The Official UKFF RAW Thread...

[scotswizard]

And Pitcos has it spot on. The WWE cannot survive without the TV revenue. They can't afford to take their shows off TV and put them on the Network.

 

 

 

So what happens in 2020 when NBC and all these big sponsors they have look at the contracts and they say ok Vince.....your show Raw was doing over 4 million viewers at the last contract and we paid you X amount of dollars.

 

 

Now Raw is doing 2.7 million viewers, almost 1.5 million LESS and you want us to give you MORE money?

 

 

 

I can see how the conversations gonna go. No way will they be paying them the $160 million a year they're getting a year now for a show drawing less than 3 million viewers. No chance. I don't know what Sky Sports will do, whatever they do is up to them, if people still wanna pay £30 a month to watch wrestling that's up to them but with Kodi and FIresticks and Roku sticks being available so cheap I can't see it. Every TV is a smart TV now. Plug it right in and you can watch any channel you want for nothing. Good luck to them though. Keep making the show and indy show, keep driving people away, keep losing viewers. That's what they want.

[MVP RULZ]

So what happens in 2020 when NBC and all these big sponsors they have look at the contracts and they say ok Vince.....your show Raw was doing over 4 million viewers at the last contract and we paid you X amount of dollars.

 

 

Now Raw is doing 2.7 million viewers, almost 1.5 million LESS and you want us to give you MORE money?

 

 

But TV Ratings across the board ARE DOWN, Its not just Wrestling shows, I follow the US Tv Ratings and every show this year is down on previous years

 

Viewers aren't always the best measure either, In the US its all about the demos watching the Show more then the amount of eyeballs on the product

 

Just This past Thursday Smackdown was Tied for the no1 show on all of Cable in terms of demos and no 2 in actual Viewers, I'd think USA would be pretty happy about that  

 

Are the Ratings what they once were of course not but no show is, You can argue they could be better and I wouldn't disagree but in the grand scheme of things they aren't too bad in comparison with other TV shows and its the year 2016 to be expecting a show to be doing the same numbers it was doing in 2000 or even 2010 is virtually impossible.

[the_mole]

Yeah ESPN even got an apology from Nielson as they said they had lost several million subscribers in a month and ESPN basically said prove it as all the information we have is that you're wrong and you're not counting other devices right, Neilson said that was true and they need a better system to count viewers that watch on other devices.

[scotswizard]

 

So what happens in 2020 when NBC and all these big sponsors they have look at the contracts and they say ok Vince.....your show Raw was doing over 4 million viewers at the last contract and we paid you X amount of dollars.

 

 

Now Raw is doing 2.7 million viewers, almost 1.5 million LESS and you want us to give you MORE money?

 

 

But TV Ratings across the board ARE DOWN, Its not just Wrestling shows, I follow the US Tv Ratings and every show this year is down on previous years

 

Viewers aren't always the best measure either, In the US its all about the demos watching the Show more then the amount of eyeballs on the product

 

Just This past Thursday Smackdown was Tied for the no1 show on all of Cable in terms of demos and no 2 in actual Viewers, I'd think USA would be pretty happy about that  

 

Are the Ratings what they once were of course not but no show is, You can argue they could be better and I wouldn't disagree but in the grand scheme of things they aren't too bad in comparison with other TV shows and its the year 2016 to be expecting a show to be doing the same numbers it was doing in 2000 or even 2010 is virtually impossible.

 

 

 

But Smackdown doesn't cost USA anything, the WWE are footing the bill on their own for Smackdown. USA doesn't pay for Smackdown, they pay for Raw, they paid $100 million per year for the first year and then every year after it increases, this year alone was $160 million just for Raw.

 

I know ratings are down across the board but what I'm saying is, the WWE isn't like other TV shows that run for 13 weeks or 16 weeks and then it's done. The WWE is 52 weeks a year and it costs them money to do those shows. How much do you think WWE pay to rent those arenas? Pay for the flights? Pay for all the staff to fly in? Pay for all the camera crews and make up ladies and the production truck and then the people to work in the production trucks? After all that is paid and the rent for the arena that night is paid and all the wrestlers get their share of the takings what is left? And then on Tuesday they need to do the same but foot the bill for the whole thing on their own because they need to.

 

And people will watch TV if they want to. 17 million watched the premiere of The Walking Dead and since then has hovered around 10 million and that is on AMC which is a cable channel just like USA Network. Basic cable. Live football regularly gets well over 10 million viewers, many times over 15 million. Game Of Thrones on HBO. Big Bang Theory on CBS. FOX? FX has some of the best show in America and that is a basic cable channel.

 

What that says is, if people want to sit and watch TV, they will. They don't do that with other live sport. They don't do that with The Walking Dead or Game Of Thrones or Big Bang Theory. They don't say, we'll DVR it and watch it later on in the week. No. They sit and watch it as it's happening because it's that good. It's that unmissable. Wrestling unfortunately is not that way anymore.

 

 

We'll see what happens. There's still 3 years left on the contract and in the space of 2 years they've went from 4.3 million viewers down to 2.7 million viewers. That's over 1.5 million people gone in the space of 2 years and there's 3 years left and I don't see the numbers going up. I don't know what sponsors pay, I don't know what they charge in America to advertise during Raw but I'm sure at 4.3 million they could charge enough money to cover that initial $100 million they paid WWE. 5 years down the line if that number is a lot lower, which it already is I don't know if they are making a profit with WWE. And whatever sponsors are paying for their ads, I can't see them agreeing to pay the same kind of money to a show that USED to draw 4.3 million and now is well under 3 million. The only thing keeping WWE going is their TV revenue. People say ratings don't matter? Believe me they do when you're relying on it 52 weeks a year. I think at the very least in 2020 we will see WWE Raw on at a different time, i think they will move it to an early evening time. Wrestling has had it's day on prime time TV in America, it will have had at that point a good 25 year on TV on Monday nights. That's when you'll see the next big change in the wrestling business I feel. When those contracts need renewed and the numbers are back to rock bottom. I don't know what Sky Sports will do but I do think in America the WWE are in for a big shock in a few years. VInce McMahon will be 73 by then. If i was them I'd either start winding the company down, think about selling it or downsizing the whole operation because they are bleeding viewers every week and losing more and more fans. I think in 2020 there wont be enough wrestling fans in America or anywhere to sustain any company for 52 weeks a year. It's went on too long. Just watch Raw now. Still the stage. Still the fireworks. The same format. Nothing's changed. Everything else on TV has moved on so much. Wrestling has had it's time.

[MVP RULZ]

Raw Last week was still the 3rd Highest rated show on Cable last Monday though

 

One of the shows that beat it was MNF which is incomparable IMO

 

I think the Fact it 52 weeks a year actually works in there FAVOUR rather then against it, The shows you mentioned on cable The walking Dead and Game Of Thrones only deliver those big weeks up to 14 times a year, the networks then have to scramble to fill the other 38 weeks of the year with far inferior ratings and less Ad revenue as a result

 

At least USA know with Raw they are guaranteed to get those ratings from on a weekly basis and be in amongst the top of the Ratings for Mondays

 

Funny you mention FOX have you seen the ratings for there shows? They would kill to have Raws ratings, almost all of there shows besides Empire and Lethal weapon (which is on before Empire and no doubt gets a big pre tune in Boost) and its Cartoon Block on Sundays (which is again Boosted by the overflow of Football on beforehand) rank below Raw and FOX is a network channel

 

I'm not sure what you mean by ''everything else on TV has moved on so much but wrestling has had its time''?

 

Whats so different now in TV then what we saw in the past, Comedies are still Comedies, Dramas are Dramas, sure the content has been updated to reflect the culture of the time (Dramas in the 70's-80's focused on Russia etc as the enemy now it will 90% be about Middle East terrorists) but Wrestling has moved on, A lot of The Attitude Era content in 2016 would Flop massively and WWE would be kicked off the air fast

 

I'm Not and I'm sure nobody is saying Everything WWE does is great and they have some massive Flaws in there writing and storyline direction and have seemingly lost the ability to create any big stars but in terms of where they stand just from a Tv ratings POV they aren't in such a dire state you;ve made out to be as I said above can they get better ratings? of course they can but to suggest they will start winding down the Company after the next TV deal is just Ludicrous     

Edited December 28, 2016 by MVP RULZ

[Benno]

This thread.

The WWE cannot survive without the TV revenue. They can't afford to take their shows off TV and put them on the Network.

 

 

The WWE vs ITV thread.

The WWE could essentially give their shows away for free on TV and they would still make money.

This thread.

How much do you think WWE pay to rent those arenas? Pay for the flights? Pay for all the staff to fly in? Pay for all the camera crews and make up ladies and the production truck and then the people to work in the production trucks? After all that is paid and the rent for the arena that night is paid and all the wrestlers get their share of the takings what is left?

 

The WWE vs ITV Thread.

The WWE covers their own backs, they somehow manage to sell enough tickets to cover the rent of the arena, pay the wrestlers wages, fly all the real employees in, pay their hotels, pay their catering, pay their wages for the day and then fly them home again.

 

WWE is one of the few companies that can actually charge money for tickets and sell enough of them to cover everything themselves.

Edited December 28, 2016 by Benno

[King Pitcos]

I wonder if he's crazyshady.

[Lenin]

This thread.

 

The WWE cannot survive without the TV revenue. They can't afford to take their shows off TV and put them on the Network.

 

 

The WWE vs ITV thread.

The WWE could essentially give their shows away for free on TV and they would still make money.

This thread.

How much do you think WWE pay to rent those arenas? Pay for the flights? Pay for all the staff to fly in? Pay for all the camera crews and make up ladies and the production truck and then the people to work in the production trucks? After all that is paid and the rent for the arena that night is paid and all the wrestlers get their share of the takings what is left?

 

The WWE vs ITV Thread.

The WWE covers their own backs, they somehow manage to sell enough tickets to cover the rent of the arena, pay the wrestlers wages, fly all the real employees in, pay their hotels, pay their catering, pay their wages for the day and then fly them home again.

 

WWE is one of the few companies that can actually charge money for tickets and sell enough of them to cover everything themselves.

Post of the year?? Too late??

[Zaheer]

Blimey, Zaheer is still around!

 

 

 

I still lurk on here from time to time (by that, I mean religiously view this forum 20 to 30 times a day for the last 15 or so years!)

 

However recently I'm finding the general views of the "state of wrestling" mind boggling and finding it hard not to react

 

I'd say over the last couple of years they've been on a great form. The best in fact. There's so much good going on I mean, AJ Styles is the current MAN! We have events where people do springboard 450s through tables from the ring apron. We have NXT. We had Balor come in and win the belt straight away. We have examples of masterful story telling such as DIY/The Revival, and other masterful story telling in the way of Goldberg/Brock (where if you didn't see the brilliance in it, then I think this wrestling lark isn't for you).

 

We have so many different platforms to enjoy and take in WWE. I don't understand this whole ratings bollocks. We're judging "ratings" from the era where if you wanted to download a 4 minute song, you'd have to be online for 4 hours, potentially have your computer catch hepatitis from Limewire, and only if your mum's friend didn't call to ruin your connection. Now we can stream and download gigs of high quality tv, movies and albums in real time. The landscape of the world has changed. Look in every single avenue of entertainment and otherwise. Everything is different.

 

Don't get me started on "the tv shows are too long they should reduce it to 2 hours". WWE are contracted to put on that many hours of TV. They get paid to do it. We are not obligated to watch it live. There's been weeks where I go from watching every episode, to missing the odd few episodes. I don't actually "miss" anything - there's plenty of ways for me to find out what has happened and to watch the best bits. It's a case of making it work for you. 

 

There's so many flaws in a lot of theories which I would love to take apart, however ultimately - I bloody love watching this shit, it's entertaining and I wish others who seem to waste their time invested into it feel the same. My enjoyment from wrestling is a lot higher than most, so I guess I'm the winner here

[Jazzy G]

Agreed, consumption of media has changed so much over the years.

[wandshogun09]

Whether it's talking zombies, midget luchadores, eggs hatching, black ooze, puppies, giants being unrecognizable in a mask, big daddys, twin magic, arms that never heal or wrestlers never hitting a move off top despite trying every week for decades.

 

Silvervision! Bringing you the very best of the World Wrestling Federation's matches.

[FUM]

I've always been one who has said viewing habits have changed in regards to viewing but I never even for a second considered how much the speed of broadband has changed and how that contributes, great point.

[PunkStep]

 

Whether it's talking zombies, midget luchadores, eggs hatching, black ooze, puppies, giants being unrecognizable in a mask, big daddys, twin magic, arms that never heal or wrestlers never hitting a move off top despite trying every week for decades.

 

Silvervision! Bringing you the very best of the World Wrestling Federation's matches.

 

 

Top arrows, Wand!

[tiger_rick]

Yep, two thumbs up.

[Philjax]

A shockingly very good episode of Raw I thought.

 

The cruiserweights (and 205 Live for sure) have quickly become my favorite show of the week. Neville's brilliant, Gallagher is the next big thing and they've somehow got Noam Dar over with me. Everyone seems to have something to do now the individual show has been going a few weeks. Very watchable.

 

Strowman was excellent.

 

Dana Brooke is a unique looking thing isn't she?

 

Charly Caruso is all over the place! Every segment. Again, it's made me like her more than I did. Her doppelganger who she sometimes hands interviews over to can fuck off though. And what happened to Cathy Kelley?

 

Odd that when the standards are so high in the looks department right now, Scarlett Bordeaux would turn up looking as worse as I've seen her look (which is still amazing). Maybe that was itentional. Get her in NXT anyway. Long overdue.

 

Does anyone have the last 4 weeks ratings comparison between Raw and SD?