it regarding Bischoff basically allowing Hogan to do what he wanted. Bischoff also mentioned the same nonsense he said on his podcast regarding Sting showing up in the wrong frame of mind and blamed that for the terrible finish of the Starrcade 97 main event. 

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I haven't seen any of this, but I will bet a pound to a penny that no words from Bischoff are him taking any kind of responsibility for what happened. 

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24 minutes ago, Carbomb said:

I haven't seen any of this, but I will bet a pound to a penny that no words from Bischoff are him taking any kind of responsibility for what happened. 

Pretty much. 

For a guy I used to find alright, he's become my least favourite of the big wrestling grifters because his grift is essentially "Wrestling fans are the worst. God this is embarrassing." Which - hey - that's what makes it a grift I guess, but it's not like anyone's even lining up to place the blame squarely at his feet anymore. He may as well own up to at least a part of it. 

Was a decent watch. I groaned when it was announced because I feel like the whole wrestling unconscious is surely completely fatigued by Monday Night Warz lore but in fairness all they needed to pull me in was some fresh faces, and they done that with some of the Turner execs and Guy Evans. 

Good on him for becoming the de facto neutral WCW demise source. It's a far more comprehensive read than the Death of WCW, which is entertaining but steeped in that decidedly early 2000s Wrestlecrap finger pointing vibe. Remember it had a dedication to Hunter and Steph as a weird sort of warning? Little else in wrestling has aged worse. 

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11 minutes ago, The Gaffer said:

Pretty much. 

For a guy I used to find alright, he's become my least favourite of the big wrestling grifters because his grift is essentially "Wrestling fans are the worst. God this is embarrassing." Which - hey - that's what makes it a grift I guess, but it's not like anyone's even lining up to place the blame squarely at his feet anymore. He may as well own up to at least a part of it. 

Was a decent watch. I groaned when it was announced because I feel like the whole wrestling unconscious is surely completely fatigued by Monday Night Warz lore but in fairness all they needed to pull me in was some fresh faces, and they done that with some of the Turner execs and Guy Evans. 

Good on him for becoming the de facto neutral WCW demise source. It's a far more comprehensive read than the Death of WCW, which is entertaining but steeped in that decidedly early 2000s Wrestlecrap finger pointing vibe. Remember it had a dedication to Hunter and Steph as a weird sort of warning? Little else in wrestling has aged worse. 

The more Bischoff talks, the less I value his opinion.

He was someone that gave Vince a little sweat for maybe two years, and has then spent more than 10× that length of time riding on the coattails of that—now in comparison—small moment in time coming up with excuse after excuse after excuse as to why WCW closing or “losing the war” wasn’t his fault, or how he knew things would happen before they did yet did fuck all about it.

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I saw several clips on Youtube where he just resorts to "the fans don't know anything about what really went on". The fans don't have to know anything about that. All they had to know was that they didn't like the product Bischoff was putting out, they didn't like seeing the same people in the same spots, they didn't like being ripped off for their ticket money to get substandard booking, and they didn't like to show up to shows when they realised they might get jipped.

We don't need to know anything except wCw doesn't exist any more because people didn't enjoy it, and he was in charge when that happened. For a Republican, he certainly isn't big on that personal responsibility they bang on about.

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58 minutes ago, LCJ said:

I legit laughed out loud when Bret said that. I mean you could argue that Bret is a bit of an ingrate considering he was paid a fortune during his almost three years with the company  

He was paid well but that’s where the positives ended. It’s a company that got Bret at the end of 97, when he was still at the top of his game and was finishing up probably the best year of his career, plus he was coming off the whole Montreal debacle and chinning Vince McMahon - he was at his hottest and they pissed it all away from pretty much his first night in and rendered him to being just another guy on the roster within 6 months. Add to that, putting him in the ring with the big lummox who ended his career and even things like how neglectful they were with the whole trapdoor incident that fucked Bulldog up. You can see why he’d have nothing good to say about the place. The whole experience must bring back nothing but negative memories.

How any promoter can fuck up getting Bret Hart at that time in his career is actually astounding. Yet you can probably count the good things they did with him in that run on three fingers. Yeah they paid him, but they also squandered, diminished and prematurely ended what time he had left as a wrestler. Then you’ve got a worm like Bischoff knocking him in interviews and stuff. No wonder Bret has such a negative attitude about his time there. 

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There's some weird (well not that weird, it makes sense) feedback loop in the human brain where people go from their creation reflecting what people want to expecting people to want what their creation is.  I've not paid much attention to most of what Eric Bischoff has said over the years so episode 1 of this show made him come across fairly well, in particular his reflecting on the changes in society and moving WCW with them.

However it wouldn't suprise me in the slightest after 2 years of success he forgot that his creation was a reflection of what society wanted and started to believe his ideas were simply what society wanted. Thus it's the fans fault.

You see the same with all the comedians who were revolutionary angry voices in their youth and now seem to be confused as to why young fans don't dig their "old man yells at cloud" viewpoints

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I'll echo the sentiment of Bischoff. I used to like listening to the guy (His Austin podcast appearance was pretty fun) and he always seemed like he had at least some context on what happened at WCW. He obviously got caught up in something and couldn't evolve, but hey he had a great run.

However, he's utterly fallen into the worst of the worst. He could be a really interesting guy to listen to with great stories, but now he's a weirdly bitter bloke who either lies or says he doesn't remember. He's weirdly the least interesting part of the whole WCW thing bar Bret shitting on him. At least Russo sort of knows he's a gimmick

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