AEW TV 2025 Discussion

[Guest]

1 hour ago, BomberPat said:

100%. I think they rushed to him challenging Moxley too early. For me, the story should always have been Hangman learning to fight for something bigger than himself then challenging Moxley, and AEW rallying behind him, because he's just as violent and unhinged as Mox, only this time, he's their guy.

I don't mind him challenging, but he can't win yet.

Ultimately, Hangman is always just trying to overcome his insecurities. He did that with the Omega feud, but then he lost the belt and lost his way a bit. His initial conflict with Swerve was about losing his spot to the guy, and those gnawing doubts came back, and then Swerve invaded his house, and he suddenly felt like he couldn't protect his family, and he went off the deep end because that foundational part of his manhood was shattered, so he's just thrashing around and overcompensating, because he beat Swerve and it didn't get any better (because ultimately, Swerve wasn't the problem, he was). He's taking his issues out on everyone else because he hasn't figured out that he's the problem, he's just lashing out because he feels vulnerable (which I think Daniels has almost explicitly said).  He needs to triumph over those as part of winning the belt again, but that's a slowish burn. Initially he's got to start letting people in and trusting again without going so over the top at every perceived slight (as seen in the Jarrett feud, and the fact that this match with Daniels is a Texas Death Match over nothing). I think your idea of having him and Kenny against the Bucks would hit that really nicely.

I'd have loved the direction you're suggesting, but there doesn't feel like much chance of it now. 

[tiger_rick]

Big picture, it's not really exciting. There's no end game in sight that gets you pumped or massive match on a big show that you can't wait for. Kenny & Okada at All In isn't that, if they think it is. However, during Collision, I sat and thought about the "Maximum Carnage" Dynamite coming up with the Women's Gauntlet, Mox v Hobbs, Kenny v Cage and Christian v Hook and I can't see how anyone isn't excited for that. They're advertising Hurt Syndicate in a Trios match and a Ricochet interview too. 

I don't know how you can be so good week to week and so bad big picture. This company really might be WCW. 

Edited January 14, 2025 by tiger_rick

[BomberPat]

1 hour ago, Duke said:

I don't mind him challenging, but he can't win yet.

Ultimately, Hangman is always just trying to overcome his insecurities. He did that with the Omega feud, but then he lost the belt and lost his way a bit. His initial conflict with Swerve was about losing his spot to the guy, and those gnawing doubts came back, and then Swerve invaded his house, and he suddenly felt like he couldn't protect his family, and he went off the deep end because that foundational part of his manhood was shattered, so he's just thrashing around and overcompensating, because he beat Swerve and it didn't get any better (because ultimately, Swerve wasn't the problem, he was). He's taking his issues out on everyone else because he hasn't figured out that he's the problem, he's just lashing out because he feels vulnerable (which I think Daniels has almost explicitly said).  He needs to triumph over those as part of winning the belt again, but that's a slowish burn. Initially he's got to start letting people in and trusting again without going so over the top at every perceived slight (as seen in the Jarrett feud, and the fact that this match with Daniels is a Texas Death Match over nothing). I think your idea of having him and Kenny against the Bucks would hit that really nicely.

What I loved about Hangman's promo on Collision - and something that only comes of him knowing his character inside and out in a way so few wrestlers ever do - is that he let on that the heart of all of this is his shame. It's not that he got angry at Swerve, it's that he was ashamed that he couldn't protect his family. And you're right, that's a negative emotion for him to overcome, it's back to Man vs. Man and overcoming his own shortcomings as the heart of his character, and that's where Hangman is best. Him going straight to the Texas Death Match over the slightest provocation, rather than allowing things to escalate that way, tells you as much about how little he values himself as it does how violent he's prepared to get towards his opponent.

There is good stuff happening in AEW, but it feels like every week I have the same complaints. It used to feel like I had a few different issues, and it always felt like someone in AEW was working to resolve them. But when it's the same thing for months, you start to feel like it's by design, and I start to worry that they've had so much bad faith criticism and grifters going after them for the most insignificant reasons that they've just shut themselves off to even the valid criticism and are pretending they're on the right track. 

The thing that makes me turn to WCW comparisons is that it feels like so little matters right now. The Conglomeration vanishing. The Trios Titles being a non-factor. Angles being dropped all over the place. I think having Kenny Omega back is a good start, and hopefully having Eddie Kingston back will be likewise, in terms of just having someone on the show who you believe cares about what they're doing and believes what they're saying, and for whom everything matters. But even then, I'm worried that King becomes just another wrestler on the show that they inexplicably never give live mic time to, just like Mark Briscoe, and that they're going to bring the Young Bucks back to TV and completely handwave away that the last time we saw them they were trying to permanently injure Kenny Omega, and just go back to them being mates. 

[LaGoosh]

Garcia/Shibata from Collision was really bloody great. He's not getting much attention but I think you could make the argument that Garcia is a top 5 wrestler in the US right now. And if not - he will be soon. 

[Infinity Land]

Just because it has recently been touched on how badly some of AEW's promotional efforts have been lately. The first tickets for Dynamite in Atlanta will go on sale tomorrow, just under 3 weeks until show time. The week before WWE will also be in Atlanta for RAW and they then added an NXT taping at Center Stage. All of which have been on sale for quite some time.

With bad booking there can be a defense of personal taste, placating egos and injuries. Something like this its really just a blind spot of a billionaire's kid that's never had to worry about the financial juggling that can be needed to go to shows.

 

[LaGoosh]

America is a pretty big place...booking somewhere on short notice about 5 minutes after WWE has been in town seems pretty deranged to me. Could they really not find anywhere else? Times like this I'd rather they just run Dailys Place instead of just throwing together a last minute show.

[tiger_rick]

I would love to hear their take on this stuff. It's a pity there's fuck all journalism in pro-wrestling. I want to know why. That looks like a great little arena. Atlanta is a wrestling town. It all makes sense. Why are tickets not out ages ago? Why is this not promoted more prominently in their TV spots and socials?

My suspicion is that it just isn't a priority because they're sitting pretty on their TV deal and they are happy shooting half an arena, so have no desire to put more effort and better people into their promotions crew - if they even have one. I'd love to know though.

12 minutes ago, LaGoosh said:

America is a pretty big place...booking somewhere on short notice about 5 minutes after WWE has been in town seems pretty deranged to me. 

I think they're probably fairly comfortable that they have an audience that differs to the WWE crowd and also fairly at peace with the fact that they don't draw anyway, so 5 minutes or 6 months makes fuck all difference. Again, though, we don't know. Someone credible asking some questions would be nice.

[DavidB6937]

32 minutes ago, Infinity Land said:

Something like this its really just a blind spot of a billionaire's kid that's never had to worry about the financial juggling that can be needed to go to shows.

Yeah that's the thing that struck me straight away. When I'm even considering going to a wrestling show it takes a lot of life planning and financial and trying to work out if anyone wants to go with me, and then their planning etc too. Everything is more expensive now and life's difficult so going to something like this has to be a far more considered purchase now than it may have been years ago. I doubt I'm the only one. Not to mention we're just the other side of Christmas too.

[Supremo]

Yeah, say what you want about when they’re putting tickets on sale and going to markets so soon after WWE, but these venues look amazing!

Provided they can paper them, they’ll look great!

[Infinity Land]

18 minutes ago, LaGoosh said:

America is a pretty big place...booking somewhere on short notice about 5 minutes after WWE has been in town seems pretty deranged to me. Could they really not find anywhere else? Times like this I'd rather they just run Dailys Place instead of just throwing together a last minute show.

Show was announced in mid-December. They had announced shows before and after that date in mid-November so must have had some idea they were running there. Just never bothered putting tickets on sale. There are still shows that were announced back in November that they haven't bothered putting on sale yet.

[BomberPat]

48 minutes ago, tiger_rick said:

I would love to hear their take on this stuff. It's a pity there's fuck all journalism in pro-wrestling. I want to know why. That looks like a great little arena. Atlanta is a wrestling town. It all makes sense. Why are tickets not out ages ago? Why is this not promoted more prominently in their TV spots and socials?

I suspect that being there just after WWE might be part of the issue; I wonder if WWE have some kind of exclusivity clause - they certainly do for individual buildings, meaning that no other wrestling promotion can run or advertise there within X amount of time of WWE. I don't know enough about the ownership of American venues, or of American municipal politics, to know whether it would even be possible for them to get the same kind of deal covering multiple venues in the city rather than just the one they're running, which would prevent AEW from advertising shows in the same area until much closer to the time. But of course the solution to that is "don't follow WWE around the country, run somewhere else".

I assume what's more likely is that they moved to a lot of smaller venues and the infrastructure isn't there - they got a lot of criticism for running massive venues and not being able to fill them, but those venues will have been booked months in advance, you can't just back out. I imagine these shows were set up much more haphazardly and with much less notice.

[LaGoosh]

There's a venue in Tennessee called The Caverns, it sits about 1,000 people. It's basically a giant cave where bands play. It looks absolutely incredible. Places like that is where AEW should do shows. Concentrate 100% on unique look rather than capacity.

[tiger_rick]

2 hours ago, LaGoosh said:

There's a venue in Tennessee called The Caverns, it sits about 1,000 people. It's basically a giant cave where bands play. It looks absolutely incredible. Places like that is where AEW should do shows. Concentrate 100% on unique look rather than capacity.

I think solely is a risk. Obviously, they need to be in venues that look great, they can shoot the whole arena and turn the lights up, that's important. But they also don't want to pigeon-hole themselves as a very secondary promotion. They still need to be the alternative to attract new fans and new talent. Part of that is going to be feeling like a big time promotion and although they don't fill these arenas they are booking, they should be showing the ambition to fill them - to fix the problems they have rather than giving up.

Two things we do know from history is that there will always be fans who grow out of WWE. There historically have been tens of millions of them. AEW need to be in a position to capture those people. Also, WWE's bubble will burst. It always does. Again, they need to be in a position to capitalise. 

I enjoy the energy you get in those full small arenas but I completely understand why they don't want that to be normal.

[LaGoosh]

26 minutes ago, tiger_rick said:

I think solely is a risk. Obviously, they need to be in venues that look great, they can shoot the whole arena and turn the lights up, that's important. But they also don't want to pigeon-hole themselves as a very secondary promotion. They still need to be the alternative to attract new fans and new talent. Part of that is going to be feeling like a big time promotion and although they don't fill these arenas they are booking, they should be showing the ambition to fill them - to fix the problems they have rather than giving up.

Two things we do know from history is that there will always be fans who grow out of WWE. There historically have been tens of millions of them. AEW need to be in a position to capture those people. Also, WWE's bubble will burst. It always does. Again, they need to be in a position to capitalise. 

I enjoy the energy you get in those full small arenas but I completely understand why they don't want that to be normal.

Good points as always.

Perhaps it'd make more sense to use venues as a way to differentiate between Dynamite and Collision. Dynamite is the A-show so it has those big time looking venues while Collision you put in the unique and visually interesting venues but sacrifice crowd size. It'd go a way to making Collision feel like its own thing.

Edited January 15, 2025 by LaGoosh

[organizedkaos]

Not watching Jericho matches or segments has significantly improved AEW television. Plus somehow that 15 min really livens up the whole rhythm.

For Collision I watched Gabe Kid vs. Kenny Omega as the main event of Collision. This also was a very good experience.

I would advise not doing things one doesn't like if possible