Paid Members Lion_of_the_Midlands Posted July 17, 2012 Paid Members Share Posted July 17, 2012 Garcia got lucky in that fight. He was being soundly beaten until he clocked Khan behind the ear, and even then he had major problems putting him away. I'd still pick Khan to win that fight seven or eight times out of ten.  Garcia had trouble putting him away because the ref was helping Kahn no end. After the first knockdown he gave him the 8 count, asked him twice if he was alright then asked him to raise his gloves, when Kahn didn't raise his gloves the ref grabbed his gloves and raised them for him. The ref seemed to me to be giving Kahn as much time as he could to recover. For me Kahn was lucky the ref let him continue after the first knockdown.  Kahn may be a great boxer but a tendency to get needlessly drawn into a brawl will always be his undoing. It will make for exciting fights to watch but he will be lucky to win 50% of them Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Egg Shen Posted July 17, 2012 Author Paid Members Share Posted July 17, 2012 No power? He's got eighteen knock outs in twenty six fights, and has put away guys like Judah and Malignaggi which isn't too shabby. To say he has no power is pretty ridiculous. As for his fight with Limond, anyone with a decent set of eyeballs can see that he's a completely different fighter from the twenty year old kid who fought Limond five years ago. Khan still shows some of the very same mistakes he used to make back as a kid in the ITV days. Did you actually follow his fights? he wasn't knocking guys out cold, he was overwhelming them with fast flurries, it will only get you so far. Who has he KOed, bar Judah (and even then, to some it was controversial)  see, i don't personally see the cockiness or arrogance? Khan's confident and says a few things in camps (for eg. he guaranteed he's knock out Garcia) but i just don't see it.  Despite his fame i've always thought he's stayed fairly grounded. You serious? the guys so far up his own arse, he's also a totally childish attention seeker, and although I know most boxers ae full of themselves to an extent, they arent all as retarded as Khan with there statements.  To quote a poster over at ESB, Khan is like Theo Walcott. "Both had lots of promise very young but never developed beyond the core attributes that brought them to public attention (speed and marketability). Both over-managed and not sufficiently humble to take a step back and relearn technique" where's the proof?  post me some videos/comments made by Khan where he comes off as a 'childish attention seeker'...  here's a little video of the next potential superstar in boxing Adrien Broner: 2 Days  now that man is fucking cocky. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Egg Shen Posted July 17, 2012 Author Paid Members Share Posted July 17, 2012 Bit of a controversial one here! What value do the UKFF'ers put into the inbetween round advice given by corner men to their boxers? I know that Freddie Roach has a tonne of respect within boxing circles, But do you feel that given the desperate place Khan was in as he sat in his corner just prior to the finish, That a barely audible Roach could help him as much as another coach could have done? Even in the footage of Khan's training camp, The producer had to use subtitles so the viewers could understand what Freddie was trying to say. Obviously i mean no disrespect to Roach, I just felt that given the seriousness of the situation that if you believe corner men can sometimes dig a fighter out of exreme danger, Was it a bad idea for Roach to have Khan's ear? I am not saying Roach has nothing left to offer boxing, Just that he must now think of stepping down from his head trainer role on fight night. that sounds harsh but i hear what your saying. Â It's pretty much an un-answerable question though, nobody knows what a fighter wants to hear in a corner except for the fighter himself. This is a case of where a team/corner need to look out and know what's in the fighter's best interests. Â As for Freddie's speech, it might be subtitling when he's in a gym situation or whatever but when he's talking to the camera i never have trouble understanding what he's saying so im assuming it's the same when he's talking to someone directly to their face. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeavyT Posted July 17, 2012 Share Posted July 17, 2012 (edited) In regards to EBB, it is more how he says things than what he says. For example, at a MMA event in 2006 they asked him how he would do in a MMA bout. Now he is not going to say he would get destroyed is he, but instead of saying "I think I could do well" or "I would have the striking advantage" instead he said "I will knock them all out"  It does not bother me any, I like his confidence, but others really do not. Plus, I get told often of stories where he acts up his own arse to people and acts like a drama queen, could be bullshit but I have heard a lot of stuff. The confidence and 'arrogance' is the same as that displayed by the likes of David Haye, Ali, Mayorga, Roy Jones, Floyd Mayweather and others though, isn't it? I honestly believe that the reason Khan gets shit for it, and that Hamed got shit for it, especially in the UK, is because they're of Asian descent.  There's an element of racism involved that we don't see with other white or black fighters I believe. maybe in some areas, wouldnt say so round my way. Ive heard people call him a "paki" but these are the same people who call all Asians in the UK that. Everyone seemed to love Khan when he was a humble young man on ITV, slowly people turned on him as he got cockier and cockier, and after he moved to Sky Box Office (a HUGE mistake on his teams part, commanding that much money for commonwealth title fights or whatever it was) and got KOed, thats when I noticed the hate for him.  Fair play, guys like David Haye are cocky, but he also doesn't come across as an inarticulate little boy when he is. "i earn more moneyz than you ever will lol" and all the other fucking stupid twitter posts, off the cuff comments he's made make him seem like a stuck up teenager...  its harsh of Froch to say he'd retire in Khan's shoes, but he didnt look special against Mcloskey (who just lost to an old DeMarcus Corley), was holding on for dear life with Maidana, and took a bit of a beating for a while there against Peterson. Add the Prescott KO (and we have to admit, even if it was before he teamed up with Roach that was BAD), Gomez knockdown, and him being pretty much saved against Willie Limond, its plain to see he's never going to be a top P4Per. Hes still young, yes, but he has a lot of mileage for his age I would say, and if I was in his position, I'd have a serious think about my future. Edited July 17, 2012 by HeavyT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators PowerButchi Posted July 17, 2012 Moderators Share Posted July 17, 2012 Everyone seemed to love Khan when he was a humble young man on ITV, slowly people turned on him as he got cockier and cockier  I'm going to play a bit of devil's advocate here, but maybe that's because some people like Asians to "know their place" as it were. If an Asian's going to be successful and make some money, he better be damned bashful about it.  That kind of thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members wandshogun09 Posted July 17, 2012 Paid Members Share Posted July 17, 2012 I'd say there's probably some truth to that. Â In the 90s people loved the seemingly dopey, humble Frank Bruno but hated the more successful, yet arrogant and showboating Chris Eubank. Going back way further, Jack Johnson, Boxing's first black heavyweight champion, was widely hated by the white American public for his success and mocking opponents while battering them. Yet the quiet and polite and almost sheepish Joe Louis was popular and had a lot of support from the Yank public and media. Â That was obviously a much different time and racial tension with black people in America was high. Ali, Frazier, Foreman and Leonard among others changed people's perceptions of black athletes. But I do think for some, seeing an Asian boxer be succesful and show a lot of confidence, even maybe a bit of cockiness, doesn't sit well and they won't tolerate it like they would off a white or black boxer. Whether they admit it or not deep down I think there is some of that 'knowing their place' bullshit mentality for some. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members WWFChilli Posted July 17, 2012 Paid Members Share Posted July 17, 2012 People don't like arrogant twats. It's in most peoples nature. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members wandshogun09 Posted July 17, 2012 Paid Members Share Posted July 17, 2012 Yeah that's right but we're talking about a sport where most of the participants almost have to have some level of whatever you want to call it - cockiness, arrogance, confidence, self belief. Â I can see with someone like Naseem or Eubank, why they would get under people's skin. The taunting, the way they would talk, the ridiculously over the top entrances. It was pretty much their aim to provoke a reaction from the audience or the opponent. Â But with Khan I don't see any particularly massively overbearing arrogance. Loads of boxers are way cockier and it gets overlooked or laughed off. Seems like it takes a lot less for a Khan comment to be deemed cocky than it does a Froch or Haye comment. Â None of this is aimed at anyone on here. I'm defo not saying if you don't like Khan you must be racist. I don't get that impression off anyone here. It's more from people who don't follow Boxing all that closely, which makes the cocky stuff more puzzling to me because they're not seeing much to base it on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Egg Shen Posted July 17, 2012 Author Paid Members Share Posted July 17, 2012 Khan is not even in the same universe of cockiness when you look at guys like Floyd Mayweather, Adrien Broner, Pauli Mallignaggi etc. Â Joe Calazghe was arrogant and by all accounts he's abit of an arse away from the ring, he was cocky in the ring too and he's a national hero! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Posted July 17, 2012 Share Posted July 17, 2012 maybe in some areas, wouldnt say so round my way. Ive heard people call him a "paki" but these are the same people who call all Asians in the UK that. You wouldn't say so round your way, yet you then go on to say that there are people who refer to him as a "Paki"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Natural Posted July 17, 2012 Share Posted July 17, 2012 (edited) Yeah that's right but we're talking about a sport where most of the participants almost have to have some level of whatever you want to call it - cockiness, arrogance, confidence, self belief. I can see with someone like Naseem or Eubank, why they would get under people's skin. The taunting, the way they would talk, the ridiculously over the top entrances. It was pretty much their aim to provoke a reaction from the audience or the opponent.  But with Khan I don't see any particularly massively overbearing arrogance. Loads of boxers are way cockier and it gets overlooked or laughed off. Seems like it takes a lot less for a Khan comment to be deemed cocky than it does a Froch or Haye comment.  None of this is aimed at anyone on here. I'm defo not saying if you don't like Khan you must be racist. I don't get that impression off anyone here. It's more from people who don't follow Boxing all that closely, which makes the cocky stuff more puzzling to me because they're not seeing much to base it on.  I liked Eubank but I don't like Khan. I wasn't a big fan of Khan to begin with but I liked him even less with his moaning after losing to Lamont Peterson. My Dad likes Khan but even he didn't like how he acted after the Peterson fight. I don't follow boxing like I do MMA, I only watch a big boxing fight occasionally. Edited July 17, 2012 by The Natural Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gooner Posted July 17, 2012 Share Posted July 17, 2012 Khan doesn't help himself when he makes comment like "I'm a superstar" to the world. He's a good fighter and has a big heart but needs to improve a lot if he is ever to go down as a great once his career is done. Some of his comments at times are childish, but he isn't alone in that. I think Froch was wrong to come out with "he would retire if he was Khan comments" I know what he was trying to get at, but you don't retire when your 25 because you lost a world title fight when getting stopped on your feet. Khan still has plenty of time in front of him and come back stronger for the loss. He made a mistake and got punished royally for it. It's boxing, most of the greatest fighters of all time have bad losses on there records. I can see why Khan rubs some the wrong way, I'm not his biggest fan but I do like his boxing style and he has a good attitude when it comes to being the best he can be. He needs to get his camp sorted out, he was sparring some really big guys in camp, which I found a little bizarre and he also needs to realise he isn't Pacman in the ring. Hopefully he can get the rematch straight away against Garcia and put things right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FUM Posted July 17, 2012 Share Posted July 17, 2012 I liked Khan back when he was doing his Olympic thing and his first two or three fights, after that he started to think he was better than he actually is and can't just accept when he loses without making some sort of excuse. For me, he started all his arrogance and cockiness before he'd actually done anything of note as a professional, and it drove me to dislike him. He may have but it seems to the "casual fan", who only really know the bigger names, as if he hadn't beaten anyone to back up everything he was saying. Â I watch the big fights by the way but am no means a massive "know every fighter" fan of boxing, so feel free to rip my comments to shreds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith Houchen Posted July 17, 2012 Share Posted July 17, 2012 Will probably mean nothing to many, but. COVENTRY boxing hero Richard Evatt - once described as Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeavyT Posted July 17, 2012 Share Posted July 17, 2012 (edited) maybe in some areas, wouldnt say so round my way. Ive heard people call him a "paki" but these are the same people who call all Asians in the UK that. You wouldn't say so round your way, yet you then go on to say that there are people who refer to him as a "Paki"? Ive overheard idiots at the pub using that word, and they probably would hate Khan by default. I dont know anyone personally whos as racist as that, but none of them like him. they all just think he's a cocky prick. Â Mayweather's a cocky prick, but he doesn't get rattled in fights the whole time. plenty of people hate David Haye for that shit with his toe too you know, and plenty hated Froch when he was in Calzaghe's shadow. If Joe had that attitude when he had a few close shaves and 2 bad KO losses, a lot less people would let him get away with it. Hatton got loads of stick for the whole "bet your house on it" before getting KOed by Pacman, and him subsequently being a sore loser after that.... no different to Khan's moaning after the Peterson fight, and now calling Garcia's win "a lucky punch" and demanding a rematch that he doesn't deserve. Â Khan's not as good as he thinks he is, thats the problem.... maybe Ricky Hatton wasn't either, but he had the football crowd behind him, and was actually considered a P4P top 10 fighter. Khan's never been close. Edited July 17, 2012 by HeavyT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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