Paid Members ColinBollocks Posted March 13, 2018 Paid Members Share Posted March 13, 2018 1 hour ago, d-d-d-dAz said: I thought Cena’s segment showed why the Reigns/crowd dynamic doesn’t feel the same, and doesn’t feel like it’ll work for them the same way Cena’s did. There’s a level of connection between Cena and the audience that I think is super rare in the history of wrestling. I think it’s different than Hogan’s, Rock or Austin’s. They were all hero worshipped, for one reason or other. They were ‘other worldly’ in their own ways, whereas despite his muscles and superhero demeanour, Cena sort of seems like ‘one of us’. He’s so nerdy at times, it’s unbelievable. Plus, he hasn’t really had that chance to bask in adoration so that, in itself, has kept his feet tethered to the ground in terms of fan perception. I don’t know. It just seemed as he was bouncing around the audience, everyone has fun with him. And most importantly, for all his faults, he clearly loves WWE, loves the audience and is having loads of fun himself. And that’s the issue, maybe. Reigns always seems a little sour. He doesn’t appear to be having fun. He’s aloof in the face of the audience ‘expressing themselves’, as Cole says, and that just seems like the worst possible way to go. Good post, this. I think the Cena/Reigns feud exposed all of this and it's no coincidence it was the exact moment I stopped being invested in Reigns' character. Good in-ring wrestlers, of course, but Cena (scripted or not) didn't half expose him as a having miserable personality - I think the best Reigns could muster as a retort was calling Cena a "bitch" over and over again. Cena's "the only reason I'm still around is because you can't do your job" is about as cutting as it gets. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FourtyTwo Posted March 13, 2018 Share Posted March 13, 2018 Could Lesnar - Reigns end up being similar to the Goldberg match - play on the fact Brock is barely around, lacking focus etc, and have Reigns have it won in under a minute? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Kaz Hayashi Posted March 13, 2018 Paid Members Share Posted March 13, 2018 No fucking chance. Of course unless they are looking for a riot and want to bury Lesnar, Reigns and the title. Goldberg had the awe of a legend gone by, people truly excited and curious about his return, a very interesting and fun build up, and a complete shock. Reigns can’t offer any of those qualities. No mystique, its now unoriginal, Lesnar has battered him in the last couple of years, people would turn the fucker off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pinc Posted March 13, 2018 Share Posted March 13, 2018 2 hours ago, ColinBollocks said: Cena's "the only reason I'm still around is because you can't do your job" is about as cutting as it gets. Or it would have been had it come from anyone but John "ten years of boos" Cena. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
d-d-d-dAz Posted March 13, 2018 Author Share Posted March 13, 2018 3 minutes ago, Pinc said: Or it would have been had it come from anyone but John "ten years of boos" Cena. Are you saying Cena doesn’t have a connection with the audience different, and superior, to that of Roman’s? Not to point at my earlier post or anything, but that’s pretty much how I think about it. In many ways, I think Cena’s ability to take anything on the chin and handle, with humour and grace, the cards he’s been dealt make him one of the most special wrestlers who have ever lived. Any one of a million moments of adversity he’s faced would have melted the head of most of his peers. We’ve watched it. When Roman’s skin peeled and his heart sank during that promo he was older than when Cena was dragged over the public coals by Triple H. You say ‘ten years of boos’ but, sorry to go all Michael Cole, I say ‘ten years of genuine, unparalleled connection’. He’s rolled with the punches well, and what might have started as a fist fight has ended as a play fight. John Cena wasn’t saying ‘I’m still here because you’re getting booed’, it was more of a ‘I’m still here because they still don’t really know you, and what they do know seems a bit shitty’... and that’s a much bigger problem. Roman’s trying to play a Cena crowd with a Dwayne attitude. That doesn’t work. Whether it’s The Rock, Batista, Goldberg... anyone with that aloof, tough guy exterior has always struggled to handle a ‘new’ crowd. You need to have a sense of humour about your situation, and yourself, and be able to spar with the audience. So, for me, it was more cutting from John than anyone as he’s probably the first real example of how to deal with the new world. And he’s smashed it. The only comparison to Roman’s predicament is John, and that’s like comparing Adidas Predators to a couple of Kwik Save carrier bags taped to your feet with a Nike tick drew on by your old dear. John Cena is bloody brilliant. Basically. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members ColinBollocks Posted March 13, 2018 Paid Members Share Posted March 13, 2018 28 minutes ago, Pinc said: Or it would have been had it come from anyone but John "ten years of boos" Cena. As dAz points out, Cena's point is Reigns is a shitty version of a main eventer. For all the Cena hate, he is/was a proper needle mover. Is Reigns? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members WeeAl Posted March 13, 2018 Paid Members Share Posted March 13, 2018 9 minutes ago, ColinBollocks said: As dAz points out, Cena's point is Reigns is a shitty version of a main eventer. For all the Cena hate, he is/was a proper needle mover. Is Reigns? The simple answer, I would gather, would be no. There's analysis done on this comparing John Cena headlined cards, with Roman Reigns headlined cards, and then the Roman cards with shows featuring neither of them. Cena has showed a marked difference when he has appeared compared to when he isn't there, whilst Roman being on a card, or being absent, means the attendance is generally the same as all Raw branded shows not featuring Cena. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Kaz Hayashi Posted March 13, 2018 Paid Members Share Posted March 13, 2018 That and the fans saw Cena as a ‘forced on them’ hero, rebelled, he took it in his stride, they acknowledge as much and now it’s basically a game because they are interacting with the biggest name in the business. I’d be surprised if any of the ones who boo, truly don’t like/respect him. They see Roman as a shit knock off version of Cena, without the star appeal to adults and kids, the charisma, the 90000 make a wish appearances etc. They can see through him and he hasn’t got what Cena has to turn it in to an interactive game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
d-d-d-dAz Posted March 13, 2018 Author Share Posted March 13, 2018 9 minutes ago, Kaz Hayashi said: That and the fans saw Cena as a ‘forced on them’ hero, rebelled, he took it in his stride, they acknowledge as much and now it’s basically a game because they are interacting with the biggest name in the business. I’d be surprised if any of the ones who boo, truly don’t like/respect him. They see Roman as a shit knock off version of Cena, without the star appeal to adults and kids, the charisma, the 90000 make a wish appearances etc. They can see through him and he hasn’t got what Cena has to turn it in to an interactive game. Yeah, good post. Also worth mentioning that once they got over the initial hump, there was always that feeling of the Cena reactions being a trend and, like Kaz says, a game between them and him. I always remember when he came back early from injury at the Rumble at number 30: that place absolutely lost its cabbages for 5 seconds, before they realised they should boo. There’s been other times too. Countless in-match examples, but one that always sticks out is Punk/Cena in Dallas, on Raw, to see who’d headline Mania against The Rock. If you’re being generous that was a 50-50 crowd, yet by the end they were so absorbed (helps that it was possibly the best TV match of all time... possibly) that the whole place fell apart when John Cena pinned CM Punk clean to main event Mania. I think there’s lots of things at play. A) he’s handled it exceptionally well and turned it too his advantage... b) he genuinely comes across like ‘one of us’, goofy at times but funny, sincere and has a genuine love for wrestling and c) he’s genuinely fucking brilliant at wrestling. On that last point, he might not be a ‘moves’ guy but his ability to tell a story (and to work out how to tell a story within the context of this new audience, despite being the first guy exposed to it) is pretty incredible. It can’t have hurt his standing with the fans that over the years a litany of their favourites (be it Punk, Styles, Bryan etc) or highly regarded WWE guys (HHH, Edge, HBK) have all gone on record as saying how good he is, and have had some of their very best matches with him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Supremo Posted March 13, 2018 Paid Members Share Posted March 13, 2018 Some great posts in here about Cena and Roman, not a lot I can really add. I’m just here to say how much I adore the idea of Braun using Elias as a weapon or shield. That’s the perfect type of cartoon nonsense that makes the Braun character so fun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members WeeAl Posted March 13, 2018 Paid Members Share Posted March 13, 2018 I bloody well hope that's where they are going with this, and have Braun use Elias like one of those sticks they used to have on Gladiators, with Elias looking like a broken man at the end of it, yet being a champion and Braun rubbing his head at the end for being a good fella. The opening segment this week was weird. It seemed to be really trying something a little bit different, and then Reigns went to the back, got scolded, put his tail between his legs and walked off because he's obviously flat broke and can't chance losing his job in case his kids starve. Despite him being a millionaire and everyone knowing it. Instead of getting fans onside with Roman and against Brock, it may just alienate fans from both of them. One, possibly, for absenteeism and the other for having a big mouth and then cowing down when the time comes to stand up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
firstnameunknown Posted March 13, 2018 Share Posted March 13, 2018 I only follow Raw via YouTube highlights and This Week In WWE and such, but how and why did Mickie James go from reluctantly cooperating with Alexa to just figuring “hell, might as well just be her bitchy sidekick now”..? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Lorne Malvo Posted March 13, 2018 Paid Members Share Posted March 13, 2018 (edited) They didn't explain it. One week she rekindled her reluctant loose alliance with Alexa in the Chamber (due to Sonya/Mandy being part of Absolution and Banks/Bayley being friends, which actually is a nice bit of logic) but then the week after they just had her as a generic bitchy heel. There was no evolution to the story or explanation given, just lazy writing. It's happened a few times the last few years though. Alexa/Nia fell out then went back to being best friends with no explanation, and I'm pretty sure there was a tag-team who fell out then were best mates again but I'm struggling to remember who that was. Edited March 13, 2018 by Lorne Malvo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shane O' Mac Version 2 Posted March 13, 2018 Share Posted March 13, 2018 38 minutes ago, Lorne Malvo said: It's happened a few times the last few years though. Alexa/Nia fell out then went back to being best friends with no explanation, and I'm pretty sure there was a tag-team who fell out then were best mates again but I'm struggling to remember who that was. Prime Time Players? They had a split and a mini feud before WWE realised they had nothing for them to do individually, so put them back together without explanation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FUM Posted March 13, 2018 Share Posted March 13, 2018 While I think Nia/Alexa is the right way to go at Mania, why are they pretending that Nia ever fell for Alexa's shite? She seen right through her manipulation countless times. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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