The Official UKFF RAW Thread...

[Nick James]

I maybe wrong here, but, the crowd were massively into Cena before it became 'cool' to hate him. When he did the heel rapper gimmick he was cheered, he got a good pop when winning the US title from Big Show, a massive pop when he won the title from JBL (That could have been more about JBL losing the title, however) and the night he was traded to Raw, the crowd adored the guy.

 

Wasn't it around 2006 that he started getting shit from the fans? Again, I could be wrong on this.

[PunkStep]

Massively is an understatement- they turned him face because the crowd pretty much told them to. He was ridiculously over it was unreal.

 

I wasn't watching WWE when the crowd turned on him, so others on here can hopefully help, but the earliest that I know of where the crowd were dead against him was the WrestleMania where he wrestled Triple H. 23 was it? 22 I think he beat HBK, so it must've been the year after.

[Shane O' Mac Version 2]

Wrong way around, Triple H was Mania 22, HBK was 23.

 

Cena was a massive face up until he got drafted to Raw. He got a massive pop in his Raw debut, then he started going over smart favourites like Christian, Jericho and Angle throughout the summer of 2005, so by the time Mania 22 rolled around in 2006, the resentment was at a high.

[IANdrewDiceClay]

Cena was getting booed on house shows and at Smackdown tapings well before he got drafted to Raw. More and more boos kept creeping in because he was live every week and they couldnt edit it. I remember people at the time thinking it was a huge mistake to put Cena on the live show, because his work at the time was very poor.

Edited December 23, 2014 by IANdrewDiceClay

[Glass Smash]

I actually enjoyed this weeks Xmas Raw. I think it's been the best episode since Triple H and Steph took time out. Also loved the Ambrose Vs Wyatt match. And as much as I like Roddy, I also think it's time Piper's Pit came to an end. It also seemed pretty obvious that Hogan fucked off home after his opening segment. So much for being the host. 

 

On a side note Paige did look fucking awesome. Loved the black Santa hat.

Edited December 23, 2014 by Glass Smash

[Undefeated Steak]

Massively is an understatement- they turned him face because the crowd pretty much told them to. He was ridiculously over it was unreal.

 

The fans were behind him when he was US champion and when he first beat JBL for the title but it soon changed when WWE started to push him as the next Rock. I remember reading about them editing the crowd reactions for him on Smackdown but like Ian said when they moved him to Raw there wasn't anything they could do. The landscape was so different back then, they were only a few years removed from the Rock and Austin era, Batista was as over as Rover, Orton was cooler than Cena was, and you had Michaels, Angle, Benoit, Eddie, Jericho etc at the top of their games. Lesnar and Golberg had just left and then suddenly Cena seemed like a cartoon character that had shot straight into the main events. Even looking back at 2005/06 the product was a lot darker than it is now, you had the flaming tables and One Night Stand and Edge/Foley matches and Cena stood out like a sore thumb.

 

Going back to my amateur theory, it's much easier to push someone into the main events if they're a heel unless the fans think they've chosen them (Punk, Bryan etc).

[King Pitcos]

There was a good bit on one of the Wrestling Observer Live radio shows this week, where Todd Martin opined that the crowd will undoubtedly turn on Reigns because - as with Cena - he isn't their guy. He's right. If you look at most of the top babyfaces of the last 30 years they were all created by the fans. Hogan? Heel who got cheered. Hart? Tag team heel got begrudging respect. Austin? Cool heel turned face. And it goes on. The reason that half the crowd have never taken to Cena is he was chosen for them, not by them, and they risk doing that with Reigns when patience may get him over anyway. But I digress.

 

Nonsense. Cena was turned babyface by fans, and I don't recall the heel Hart Foundation ever getting the kind of positive reaction that Roman Reigns was regularly getting when he was in a heel tag team.

[Loki]

Bit late due to the UKFF AIDS, but.. I liked this Raw, although as I hadn't seen the PPV, some of these matches were fresh.

 

Cena and Rollins click well together.  Rollins has won me over this year, he's a great heel and a super worker.  He's also stepped up in the manner expected of young guys, got himself in tremendous shape and worked on every aspect of his job.  Cena looks, maybe it's my imagination, but a little slower and less mobile than a year or two ago.

 

I'm an unashamed Ziggler fan, and I thought his promos and his match was great; he makes his opponents look strong even when he beats them.  I agree with Stone Cold that he's reached a stage of his career where he needs to show a little LESS ass, go toe to toe a bit more and win stronger, but you can't deny that he's clearly doing everything he can to fulfil the constant demands from Vince et al to "grasp the brass ring" - his enthusiasm and effort are off the chart.

 

Rusev v Ryback is my kind of feud - two big bulls thrashing it out.  If WWE want to complete the process, in my mind they could do worse than have Ryback beat Lesnar at Wrestlemania for the title.  He's physically intimidating enough to look like he could go toe to toe, and is the right sort of popular to really benefit from the rub.  It would be a cracking match too.  If they fail to pul the trigger on him a 2nd time, he'll be ruined for good.

 

The flip side of that is that I'm just not sold on Reigns.  He's just not showing the depth he needs - his matches are totally one-dimensional, and his promos suck.  I think he'll be a big star, but he's a few years off for me.  They might as well turn him heel again for a while rather than continue to force him down people's throats.  It's not his fault, it's just not his time yet and there are others better placed.

 

The more main events Wyatt and Ambrose get, the better they'll get.  Their main event was fantastic.  Wyatt's finally starting to look more like a monster in the ring - he's added a few new bits to his offence, works a little more vicious, doesn't need to pull up his trousers all the time...  Incorporating a bit of the Cactus Jack into his act is a good idea - he actually enjoys the pain etc.  You buy that both Ambrose and Wyatt enjoy hardcore type matches and look forward to beating each other up.

 

It feels like this year the WWE finally has enough young main event/top tier guys to sustain a show without the older stars if they had to - 

 

Rusev

Ryback

Ziggler

Bruiser Brody

Reigns

Rollins

Ambrose

Wyatt

 

That's a good core of contrasting characters to build a brand around.  They could do with clearing out the mid card though - you could lose the likes of Swagger and Fandango and bring in some fresh faces.  Grab some TNA guys, bring up the top tier of NXT, freshen the whole card up.

 

Looking forward to next year.

[SpursRiot2012]

Ah, nothing.

Edited December 26, 2014 by SpursRiot2012

[Sphinx]

I'm all over The Big Guy, but Lesnar vs. Ryback is highly unlikely to be a cracking match. Lesnar needs someone to lead him through matches. Ryback isn't the one to do that.

 

Edit: I suggested Ryback vs. Rusev as Ryback's comeback feud #wrestlingguru

Edited December 27, 2014 by Sphinx

[Big Benny HG]

Catching up on recorded Raws.

 

Just so we're clear, what is the difference between a Street Fight, an Extreme Rules match and a No Holds Barred contest?

[neil is brill]

The way in which you spell them... In all seriousness, there is no difference. WWE think all their viewers are a bit thick and didn't think they'd notice that all 3 options in the vote were essentially the same match.

[Shane O' Mac Version 2]

Jerry Lawler: "Maybe we should explain to the viewers what the differences between these matches are."

Cole and JBL:*crickets*

[neil is brill]

It's the same in WWE 2K15 too. There's a No Holds Barred Match and Extreme Rules match, both are exactly the same, feature the same winning conditions etc, but each is considered it's own match type.

[UK Kat Von D]

Street fights people sometimes wear jeans and a t-shirt. No holds barred means anything goes and you can use whatever you find knocking about. Extreme rules is the same, except you are encouraged to use weapons and are probably provided with random shit to hit each other with.

 

That's how I've always looked at it anyway. It's pretty flimsy and not always the case.