Paid Members Catfish Jake Posted November 16, 2009 Paid Members Posted November 16, 2009 At the end of the episode I just kept thinking he was almost like the Valeyard. Well the Valeyard was created during the Doctor's 12th and 13th incarnations and it could be used that Smith's Doctor is actually the 12th, so maybe...just maybe we know who the main villian for next season is. Anyway, what a bloody good ending to last night's episode! A price will be paid and hell is going to break lose. I have got the idea that this "darkness" which is coming to cause the end of time will use the Master as his means to do it, so the master comes back as a ghost maybe. I'm probably missing something obvious here, but won't Smith be the eleventh incarnation? Who else are you counting, Peter Cushing? Richard E. Grant? Quote
LiamTheGreat Posted November 16, 2009 Posted November 16, 2009 I think Cushing never countd because he's doing Hartnel's doctor in a film adaptation of a tv show. And E Grant was in a slightly unofficial audio play (done by the BBC but not along the lines of the big finish ones) Quote
JamesTyler Posted November 16, 2009 Posted November 16, 2009 I'm probably missing something obvious here, but won't Smith be the eleventh incarnation? Who else are you counting, Peter Cushing? Richard E. Grant? At a guess (and correct me if I'm wrong) I'd say he's counting Ten twice as he did regenerate i series four, but just enough to heal himself and not to change. Quote
Lou Cyfer Posted November 16, 2009 Posted November 16, 2009 the two other space station that didnt top themselves (how selfish was the captain? oh yeah save my life will you? i'll show you BLAM!) were they an "item" i thought the younger woman survivor held someones hand when it kicked off, could this lead to a "out of time" child, someone who wasnt supposed to exist? and the timelords arnt dead just "timelocked" with the darleks, surley they could figure a way out of it? Quote
Paid Members Catfish Jake Posted November 16, 2009 Paid Members Posted November 16, 2009 the two other space station that didnt top themselves (how selfish was the captain? oh yeah save my life will you? i'll show you BLAM!) were they an "item" i thought the younger woman survivor held someones hand when it kicked off, could this lead to a "out of time" child, someone who wasnt supposed to exist? and the timelords arnt dead just "timelocked" with the darleks, surley they could figure a way out of it? According to the commentary, they were, but most of it was edited out of the final cut. The scenes are likely to appear as deleted scenes on the DVD release. Quote
Pinc Posted November 17, 2009 Posted November 17, 2009 (edited) I'm probably missing something obvious here, but won't Smith be the eleventh incarnation? Who else are you counting, Peter Cushing? Richard E. Grant? At a guess (and correct me if I'm wrong) I'd say he's counting Ten twice as he did regenerate i series four, but just enough to heal himself and not to change. I'm quite sure the episode of Doctor Who Confidential which revealed Matt Smith as the new doctor was subtitled "The Tenth Doctor." So regardless of the reasoning behind it, one can be sure that the current writers consider Smith to be the 10th doctor. Also, in the most recent christmas special, when the Doctor saw the faces of all the previous doctors Cushing and Grant weren't represented. I think that was definately an explicit attempt to canonise the Doctor lineage in a very concrete way. Edit: Checked wiki, the DWC episode was called 'The Eleventh Doctor.' Edited November 17, 2009 by Pinc Quote
Andrew the Giant Posted November 17, 2009 Posted November 17, 2009 1. Hartnell 2.Troughton 3.Pertwee 4. Baker 5. Davison 6. Baker 7. McCoy 8. McGann 9. Eccleston 10. Tennant 11. Smith Thats the way I see it, so the new guy will be the 11th Quote
GalaxyV.2 Posted November 17, 2009 Posted November 17, 2009 I've always felt Cushing should count somewhere in the scheme of things, he played the Doctor in two big films and although he did so as Hartnell wasnt up to it, his Doctor is a lot different to Hartnells. Then again the beauty of Who is your not sure what incarnation Cushings Doctor was. Quote
Paid Members ReturnOfTheMack Posted November 17, 2009 Paid Members Posted November 17, 2009 Cushings Doctor was a human who was actually called Doctor Who. He wasnt a Time Lord, and he wasnt 'The Doctor'. Parallel worlds maybe? Quote
GalaxyV.2 Posted November 17, 2009 Posted November 17, 2009 Yeah possibly, I wonder why they changed it, as I'm pretty sure Hartnell was supposed to be in the film. I'ld go for the parallel theory. Quote
Paid Members Foale Posted November 17, 2009 Paid Members Posted November 17, 2009 Cushing is the 'Movie Doctor', considering the films were made whilst Hartnell was still the TV doctor and not in between breaks like McGann was, I can't see him fitting in any other way. Quote
Baz Windham Posted November 26, 2009 Posted November 26, 2009 Just re-watched the Christmas special from 2007 on BBC3 and there was an interesting piece of dialogue from Mr Copper, he was saying that if the Doctor could pick he probably wouldn't save Tony Gordon from Corrie and then said.... But if you had the power to decide who lives and who dies you'd be a monster I thought it was very apt considering what he did in the special the other week I love it when you re-watch shows like this and get little nuggets that become relevant even if they weren't planned to be. Quote
bringbackwrestling Posted November 26, 2009 Posted November 26, 2009 Cushings Doctor was a human who was actually called Doctor Who. He wasnt a Time Lord, and he wasnt 'The Doctor'. Parallel worlds maybe? faulty chameleon arch from a future incarnation would be my guess. oh first post on a wrestling forum is about Dr Who - yay Quote
JamesTyler Posted November 27, 2009 Posted November 27, 2009 Just re-watched the Christmas special from 2007 on BBC3 and there was an interesting piece of dialogue from Mr Copper, he was saying that if the Doctor could pick he probably wouldn't save Tony Gordon from Corrie and then said.... But if you had the power to decide who lives and who dies you'd be a monster I thought it was very apt considering what he did in the special the other week I love it when you re-watch shows like this and get little nuggets that become relevant even if they weren't planned to be. I've read posters on a few (much geekier) forums go on about how the Doctors 'change' at the end was a bit out of the blue, therefor less believable. But there has been a lot of subtle set up - whether it was intentional or not. In that same Christmas special the Doctor had his "I can do anything!" line after Kylie died, going back to the year before there was the whole moment of Donna saying that if he needed someone to stop him when he goes too far. In the series four finale we saw him stopping Team Jack from going mental, but in the same episode we saw his 'soul revealed' and his upset at seeing others die doing his dirty work... Little seeds of the Doctors darkness has been thrown throughout - that combined with not wanting to regenerate in that same finale, "Why would I, look at mt?" helped to make that moment in Waters on Mars more believable for me. Quote
GalaxyV.2 Posted November 27, 2009 Posted November 27, 2009 I think Tennants Doctor has been one of the darkest there has been. After they got Rose out of the way, he excelled imo at those bits. Look at him in the Christmas episode with the spiders (racknous?) He's completley mental when he's drowning them, and the rather wonderful 'Human Nature/Family of Blood' with the whole wrath of the timelord stuff, really built up how this change would come about. Its been building up to it for a while and was imo, wonderfully executed. I just wish Tennant hadn't played him like frank spencer the other times. Quote
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