Yakashi Posted November 1, 2013 Share Posted November 1, 2013 Someone give Sphinx a medal for actually getting it. Wrestling is just stories, low-brow panto stories, but stories nonetheless. And, like all stories, logic only matters in so far as it must be matched with character. If Luke Skywalker wofts a lightsabre it's fine, if Tosh from The Bill uses one it's a bit mental.  The Undertaker has the character, as does Cena, whereby there super human feats are justifiable. Those indie twerps can't even spell character. They do things just because.  I agree with Taker having a certain character/gimmick that would allow for such things. But there's no reason for some of Cenas crimes against wrestling psychology. In the 21st century there is no explanation that can justify what happened at the end of Summerslam in the 5 on 5 vs Nexus for example. Cena is generally exceptional at many things, but he is fucking awful at comprehending the art of selling correctly and how to transition. The fact Cena is sometimes fantastic in his selling and sometimes so astoundingly bad makes me think he still doesn't fully understand what he's doing. I cant think of another reason for some of the things he has done.  Davey Richards however, is a a crime against wrestling entirely. For someone to wrestle the way he does and genuinely believe he is one of the best in the world (he is an arrogant, self entitled prick right?) is flabbergasting. If he goes to WWE as rumoured, he wont last five minutes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Butternut Squash Posted November 1, 2013 Share Posted November 1, 2013 That's Cena's role though. He's the white (black?) meat babyface ace that sells he's arse off but ultimatly 'overcomes the odds' with a big comeback. Just like Hogan. He's WWE's superhero. I know some have grown to hate that trope (I didn't like the Summerslam ending myself) but I see no problem with it generally. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members FLips Posted November 2, 2013 Paid Members Share Posted November 2, 2013 That's Cena's role though. He's the white (black?) meat babyface ace that sells he's arse off but ultimatly 'overcomes the odds' with a big comeback. Just like Hogan. He's WWE's superhero. I know some have grown to hate that trope (I didn't like the Summerslam ending myself) but I see no problem with it generally. Â The thing with Hulk though is that he hulked up. I know it sounds daft, but hulking up made you believe in the comeback because he was freaking out and powering up and shit was going to kick off. It was a spot that people loved, and sometimes (rarely) it didn't even lead to the win. Hulk Hogan would have been so much shitter if he just jumped up and hit a big boot and leg drop with no build at all. That's the one thing I still can't like about Cena, he just doesn't get it at all when it comes to how to do a comeback. There's no psychology to jumping off the floor and half-arsing your finisher with no build, it just takes the wind out of the sails. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members CleetusVanDamme Posted November 2, 2013 Paid Members Share Posted November 2, 2013 But there's no reason for some of Cenas crimes against wrestling psychology. In the 21st century there is no explanation that can justify what happened at the end of Summerslam in the 5 on 5 vs Nexus for example. Â No. That's another thing that only became a major talking point because it was Cena doing it. He took a DDT on the outside, was out cold for ages, got thrown back in the ring, Barrett tagged in Gabriel, who went for his flippy thing and Cena rolled out of the way then pinned him, Barrett came in and Cena tripped him up and stuck him in the STF. It's hardly like he sold the DDT by popping up and hitting a DDT of his own, right? When has any babyface in WWE took a move on the outside, got rolled back in the ring and not made a comeback? Â Just a few months earlier. Shawn Michaels took a fucking TOMBSTONE on the outside and was moonsaulting about minutes later. Not a single soul complained. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Butternut Squash Posted November 2, 2013 Share Posted November 2, 2013 I don't disagree with the idea of Cena Hulking up although that would probably piss people off even more. I'd love to see the return of the hulk-up/strap down. Big E is tomorrows hero. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yakashi Posted November 2, 2013 Share Posted November 2, 2013 No. That's another thing that only became a major talking point because it was Cena doing it. He took a DDT on the outside, was out cold for ages, got thrown back in the ring, Barrett tagged in Gabriel, who went for his flippy thing and Cena rolled out of the way then pinned him, Barrett came in and Cena tripped him up and stuck him in the STF. It's hardly like he sold the DDT by popping up and hitting a DDT of his own, right? When has any babyface in WWE took a move on the outside, got rolled back in the ring and not made a comeback? Â Just a few months earlier. Shawn Michaels took a fucking TOMBSTONE on the outside and was moonsaulting about minutes later. Not a single soul complained. Â I've just watched it on YouTube to check. Cena went from being DDT'd on concrete to running at full speed in about 45 seconds. That's not 'ages'. That's retarded. And yeah, there's no excuse for Shawn doing that either. Kurt Angle is even worse. It's not just Cena. But as the top guy in the business I guess he shoulders most of the complaints. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members CleetusVanDamme Posted November 2, 2013 Paid Members Share Posted November 2, 2013 I just checked as well, he was only down for a minute. Still, being lifeless for that long and getting a flash pin and submission afterwards isn't a "crime against psychology". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members IANdrewDiceClay Posted November 2, 2013 Paid Members Share Posted November 2, 2013 (edited) Its amazing how some arguments will be the same whatever era we are in. Remember when Hogan stood up (didn't even Hulk Up!) after the devastating back breaking Vader Power Bomb? No amount of shit Cena gets will ever compare to that. I'm certain what popularized the internet was that move. I can just see millions of people across the globe saying "I'm going to buy a computer after that shit". Hogan no selling the power bomb (a move which crippled a jobber and had Foley coughing up blood), would be like Cena taking the tombstone, jumping up and doing the "You Cant See Me" hand signal or something. Mass hysteria. Edited November 2, 2013 by IANdrewDiceClay Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yakashi Posted November 2, 2013 Share Posted November 2, 2013 (edited) I wonder if the whole hulk up routine can be justified by people our age now because we went through it as children and are quick to defend it because of how tremendous it made most of us feel at the time. I'm sure kids now feel similar about Cena. Â I'm a Cena fan but shit, he's not Hogan. I will stupidly defend Hogans bullshit til the bitter end because he's the fucking man. I know it's a massive contradiction. But it's hogan. Edited November 2, 2013 by Yakashi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The King Of Swing Posted November 2, 2013 Share Posted November 2, 2013 Warrior kicking out of 5 big elbows, Taker kicking out of sledgehammer shots.....wrestling logic? Your examples are just proving the fact that Richards/Edwards spot is a joke! Kicking out=they sold it in the first place! Ha ha ha, warrior sold 5 elbow drops for 2 seconds, thats fine then. Wrestling logic has now been preserved. Â Warrior and Savage had their careers on the line and had to go beyond their limits. Everything makes perfect sense in that match if you actually pay attention to it. Â Savage also kicked out of Warrior's finisher in that match. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members air_raid Posted November 2, 2013 Paid Members Share Posted November 2, 2013 But there's no reason for some of Cenas crimes against wrestling psychology. Â Hi Fin. Â I've just watched it on YouTube to check. Â Don't lie to me, Fin. You didn't need to check, you have the last 90 seconds of that match memorized. You complain about it least once a month in your magazine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheShowOff Posted November 2, 2013 Share Posted November 2, 2013 When has any babyface in WWE took a move on the outside, got rolled back in the ring and not made a comeback? Â Â Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members LaGoosh Posted November 2, 2013 Paid Members Share Posted November 2, 2013 But doesnt 90% of wrestling defy logic? Â CONTEXT. That sequence defies even wrestling logic. Wrestling logic is that if you get suplexed from the top rope, it hurts and debilitates you. Ideally to the point you aren't really capable of getting straight back up and suplexing your opponent. It's fabulously moronic and renders the superplex something you can just shrug off and go back on the offence immediately like a shoulder block or a dropkick. Â What about Hulkster kicking out of Bob Ortons Superplex of the top rope, hulking up, irish whip, big boot then the pin? Does he know how to work? CONTEXT: Â Yeah but that's Hulk Hogan. He's allowed to no-sell things at times because he's HULK FUCKING HOGAN. He's not some vanilla midget pretending to be a ninja/UFC fighter, he's a goddamn superhero. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members quote the raven Posted November 2, 2013 Paid Members Share Posted November 2, 2013 The Hogan no sell was the main comeback of a match! You knew the end was here when hogan wagged the finger. Â How much longer did that Roh match go on for? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members LaGoosh Posted November 2, 2013 Paid Members Share Posted November 2, 2013 Probably 40 minutes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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