So what's unacceptable?

[tiger_rick]

Undertaker says hiGoldust says hiNation of Domination say hi

Never drew a dime.Tyson wasn't just controversial, he was Mike fucking Tyson. Big difference from trying to be controversial for the sake of it.Austin vs. McMahon was realistic, not controversial.Austin-Pillman Gun Angle, that was controversial. Never drew a dime either.

[Michael_3165]

I just want to add one more thing before I stop! I just read about 4 pages back comments such as 'its all harmless fun' and people saying they 'don't see what the fuss is about'. I would like to point out that I was let down by 1PW and offended by Smother's (mainly) due to the fact that it made ME feel uncomfortable. I would like those people that say it was 'harmless fun' to tell me that when they have suffered some form of bullying to such a large degree (that I did), only to go to a show which promotes and condones such actions.

[Kenny McBride]

Steve Austin Vs McMahon says hi

There were very few controversial moments in there. The worst was probably Austin holding a gun to McMahon's head, but in the end it was clear he was just trying to scare the old bastard. Besides, he was at least theoretically justified in his actions because McMahon had repeatedly tried to fuck with him in outrageous ways.

Andy Kaufman says hi

A cocky, smartass actor/comedian mocks local women and local hero shows him what happens when you mess with the SOUTH~. Not exactly controversial.

Mike Tyson says hi

It was controversial to use a convicted rapist and eventually to make him a babyface. Still, as someone else said, it was Mike Fucking Tyson.

Undertaker says hi

A zombie character is controversial?

Goldust says hi

Show me a time Goldust drew a dime. Seriously, one time and you win the internet.

Eddie Gilvert USSR flag says hi

Sneaky bastard heel turns on his country in the midst of a (Cold) war? That's not controversial. That's just heat.

Nation of Domination say hi

I refer you to my Goldust comments.

Controversial moments create money, sterotypes included. And throught out wrestling it has been used. I don't condone it, I actually don't like it, but it is used as it works.

Stereotypes can be entertaining characters, or at least they could be. In the modern era, I think fewer and fewer people buy them, but that's beside the point. Personally, I think the borderline racist portrayal of Samoans are hard-headed savages that persists in WWE to this day is not a good thing and you can bet I'd be pissed off if anyone started calling Bobby Lashley a nigger. So what makes this any different? At least with characters from Gorgeous George to Goldust you knew they'd eventually turn babyface and the perceptions would change. When you've got babyfaces using a pretty explicit slur on two heels for no other reason than to get the crowd chanting at them, there's something far wrong.

[JNLister]

Kaufman didn't draw. Crowds actually fell during his appearances. That's actually true for about 90% of the artistically classic Memphis angles such as the empty arena match and Gilbert running over Lawler.Controversy doesn't create money in itself. If it leads to people wanting to pay to see a future match, it can lead to money. But in a lot of cases, it either puts fans off coming back, fails to interest them either way, or causes problems in the real world that hurt the company.

[Loki]

Undertaker says hi

Never drew a dime.

Oh come on. Even I have paid to go and see Undertaker wrestle.

[This thread scares me]

Beats Kid Kash going on about A2M in the offensive stakes

...ohhh, do tell. Im not familiar with this one

[This thread scares me]

Andy Kaufman says hi

A cocky, smartass actor/comedian mocks local women and local hero shows him what happens when you mess with the SOUTH~. Not exactly controversial.

Being Scottish it wouldnt be controversial to you Kenny,but men beating up on women was certainly an eyebrow raiser,expecially back then. Edited October 18, 2007 by bootcleaner

[Guest May 19th]

When you know where the term 'faggot' comes from, you'll find it to be a completely unacceptable word to use. Full stop.

Educate us

Seconded. I want to be edumacated.

Basically, it means 'kindling'. The Nazis used homosexuals to get the fire pumped up enough to start chucking on Jews.

I really, really doubt that's where the use of the word came from. Faggot as a derogatory word for homosexual predates the Second World War by some margin. It most probably derives from the Yiddish word for homosexual "faygele", or possibly from the use of the word "fag" in British public schools to denote junior boys who have to run errands for senior boys.

I wouldn't think the fine Southern gentlemen in question even know the true meaning of the word as per where it derives from, they just know how offensive it is.

I believe 'Faggots' derived from the food.It's a pink sausage which you can buy in any supermarket.Some clever fella obviously cracked a joke about liking pink sausages and the rest is history**I have no idea if this is true or not but it sounds plausable.

[tiger_rick]

Undertaker says hi

Never drew a dime.

Oh come on. Even I have paid to go and see Undertaker wrestle.

He's not at the level of Goldust, but he's never really drawn, has he? He was a big part of the product when it was shit and when it was great, when business was great and when it was in the toilet. He didn't really effect business at all. He drew money with great talent and didn't with crap talent. There's no evidence to suggest that Undertaker = money.

[MoChatra]

DX were controversial, and they drew.As John said, controversy is all well and good, but it needs to serve a purpose. Controversy on its own won't just make money.

[HarmonicGenerator]

Kaufman didn't draw. Crowds actually fell during his appearances. That's actually true for about 90% of the artistically classic Memphis angles such as the empty arena match and Gilbert running over Lawler.

Isn't the lack of crowds kind of the point of an Empty Arena match?... just saying.

[Little Johnny]

It wasn't done in a way to intimidate people. It was just harmless fun.

If little Johnny went to that show, chanted "faggot" as if it's an OK thing to yell at someone, then does the same thing at school to a fellow pupil, little Johnny's going to get a bollocking from teacher.

I learned my lesson alright.Don't worry, it was always good touch.

[Kenny McBride]

Undertaker says hi

Never drew a dime.

Oh come on. Even I have paid to go and see Undertaker wrestle.

He's not at the level of Goldust, but he's never really drawn, has he? He was a big part of the product when it was shit and when it was great, when business was great and when it was in the toilet. He didn't really effect business at all. He drew money with great talent and didn't with crap talent. There's no evidence to suggest that Undertaker = money.

Undertaker drew some of the biggest buyrates of the "Attitude Era."And Kaufman was hardly "beating up women." Everyone knew it was a comedy gimmick.

[Deaq]

I would have throught before Austin made it big and we were use to seeing it his gimmick was considerd controversial at the time. Eric Bishoff in the way WcW was run was as well, Raven and Sandman's fued had its moments as did the whole of the ECW basicly. Jake's Snake bitting Randy Savage.

[darkship]

Undertaker says hi

Never drew a dime.

Oh come on. Even I have paid to go and see Undertaker wrestle.

He's not at the level of Goldust, but he's never really drawn, has he? He was a big part of the product when it was shit and when it was great, when business was great and when it was in the toilet. He didn't really effect business at all. He drew money with great talent and didn't with crap talent. There's no evidence to suggest that Undertaker = money.

Weren't there reports that people were leaving the Smackdown! tapings in their droves following the 'Taker match, and he wasn't even the main event? Surely Taker's feuds with Austin and Michaels drew (although granted, it's Austin and Michaels) and his feud with the previously-unknown Kane was commercially successful?As for the main topic. I'm bisexual, but I'm well aware that wrestling isn't exactly tolerant of homosexuality- sure, Rico was a face, but an outrageously OTT gay character; you can guarantee that the mooted Chris "Only Gay In The Village" Kanyon and Orlando "Intergender Love Triangle" Jordan storylines would have either/or (a) not gotten over, (b) turned dramatically into Wrestlecrap, © depicted the wrestler at their centres as a screaming queen, rather than a badass who happened to be gay. I think the only homosexuality-based storyline that got over and didn't depict either character as WRONG was the Mickie James-Trish Stratus unrequited love story. Even then Mickie was depicted as a lovelorn nutcase and y'know, it's two hot women, of course it got over (I assume doing the same storyline with, e.g., Matt Hardy and Brian Kendrick wouldn't get the same reaction). So I'm well aware that wrestling is, at its centre, essentially redneck and that a Loser Must Wear Dress match is probably going to invoke a few insinuations of homosexuality. However, a face wrestler coming out accusing people of being "ass up, face down, pillow-biting faggots"? That's going too far and, for me, would have automatically turned Tighe and Simmonz face against such idiotic comments.And this is from a man named TRACEY?