UKFF Questions Thread V2

[Vamp]

Yeah pretty much, although I did see the Maestro pre-WCW with them once so I don't know how they played that off.

 

The best thing about the 'WWF invasion' was changing most of their rudo midgets to WWF gimmicks. We had mini Vader, Mankind, Goldust and even Paul Bearer for a short while!

 

Somewhat connected to this, and because it's just fun to think of, IWRG's now got a Mini Bastista, or at least did have for the Christmas period. You can get a look at him for 6:37 (not in action though, sadly): Mini Batista

[Reznor]

Yeah pretty much, although I did see the Maestro pre-WCW with them once so I don't know how they played that off.

 

The best thing about the 'WWF invasion' was changing most of their rudo midgets to WWF gimmicks. We had mini Vader, Mankind, Goldust and even Paul Bearer for a short while!

 

Somewhat connected to this, and because it's just fun to think of, IWRG's now got a Mini Bastista, or at least did have for the Christmas period. You can get a look at him for 6:37 (not in action though, sadly): Mini Batista

Ha, loads of effort went into that one, looks more like Dick Togo!. Reading that wee typo just reminded me that there's a trio called Los Bastardo's going around the indies just now.

[iamthedoctor]

This might sound a bit of a odd question to ask so here goes.

 

Are their any articles about that list the top 100 wrestling matches/promos in WWE & WCW of all time?

 

Reason I ask is I got a fone with a 16 gig card and I want to fill it up with all the best matches.

[air_raid]

Are their any articles about that list the top 100 wrestling matches/promos in WWE & WCW of all time?

 

Well, I don't know if there are any top 100 lists, but if you don't find any as such you could find a worse starting point than picking out the Big 2 matches from THIS little lot.

 

 

EDIT - here's a question : why the fuck was Duggan protected so much??

 

Year after year, he never lost properly on TV. Between 'Mania IV and the first King of the Ring PPV (when he was well and truly on his way out) he barely did a single high profile job on TV for five fucking years. NOBODY got the protection Duggan did, even fucking Hogan and Warrior got pinned more often in that same period. Every Survivors he was in, he got disqualified. When he lost the crown to Macho Man, they showed the finish on an update segment (ropey finish that it was) but that was it, so that barely counts. Wrestling the Undertaker? No problems, disqualification will do ya. Building up rising superstar Yokozuna for the big push and title win? Well, you can send Duggan to hospital, that's fine, but PIN him? No chance, fat boy. Two goes around with Intercontinental Champion Shawn Michaels? How about a count-in win to hype the rematch where get gets beat next week? Sure... beat by disqualification, natch. What do you mean, DQ in a lumberjack match doesn't make sense? Duggan can't lose!

 

So yeah... five years of being allowed to look invincible, then a loss to Bam Bam at King of the Ring (which nobody remembers compared to the final), two months of the occasional Superstars squash, then finally a PROPER loss to Yoko at the SummerSlam Spectacular (by which point Yokozuna is ridiculously above Duggan's level and WWF Champion anyway). Then he's gone. What was the point? Were those foam 2x4s such a hot seller that the WWF couldn't compromise him???

Edited January 6, 2013 by air_raid

[Au]

I seem to recall one of both of them working somewhere else under the gimmicks for a bit too, possible a short run in Puerto Rico or Mexico. There is at 20% chance I'm talking shit though. Might even have been a few shows for the USWA or something like that (if that was still going then).

Nah, your right enough, they got shipped off to AAA for the spring/summer of '97 along with Jake Roberts (although he was probably there on his own back)

They play that off as a WWF vs. AAA feud don't they?

I was listening to an MLW podcast recently where Konan talks about Roberts blowing his entire pay for a run in Mexico in a single night. Presumably this one?

 

Anyway, on the subject of 1997 WWF, we were watching some old Raw's last night at a mates house and there was one where the ad break hadn't been quite edited out and there was the start of a commercial with Freddie Blassie (I think) and a young boy. All we got was Freddie saying "Okay kid, let's see what you've got." Which, out of context and in the current climate was just hilarious!

 

Anyway, Google and YouTube hasn't returned anything of this so just wondering if anyone knows what the full advert was about?

[Loki]

EDIT - here's a question : why the fuck was Duggan protected so much??

 

Year after year, he never lost properly on TV. Between 'Mania IV and the first King of the Ring PPV (when he was well and truly on his way out) he barely did a single high profile job on TV for five fucking years. NOBODY got the protection Duggan did, even fucking Hogan and Warrior got pinned more often in that same period. Every Survivors he was in, he got disqualified. When he lost the crown to Macho Man, they showed the finish on an update segment (ropey finish that it was) but that was it, so that barely counts. Wrestling the Undertaker? No problems, disqualification will do ya. Building up rising superstar Yokozuna for the big push and title win? Well, you can send Duggan to hospital, that's fine, but PIN him? No chance, fat boy. Two goes around with Intercontinental Champion Shawn Michaels? How about a count-in win to hype the rematch where get gets beat next week? Sure... beat by disqualification, natch. What do you mean, DQ in a lumberjack match doesn't make sense? Duggan can't lose!

 

So yeah... five years of being allowed to look invincible, then a loss to Bam Bam at King of the Ring (which nobody remembers compared to the final), two months of the occasional Superstars squash, then finally a PROPER loss to Yoko at the SummerSlam Spectacular (by which point Yokozuna is ridiculously above Duggan's level and WWF Champion anyway). Then he's gone. What was the point? Were those foam 2x4s such a hot seller that the WWF couldn't compromise him???

 

Didn't he also get some crazy protected booking in WCW too? I remember him beating Stunning Steve Austin in about 2 seconds.

[Au]

Year after year, he never lost properly on TV. Between 'Mania IV and the first King of the Ring PPV (when he was well and truly on his way out) he barely did a single high profile job on TV for five fucking years.

Y'know, I've never really thought as to why but at one point when I was about 9, I decided to put all my Figure Federation titles on Jim Duggan. Perhaps, because he never lost, my subconscious made me think he was unbeatable.

[IANdrewDiceClay]

It was different in the 80s. If Duggan didn't want to do a job he'd just say no. Honky Tonk Man rarely lost as well. I remember someone quoting Tito Santana to Bret Hart where Tito said "I didnt care about winning, Bret was a mark etc" and Bret replied with "that's why Tito Santana had the career he had and didnt rise above the level he was at". When Vince expanded the WWF in 1984 he brought in all established veterans who knew what was best for their characters. If a road agent comes up to you in 1988 and says "they want you to lose to Barbarian" and Duggan says "nah, you're alright, like" they just said "fair enough" because the wrestlers back then were from a different era and their money was based on their stock. Duggan was a flag waving gimmick worker in the WWF era. He pretty much had to be protected to keep his gimmick alive.

Edited January 7, 2013 by IANdrewDiceClay

[Reznor]

EDIT - here's a question : why the fuck was Duggan protected so much??

 

Year after year, he never lost properly on TV. Between 'Mania IV and the first King of the Ring PPV (when he was well and truly on his way out) he barely did a single high profile job on TV for five fucking years. NOBODY got the protection Duggan did, even fucking Hogan and Warrior got pinned more often in that same period. Every Survivors he was in, he got disqualified. When he lost the crown to Macho Man, they showed the finish on an update segment (ropey finish that it was) but that was it, so that barely counts. Wrestling the Undertaker? No problems, disqualification will do ya. Building up rising superstar Yokozuna for the big push and title win? Well, you can send Duggan to hospital, that's fine, but PIN him? No chance, fat boy. Two goes around with Intercontinental Champion Shawn Michaels? How about a count-in win to hype the rematch where get gets beat next week? Sure... beat by disqualification, natch. What do you mean, DQ in a lumberjack match doesn't make sense? Duggan can't lose!

 

So yeah... five years of being allowed to look invincible, then a loss to Bam Bam at King of the Ring (which nobody remembers compared to the final), two months of the occasional Superstars squash, then finally a PROPER loss to Yoko at the SummerSlam Spectacular (by which point Yokozuna is ridiculously above Duggan's level and WWF Champion anyway). Then he's gone. What was the point? Were those foam 2x4s such a hot seller that the WWF couldn't compromise him???

 

Didn't he also get some crazy protected booking in WCW too? I remember him beating Stunning Steve Austin in about 2 seconds.

Aye, and to make matters so much worse, it was when WCW fans were sitting down to their PPV (Fall brawl 94) expecting to see Steamboat/Austin, hot on the heels of two or three crackers at recent shows.

 

I never really noticed that pattern so much with Duggan but it's an accurate observation. Who knows really, I guess part of it could be down to the fact he became a bit of a novelty. He was rarely in any kind of meaningful feud or title programme, he was such a lump, and it would be pretty difficult for his opponent to look particularly good coming out of any matches with him. He would barely bump (and when he did it looked absurd), and wouldn't be able/willing to take most moves. Maybe he was just kept in his own little bubble with the impressive record to make sure he kept his popularity, especially considering his gimmick. And I guess that if he just didn't want to job, his popularity (and friends?) gave him enough clout and leverage to refuse without being fired.

 

I hated the fucker, but I can see the appeal somewhat with his charisma, that jingoistic shit he was all about, and that ability to suck in the sympathy by looking all pathetic and pitiful whilst being beat up despite being a big fat bloke. All I quite liked about him were his big cartoonish punches. To me he was horrid though, moreso now when we're 'smart' and can see that it was all "take, take, take" with him. And as last years thread established, he was also fucking bogging.

[AshC]

Do you reckon they were hesisitant to job out such a staunchly patriotic character?

[Loki]

How Patriotic WAS he compared to guys like, well, The Patriot, or Hulk Hogan? Genuine question, I've not watched enough of him. I guess his value has always been in getting the crowd stirred up, rather than putting bums on seats or anything.

[King Coconut]

As far as I remember he had a monopoly on the USA chant and that was just about it.

[Slapnut]

I was watching the Stone Cold DVD last night (which is great by the way), and it made me realise that I've seen hardly any 1997 WWF. Does anyone have any recommendations of PPVs or Raw episodes? Preferably full shows and not just matches.

[CleetusVanDamme]

The European championship show from Berlin is a really fun couple of hours that seemingly nobody remembers, aside from the main event.

 

It was a pretty shit year ppv-wise, most of them were one or two match cards. Definitely watch Summerslam and Canadian Stampede, though. Tv-wise, the Raw before Wrestlemania 13 is one of my favourite episodes ever.

Edited January 7, 2013 by CleetusVanDamme

[air_raid]

Slapnut,

 

If you haven't planned to have enough time to watch all of it, here's a sampler. It's hard to make "full card" recommendations for 97 because of lot of PPVs have dull undercards then one or two storming matches, and the Raws with great storyline development don't always have matches that are any good. I'll star what I think is "must see."

 

6/1/97 Raw (couple of good matches and a storyline advancement)

Rumble (for Rumble and WWF title match)

20/1/97 Raw (storyline developments/announcement of Final Four)

Thursday Raw Thursday Live

Final Four PPV (for the main event)

17/2/97 Raw (WWF title match main event)

24/2/97 Raw (ECW invades, LOD come back)

03/03/97 Raw (European title final in Berlin)

17/3/97 Raw (Sid/Bret cage match, Bret/Vince confrontation) ***

Mania (for Bret/Austin, mostly) ***

 

24/3/97 Raw (Bret heel turn, Undertaker/Bearer confrontation "Fire in the eyes") ***

31/3/97 Raw (new Hart Foundation forms)

21/4/97 Raw (Austin/Bret streetfight) ***

28/4/97 Raw (Maivia/Owen, Undertaker/Smith, Taker/Austin confrontation, Anvil returns)

Cold Day In Hell PPV (Taker/Austin title match, Vader/Shamrock is very different and fun)

26/5/97 Raw (Owen/Smith vs Michaels/Austin - Shawn comeback match) ***

* Personally I'd give King of the Ring a miss although Shawn vs Austin is fun, but has a weak finish

30/6/97 Raw (features Paul Bearer telling the story of the fire and Mankind's "Pick Me Steve" campaign)

Canadian Stampede (one of the best PPV of all time) *********************

 

07/07/97 Raw in Edmonton (just a fun show at the peak of USA v Canada)

14/07/97 Raw (Owen/Smith vs Austin/Dude Love)

21/07/97 Raw in Halifax (announcement of Shawn as guest ref for SummerSlam, Bret/Owen/Smith v Taker/Austin/Dude flag match) ***

28/07/97 Raw (Bret vs Patriot with HBK commentating - this whole run is gold, really)

SummerSlam

 

11/8/97 Raw (Shawn interview where he starts acting fully fledged heel, Michaels vs Mankind, formation of what comes to be DX)

18/8/97 Raw (Shawn & Hunter vs Taker & Mankind)

One Night Only (great Owen/Vader, Bret/Taker and Shawn/Bulldog matches) ************************

22/9/97 Raw at MSG (hilarious Owen/Pillman match, Vince/Austin interview, Cactus/Hunter falls anywhere) ***

Badd Blood PPV (for Hell In A Cell) ***

06/10/97 Raw only if you want to see DX formally named, Kane's Raw debut beating the shit out of the Hardys and Shawn stick the Canadian flag up his nose during Bret/HHH

13/10/97 Raw only if nostalgia makes you want to see LOD win the tag belts from the Godwinns (terrible match)

20/10/97 Raw (Owen vs Shawn, more Kane brutality, early antics of New Age Outlaws)

27/10/97 Raw only if you want to see that rant of Jim Cornette and Bret/Shamrock to my knowledge their only televised singles match

Survivors ***

17/11/97 Raw (Rock steals IC belt from Austin, Rock v Dude with hilarious pre match promo from Rock, big shit eating grin)

24/11 Raw (LOD v Outlaws tag title match, good Rock/Austin segment, DX recruit Anvil, Shawn v Vader)

8/12 Raw (Austin gives Rock the IC belt and he and Vince have a minor falling out. Oh, and Sable "potato sack" incident, heh)

22/12 Raw (Shawn vs Hunter European title match, Cactus v Road Dogg. fun show overall) ***

 

OK, there's more worth watching than skipping, but you get the idea.

Edited January 7, 2013 by air_raid