The Transphobes, Terfs and Assorted Anti-LGBTQ+ Sorts thread

[Devon Malcolm]

4 minutes ago, Chili said:

I see. Look thanks everyone for pitching in to help me get my head round it. I think something I genuinely struggle with is understanding that people are absolutely horrid fuckers and how that behaviour doesn't absolutely ruin them emotionally.

Understanding them is not something anybody should waste their time doing considering they themselves have no interest understanding trans people.

[Chili]

1 minute ago, Devon Malcolm said:

Understanding them is not something anybody should waste their time doing considering they themselves have no interest understanding trans people.

Yeah I get you, I think I mean more... I just wish and expect better in people and everything is so openly hostile now that I just can't get my head around it all. I'm not very good at finding the words, sorry.

[westlondonmist]

12 hours ago, Chili said:

Yeah I get you, I think I mean more... I just wish and expect better in people and everything is so openly hostile now that I just can't get my head around it all. I'm not very good at finding the words, sorry.

Yeah I think back to the 90s and early 00'sand while there was casual use of homophobic and racial slurs, I'm not sure it was agressive and heavily down to just plain ignorance (not that it made it okay). Maybe I was just too young, but I don't remember outright hate being so open, it obviously existed, but it now has an open podium. It's fucking scary.

[deathrey]

I had a discussion about this with an old school friend of mine, I am brown and he  is gay and is now a fairly well known drag queen. We both were in unanimous agreement that the late 90's and 2000's were actually peak for tolerance of others. Both of us experienced some name calling etc but nothing sustained and nothing 'nasty'.  Since Brexit we both felt a real shift in more open and deeper prejudice that has accelerated since Covid in my opinion, and is now the worst I've ever known it. I don't feel a lot of hope for the future if I'm honest.

Edited January 22 by deathrey

[Carbomb]

10 minutes ago, deathrey said:

I had a discussion about this with an old school friend of mine, I am brown he was gay and is now a fairly well known drag queen. We both were in unanimous agreement that the late 90's and 2000's were actually peak for tolerance of others. Both of us experienced some name calling etc but nothing sustained and nothing 'nasty'.  Since Brexit we both felt a real shift in more open and deeper prejudice that accelerated since Covid in my opinion and is now the worst I've ever known it. I don't feel a lot of hope for the future if I'm honest.

Genuinely, am the same. 

What particularly angers me about Starmer and his bunch of snivellers is that they have the power to bury that cunt Farage many times over for all the shit he's done, and instead they're laying down the framework of authoritarianism for him to exploit, like his masters Trump and Putin, if he gets into power, which is looking increasingly and disturbingly likely now. They're potentially gifting him his own ICEstapo.

[Chili]

I feel it's a fucking stupid example but I always think about Coronation Street creating Hayley Cropper in 1998. She was initially written to be somewhat of a joke until they realised there was actually more you could do with her and tell a story. I was only 11 at the time so I'd love to know what the actual reaction was to having a trans character in a soap opera, which would garner a different reaction than in a movie. I'm taking a punt there really wasn't that much blowback or outrage related to it (beyond uneducated people making jokes) and this was almost 30 years ago. In the last few years, if they had brought a character in like her, a nice, good natured positive character who was trans, people would be losing their pathetic minds about it and bellowing all the usual Helen Lovejoy bollocks.

Edited January 22 by Chili

[deathrey]

12 minutes ago, Carbomb said:

Genuinely, am the same. 

What particularly angers me about Starmer and his bunch of snivellers is that they have the power to bury that cunt Farage many times over for all the shit he's done, and instead they're laying down the framework of authoritarianism for him to exploit, like his masters Trump and Putin, if he gets into power, which is looking increasingly and disturbingly likely now. They're potentially gifting him his own ICEstapo.

Well this is the biggest fear isn't it. I look at what is happening in the US and it honestly terrifies me. My eldest son is autistic and semi-verbal, he's 5 years old and I've seen videos of 5 year olds being 'arrested' by ICE and it terrifies me. The fact that this is even happening at all, on top of that, if it was my son he would disappear in to an untraceable system and I would probably never see him again.  I often think if I were kicked out of the UK, where would I even go?! I was born here and lived here my whole life. I'm Sikh so India doesn't want me, and it's not a safe place for Sikh's to be. I have no heritage in any other country. My kids only really speak and understand English, I'd end up an asylum seeker or refugee. It seems crazy to me that I even worry about this. In 2026.

@Chili a really good point you make about Hayley Croper, the character was introduced as a bit of a joke I think but became hugely popular and was in the show for years, she was presented iirc as a normal person who just happened to be trans (exactly as trans people are). She went on to become a really beloved character, one that wasn't meant to be a long term character if I remember rightly but was so popular, they kept her.

Edited January 22 by deathrey

[Lorne Malvo]

9 minutes ago, Chili said:

I feel it's a fucking stupid example but I always think about Coronation Street creating Hayley Cropper in 1998. 

I think it's a pretty good example. I think this may have been mentioned on here before but Nadia from Big Brother 2005 is another. At the time there was the expected jokes but there didn't seem to be the level of vitriol and hatred you'd see now. She was championed for her bravery and her story whereas now there would be people protesting outside Elstree foaming at the mouth.

[westlondonmist]

22 minutes ago, Chili said:

I feel it's a fucking stupid example but I always think about Coronation Street creating Hayley Cropper in 1998. She was initially written to be somewhat of a joke until they realised there was actually more you could do with her and tell a story. I was only 11 at the time so I'd love to know what the actual reaction was to having a trans character in a soap opera, which would garner a different reaction than in a movie. I'm taking a punt there really wasn't that much blowback or outrage related to it (beyond uneducated people making jokes) and this was almost 30 years ago. In the last few years, if they had brought a character in like her, a nice, good natured positive character who was trans, people would be losing their pathetic minds about it and bellowing all the usual Helen Lovejoy bollocks.

Discussed this with people before. A fairly conservative man initially rejects her, but realises it doesn't matter because he loves her. She even later changes her birth certificate and officially marries him. I get it's Coronation Street but it was probably fairly well done, for the time at least especially as the only other TV show I can remember bringing such a thing up was IT Crowd and look how Linehan treats that.

[Chili]

Yeah Nadia was obviously an arsehole because she was in the Lip Gloss Bitches (Jungle Cats 4 Life), but nobody wasn't levelling that kind of shit at her. I think every week there was an eviction, Davina would give them the iggy about Nadia and nobody seemed that bothered, just your general surprise at something you probably didn't think that much about.

[deathrey]

The only show that I can think of that created some real controversy, but not necessarily hate if I remember correctly is the dating show from 2004 'There's something about Miriam'. I don't know if any of you remember that?

Edited January 22 by deathrey

[Chili]

4 minutes ago, deathrey said:

The only show that I can think of that created some really controversy, but not necessarily hate if I remember correctly is the dating show from 2004 'There's something about Miriam'. I don't know if any of you remember that?

Miriam later died. Also the show was built around the pay off of 'HA! SUCKERS. SHE'S A MAN! DO YOU FEEL SILLY LADS. DO YOU FEEL DECIEVED EH?!!'

[Devon Malcolm]

8 minutes ago, deathrey said:

The only show that I can think of that created some really controversy, but not necessarily hate if I remember correctly is the dating show from 2004 'There's something about Miriam'. I don't know if any of you remember that?

Yeah. It was basically if a certain scene from The Crying Game was stretched out into a reality TV series.

[SuperBacon]

2 minutes ago, deathrey said:

The only show that I can think of that created some really controversy, but not necessarily hate if I remember correctly is the dating show from 2004 'There's something about Miriam'. I don't know if any of you remember that?

@Scott Malbranque does.

As an aside, I think a lot if this is how it's written as well. I'm not going to condone the Sunny writers for making quite a few references to a "tranny" in some of those early episodes, as well as having an episode about Dee dating a retarded person. They can do that themselves, and there are plenty of instances of them addressing it if people want to look them all up.

What I can say though using that as an example is that the characters in that show are absolute arseholes/losers who 100% would use that word so you're not really supposed to be looking at them for morality or guidance are you? You're not supposed to empathise with them, and they also don't use Carmen as a punchline, and that's reflected in later series when *Spoiler alert* Dee is her surrogate.

It's not the writers intention to offend or punch down in my opinion, whereas im not sure thats alwsys the case with other shows. Its always about presentation. 

They did go on years later to also expertly solve "the bathroom issue" as well  and will freely admit that they possibly wouldn't make those choices these days. 

Regarding Hayley, again it was really well written. IIRC the only person who was shitty about it on the show was Janice Battersby and everyone hated her as she was a prick. So that helped.

[Carbomb]

There was also Dana International - I remember that the only outcry around the time was from the conservative Jewish Israeli quarter. Everyone else seemed pretty ambivalent at worst, and positive at best.