Charlie Sheen is out of his mind

[Devon Malcolm]

That Mitchell & Webb Look

 

Really? I thought that programme was absolutely fucking indefensible. The only half decent thing on it, Numberwang, was ripping off Adam and Joe's stuff like "Quizzlestick" anyway.

 

I love Mitchell & Webb and I thought the sketch series had its moments but to suggest it's better than Seinfeld is completely ridiculous - even more so considering it's a bloody sketch show.

 

Interesting to see Carbomb refer to that sketch, which I believe was the first one they ever did in the series, about the Nazi officers, because it's actually a classic example of the biggest fault with that show - running a joke completely and utterly into the ground. The best parts of the series are the mock behind-the-scenes sketches they do.

[Carbomb]

Could you please stop horribly overusing the word genuine?

 

TIA x

 

 

Huh?

 

Also Carbomb's list is bizarre. Absolutely Fabulous better than Seinfeld? You're mental.

 

Explain why, please.

[Loki]

That Mitchell & Webb Look

 

Really? I thought that programme was absolutely fucking indefensible. The only half decent thing on it, Numberwang, was ripping off Adam and Joe's stuff like "Quizzlestick" anyway.

 

I liked a lot of the "alternative viewpoint" angles they took, such as the Nazi officers who were gradually realising they were the bad guys.

 

I will say this, though: obviously, I haven't watched the whole lot of Seinfeld, just a few episodes, and it could be that, outside of "The Soup Nazi" and the couple of "meh" episodes I'd seen, I just hadn't been lucky enough to catch the best of it. I'm not inflexible - I actually rather prefer to be entertained than to slag something off, so if someone wants to point me in the direction of episodes they feel would convert me, please feel free to do so. The "Memento-esque" one sounds cool, in fairness.

 

Start at the beginning and work your way through. It's all in the characterisation, rather than gags, so you have to follow the series through. At the very least, start at the beginning of a series, say series 2, and do the whole series.

[Chest Rockwell]

Could you please stop horribly overusing the word genuine?

 

TIA x

 

 

Huh?

 

Saying "genuine question" or adding the caveat "I genuinely want to know" to your questions. You do it a lot, and in a very patronising fashion.

 

@Carbomb - "The Betrayal" is the name of that backwards Seinfeld episode. Also, "The Contest" is often hailed as the best episode (though not my personal favourite).

 

Edit: But, what Loki said. You have to work your way through sequentially rather than just cherry pick some random episodes. I would echo the advice to just start at the beginning of Season 2 and watch a few in a row.

[Mr. Seven]

Not sure I do that, and it wasn't meant to be patronising. I think you're just a humourless dickhead with a chip on his shoulder.

 

Carbomb - Absolutely Fabulous is up there with Gimme Gimme Gimme in the "not funny, never was" stakes. Regarding Seinfeld; watch The Boyfriend parts 1 and 2 if you haven't already. It's unbeatable.

[Devon Malcolm]

I reckon The Subway could be the single best sitcom episode I've ever seen. It is just perfect in every way in capturing the main characters and what they are all about.

 

Also, from a different episode but still on the subway, Newman and Kramer trying to play Risk on the train still makes me laugh like a pillock to this day.

[PowerButchi]

Did the Betrayal have the awesome guest turn by Mike McShane as FDR in it? If it is that one, it's incredible.

[Chest Rockwell]

You do do it. And you're always being patronising, except maybe when you're a being melodramatic bitch.

 

Chip on my shoulder about what?

[Card]

I wouldn't pick and choose Seinfeld episodes, it is better if you work your way through the seasons because there are references to characters and jokes from previous episodes.

 

But if you really were going to pick one I think personally "The Contest" is great and it's probably one of the most famous and got them a lot of hype and a lot of new viewers and it's very good. I wouldn't go for the backwards episode it's probably one of my least favourites.

[Devon Malcolm]

You do do it. And you're always being patronising, except maybe when you're a being melodramatic bitch.

 

Chip on my shoulder about what?

 

Why are you derailing what has turned into a great discussion about sitcoms with this crap that only you care about? It just seems to me that you're itching to pick a fight with Sev about the pissiest little thing. Go back to talking about sitcoms, you herbert.

[Chris B]

I've recently been finally won over by Curb Your Enthusiasm, so I'm going to try giving Seinfeld another go at some point. I've seen a couple of episodes, and my biggest issues with it is that I find Kramer to just be fucking irritating, and Jerry Seinfeld is a fine comedian but a lousy actor - to the point where I actually can't get past it. He just doesn't deliver dialogue like a person.

 

George and Elaine, on the other hand, are immediately appealing, and I get the idea that Seinfeld surrounded himself with people who could actually act - if Kramer hadn't been one of them, I'd probably have found it more appealing.

 

As much as I like That Mitchell and Webb look, I actually prefer the radio show. I find it tends to work better - either way, their high point was the gentleman in the shop with the 'alcoholic lager beer'.

[Carbomb]

Carbomb - Absolutely Fabulous is up there with Gimme Gimme Gimme in the "not funny, never was" stakes.

 

Sorry, don't agree. Joanna Lumley playing a spectacular slag after years of playing classy ladies was brilliant; she was exactly how I imagined Twiggy would be in real life. Whilst a lot of the dialogue is contrived, they make excellent use of creative invective, and the overall interplay between the characters has more depth than people give it credit for: Saffron REALLY just wants her mum to love her, but hates that fact, whereas Edina, despite being completely self-centred and unaware, wants to have her cake and eat it by influencing her daughter into being as dissolute as she is, yet still be considered a decent mum, just because her own mother was part of that horrible, sterile, 40s generation who treated their kids like viruses to be cultivated at arms' length.

 

It's completely unrealistic and contrived, but I think their delivery and characterisation make it work. The post-comeback stuff jumps the shark hideously, though.

 

Regarding Seinfeld; watch The Boyfriend parts 1 and 2 if you haven't already. It's unbeatable.

 

Thank you, will watch.

[Mr. Seven]

You do do it. And you're always being patronising, except maybe when you're a being melodramatic bitch.

 

Nah.

 

 

Chip on my shoulder about what?

 

No idea. You come across as an uptight dickhead most of the time.

 

Edit: Carbomb, fair play if you can find such subtext in Ab Fab. I could never get past the "drunken slags being loud" aspect of it. Genuinely.

[Carbomb]

Other stuff which springs to mind:

 

The Day Today

Brass Eye

On The Hour (radio)

Jam

 

Pretty much anything by Chris Morris, really.

 

Edit: Carbomb, fair play if you can find such subtext in Ab Fab. I could never get past the "drunken slags being loud" aspect of it. Genuinely.

 

I did find that, initially. But I found myself watching more and more. Said subtext, for me the high point when Edina sells Saff into slavery, then immediately regrets it, but not enough to try and get her back. Completely ridiculous, but summed up their relationship in a nutshell.

 

"Drunken slags being loud" - for me, that's Men Behaving Badly.

 

Also, stuff that I enjoy more than I've enjoyed Seinfeld, but would never consider better than it:

 

Up Pompeii!

Mork & Mindy

 

and yes, Gimme Gimme Gimme - can't re-watch it much, but I just love some of the outright disgusting stuff they come out with. Pure LCD, I must admit.

[King Pitcos]

But how is it they've got such an awful record for modern sitcoms

They haven't, unless you just ignore all the good ones.

 

As far as mainstream comedy goes, I do enjoy How I Met Your Mother, but would you classify 30 Rock as mainstream?

I don't, because it's so absurd. The meta stuff and Immortal Kenneth especially seem out of place in a sitcom. But it is primetime on a major network, so it's as mainstream as can be in that respect.

 

30 Rock and It's Always Sunny are two of my favourite things on telly in the last year. I used to love Seinfeld on the Paramount Channel when I was about thirteen or fourteen, and I think Sky picked it up and promoted it quite a bit for the final season? I was a bit disappointed by the final episode, and never bothered with it much after that. I've got the first two or three seasons on DVD but never quite got back into it.