Chris Benoit - 5 years on.

[aaron]

I've often wondered if people would be far more up in arms if it was, say, Prime Time Brian Lee or Shawn Stasiak or someone that did it.

At the time you mean? Because since it became clear, I've never seen anyone refer to Benoit as anything other than a scumbag.

 

I didn't quite believe it at the time. It wasn't because he was a great wrestler, it was because there are hours and hours of interviews out there with everyone saying what a fantastic guy he was. I've never heard anything about Stasiak or Brian Lee so I wouldn't be surprised by anything they did, good or bad.

 

The hero worship aspect of it doesn't apply just in this case. Look at the millions of nutjobs who think Michael Jackson was an innocent child.

 

Also never convicted by any crime... innocent until proven guilty, isn't it? Unless some conspiracy theory says otherwise...

[Halitosis Romantic]

I've often wondered if people would be far more up in arms if it was, say, Prime Time Brian Lee or Shawn Stasiak or someone that did it.

At the time you mean? Because since it became clear, I've never seen anyone refer to Benoit as anything other than a scumbag.

 

I didn't quite believe it at the time. It wasn't because he was a great wrestler, it was because there are hours and hours of interviews out there with everyone saying what a fantastic guy he was. I've never heard anything about Stasiak or Brian Lee so I wouldn't be surprised by anything they did, good or bad.

 

The hero worship aspect of it doesn't apply just in this case. Look at the millions of nutjobs who think Michael Jackson was an innocent child.

 

Also never convicted by any crime... innocent until proven guilty, isn't it? Unless some conspiracy theory says otherwise...

 

Who said that Michael Jackson was convicted of a crime? Not Rick, that's who.

[unfitfinlay]

I've often wondered if people would be far more up in arms if it was, say, Prime Time Brian Lee or Shawn Stasiak or someone that did it.

At the time you mean? Because since it became clear, I've never seen anyone refer to Benoit as anything other than a scumbag.

 

I didn't quite believe it at the time. It wasn't because he was a great wrestler, it was because there are hours and hours of interviews out there with everyone saying what a fantastic guy he was. I've never heard anything about Stasiak or Brian Lee so I wouldn't be surprised by anything they did, good or bad.

 

The hero worship aspect of it doesn't apply just in this case. Look at the millions of nutjobs who think Michael Jackson was an innocent child.

 

There's still plenty of people on YouTube who either don't think he did it or that it's excusable because of his brain injuries. A LOT seem to believe that Kevin Sullivan is some sort of Hannibal Lecter style psychotic genius and waited ten years to get his revenge Benoit for stealing Nancy from him.

 

On topic - I was thinking about this not long before the thread was posted and I'd say that my attitude to wrestling has changed drastically because of Chris Benoit. I used to love hard working guys like Benoit, Eddie Guerrero, the Hardys etc and hate the bigger guys for "holding them down". Now I think that wrestling is fake for a reason and that anyone who has to legitimately, and deliberately, hurt themselves or their opponent to get over is a moron and should probably find another career.

 

Also never convicted by any crime... innocent until proven guilty, isn't it? Unless some conspiracy theory says otherwise...

 

Surely the "conspiracy theory" about Michael Jackson is that he used his wealth to make an allegation that he molested a young boy go away, which he did. Is it really a conspiracy theory when it's reported as fact internationally?

[Arch Stanton]

On topic - I was thinking about this not long before the thread was posted and I'd say that my attitude to wrestling has changed drastically because of Chris Benoit. I used to love hard working guys like Benoit, Eddie Guerrero, the Hardys etc and hate the bigger guys for "holding them down". Now I think that wrestling is fake for a reason and that anyone who has to legitimately, and deliberately, hurt themselves or their opponent to get over is a moron and should probably find another career.

You are certainly not alone on this point, I know that a lot of people on here (myself included) have experienced the same changes in attitude and now have a much greater appreciation for the 'less is more', basic story-telling ring style.

[wandshogun09]

I'm a big fan of Kevin Sullivan, and I was just disgusted when a couple of people on another forum wished that the blame could get shifted off to the Taskmaster instead, so they could watch Benoit matches in the future. Just disgusting, wanting to offload that onto an innocent man.

 

I've seen that shite aswell. It's pathetic. To try and blame Kevin Sullivan is really clutching at straws. And like Butch said, if it was someone not so beloved as a 'great worker' like Benoit was, then I'm not sure there would be so much excuse making.

 

I've seen all sorts of cack spouted and wacko conspiracy theories thrown about blaming Kevin Sullivan, Vince McMahon and the one that really disgusted me, I've seen people try to pin it on Nancy. Saying she killed their son. So then Benoit, the poor get, was so distraught he topped her and then himself. Of course, this is easily disproven by the fact that Nancy was killed first. I understand the shock and disbelief when it happened, and people not wanting to accept it. I was the same, but as much as everyone was trying to think of some other explanation, I think deep down most knew the likely outcome.

 

I just found it really tasteless that some people were so quick to pin it on Nancy, why jump to that conclusion but not believe that Benoit could do it? Because she didn't have ***** matches is the only reason I can think of. I was a huge fan of Benoit and while I can still watch matches of his and seperate it from what he did to an extent, it's absolutely right that he's remembered for being a child murdering cretin first and foremost.

 

He was a great performer in the ring but that's all worthless when stacked up against offing your wife and kid.

 

Anyway, if anyone's wants a bit of a laugh have a look at this thread full of wrestling conspiracy theories on another forum I stumbled across;

 

http://www.wrestlingforum.com/general-wwe/...-so-creepy.html

 

It's a long thread, I just flicked through clicking random pages and you can't fail to find something ridiculous on any page you land on. Unintentional gold. There is some sense talked by a small number in there but they're drowned out by the sea of conspiracy theorists/nutjobs. These are people who probably thought the Billy Jack Haynes shoot was a news report and completely factual. Absolute bonkers.

 

Here's a few examples;

 

Owen Hart's death wasn't an accident, Vince rigged the line to break; injuring Owen Hart in retaliation for breaking Austin's neck and nearly ending the career of the man who would forever change the face of wrestling. It's common knowledge that Owen never called/spoke to Austin after he broke his neck, and it doesn't seem like something that Austin was too bothered about, but Vince wanted revenge it for it.

 

The only thing that went wrong was the line broke at the wrong point, killing Owen instead of injuring him.

 

Christ. Apparently Owen is haunting the Kemper Arena aswell and he was behind Triple H's quad injury in 2001.

 

Another tricky piece of mystery in the Benoit tragedy is the text messages. The address given on the investigation paper regarding the steroids sent to the house (the FBI paper) and the address on the text message don't match. The address on the text message is the EXACT one you get on google maps/earth and is a couple of streets away from Benoit's home. The other text message is misleading because it claims that the dogs are in the enclosed pool area but when the cops arrived, two Rottweilers were completely loose, guarding the door which didn't let the cops get in and they had to get the neighbor who was familiar with the dogs get in first.

 

I could write an essay on how much the Benoit tragedy DOESN'T add up AT ALL. For instance, there are beer bottles found in the house by the dead bodies but all three tested negative for alcohol. Steroids were found but "roid rage" was proved to be out of the door as an explanation since the deaths took place under two days minimum. Going back to the text messages, the first investigation claimed that Daniel and Chris both died on Saturday but the text messages were sent in early Sunday around 4 AM.

 

And more confusion is when Daniel was found on his bed with an unused knife under the bed. The internet history led them to searches made about a prophet named Elijah that could raise a dead boy from the dead by placing it on his bed and then proceeding to place a knife under it. Which brings me to this: why would Chris try to resurrect his son right after killing him?

 

This is an extremely interesting topic and I think the cops should reopen the case and do a proper search. And Kevin Sullivan really needs to be asked because he was suspected a couple of days after the news broke out and police never bothered asking him anything. Weirdly enough, he was also linked to Sherri Martel's death about a week before the Benoit's were found dead.

 

I may be making it more complicated and the truth may just be that Chris did it and that's all but nobody saw what happened or even had "hearing" proof so all we can do is speculate.

 

This is what I dont understand...

 

He comes home from the doctors visit that Friday evening, and is on the phone with a WWE superstar. Says someone is at the door, he will be right back. WWE superstar hears a scuffle or something and the phone goes dead.. He calls the WWE wrestler back after awhile and says everything is ok, and at the end he gives that weird and random " I Love You " ... To me that signals he knows he is in deep shit (maybe if someone was in his house and holding him hostage or something )...

 

Sometime that weekend a white car is said to have been seen leaving the house.. Whether ot not all 3 were dead when that car left or not, its creepy...

 

And once again those texts... Who the hell sent them if he died on Saturday? Who updated his WIKI?? Why did none of that not make it to the news?? Not much talk of foul play, a possible murder... No DNA or Fingerprints taken... They just walk in a room, stumble upon Benoit and pretty much say dont worry about DNA this was a murder suicide... Were the police to stupid to realize that in some cases of an intruder/killer, he could drug a man and force him to make or recieve calls, leading to the man sounding groggy/tired because of the drugging?

 

This is my favourite one;

 

I understand what you are saying but Sullivan could have easily brought with him a gang of friends, some of them with guns to keep Chris in check. That would also explain Chris saying that his family had food poisoning in the phone call about him missing Vengeance which could have been a forced explanation to keep WWE workers from suspecting something was wrong. Also, the hanging story is a bit weird too. The machine they claim he hanged himself with is only a few inches taller than he was and I've heard that there was a towel placed by his neck. Also, being hanged would cause your remains to look extremely destroyed with some piece of flesh hanging out but Chris only had a few scars on his neck, or so I've heard.

 

I think it's possible that police just used Chris as the guilty one because he was dead and couldn't defend himself which also explains why they came to a conclusion so fast. There's still a lot that needs explaining.

 

I used to accept that Chris was the one behind it and suspected some kind of brain damage to be the cause when I first heard of the story, that's what ended up being the explanation but then I read up on all these plotholes in the police's explanation and it makes me think... maybe Chris is innocent after all. It's creepy because a few weeks ago, I had a dream where somebody randomly walked by a laid down Chris Benoit, shot him twice in the head and then walked away but got caught with a couple of bullets from a cop that stopped him from walking free.

 

 

What the....?

 

And the thing is, unlike the thread on here where the comments were made when people were in shock and the events still fresh and constantly developing...these above posts were made this year. I can't believe there's still people banging on about him being innocent 5 years on. Maybe, I shouldn't be surprised, maybe Benoit and his family are having days out with Elvis and Tupac in some secret location as we type.

[No use for a nick]

On topic - I was thinking about this not long before the thread was posted and I'd say that my attitude to wrestling has changed drastically because of Chris Benoit. I used to love hard working guys like Benoit, Eddie Guerrero, the Hardys etc and hate the bigger guys for "holding them down". Now I think that wrestling is fake for a reason and that anyone who has to legitimately, and deliberately, hurt themselves or their opponent to get over is a moron and should probably find another career.

You are certainly not alone on this point, I know that a lot of people on here (myself included) have experienced the same changes in attitude and now have a much greater appreciation for the 'less is more', basic story-telling ring style.

 

Great point, same here. I reckon something similar could be said about Misawa falling victim of the style he popularised, many years ago I used to worship Triple Crown matches, now I'd rather watch Hogan sending crowds into a frenzy with lame big boots, it shows just how good of a showman he is/was. A bit like when a shy and unpopular guy tells a craking joke and gets less of a reaction than the leader of the pack burping at the right time, that's what wrestling is all about at the end of the day, timing and charisma.

[Magnum]

Are we all still spinning Gary Glitter discs?

Rock n Roll Part II and Rock n Roll Christmas are still the soundtrack to my adulthood.

 

Funnily enough, this was the first thing that came into my mind when I read the first post. Five years ago, the Benoit incident really creeped me out, and I did think quite a lot about the moral issues surrounding the murders, the concussions, the drug abuse, the alleged prior domestic abuse, and all the other factors surrounding it. I was quite morbidly fascinated by it, for a period, and I've made much longer and more involved posts about it on this forum in the past.

 

Now? Now, the truth is I'm simply not that bothered by it. I never met and was never likely to meet any of the people who died, and the extent of their impact on my life was that I watched them from time to time on TV. While tragic, their deaths didn't affect my life in the slightest. I know that sounds cold and callous, and to an extent I'm deliberately phrasing it that way to get a point across, but in truth I think people naturally develop that sort of detachment as a necessity these days, because otherwise we wouldn't be able to hear about the murders of other people we don't know on the news every night without bursting into floods of tears.

 

Chris Benoit probably wasn't a very nice person, but he was involved in some TV shows that I liked a lot, shows that I'll happily watch again and again when the inclination strikes me. Just like I can have a laugh at the Naked Gun films without worrying about OJ Simpson decapitating his wife, or listen to a Beatles album without thinking about how Phil Spector shot an innocent woman, or have a good old pissed singalong to 'Rock & Roll Christmas' at the end of the year. I don't need my entertainers to be nice people, I just need them to entertain me.

[David]

Those conspiracy theories are brilliant, I love all of that stuff. The Benoit murder-suicide tragedy should be up there with similar crimes such as the Ronald DeFeo murders as far as crackpot theories and alternative viewpoints go.

 

Once you cut through all of the intrigue and interesting theories though you are left with the sad facts of the matter. Benoit was a damaged individual who ultimately paid the price, and so did those close to him.

 

I still don't agree with those who call him a monster, evil and suchlike. It's not as if he was a serial killer who carried out his horrible acts over a period of months or years.

 

The studies on his brain after he died show that he was clearly suffering from brain damage which more than likely lead to him doing what he did, so it's hardly a real reflection of his character which is why I have no issue watching Benoit matches or interviews.

 

It also led to WWE clamping down on certain moves which could lead to head trauma, so I guess at least one poitive thing came out of the situation.

[King Pitcos]

Now? Now, the truth is I'm simply not that bothered by it. I never met and was never likely to meet any of the people who died, and the extent of their impact on my life was that I watched them from time to time on TV. While tragic, their deaths didn't affect my life in the slightest.

I always think about that when people get genuinely devastated and ecstatic over football, to the point of battering their wife if their team loses and so on. Whether a football team wins or loses doesn't really change anything in the lives of fans other than giving new conversation branches when interacting with non-playable characters at work.

[air_raid]

I loved Benoit as a wrestler, and was devastated the day I heard he had died, and felt a bit sick inside when I heard what had happened. Honestly though, I never let it affect my watching his matches, and can't imagine ever letting it. Some of his matches are among my favourites, and I still mark out watching him win at Mania XX, regardless of how things ended up for him.

 

My feelings have actually been fairly succinctly wrapped up by two others already :

 

I don't need my entertainers to be nice people, I just need them to entertain me.

The studies on his brain after he died show that he was clearly suffering from brain damage which more than likely lead to him doing what he did, so it's hardly a real reflection of his character which is why I have no issue watching Benoit matches or interviews.

[RJ Impact]

I still watch plenty of his matches I love his match against Angle from Rumble 03, a nice hidden gem vs Lesnar from Dec 03 and heaps others, I watched his last match a few weeks ago on Youtube when I was looking at some WWECW stuff, its weird to watch knowing what happens a few days later.

 

But Yeah I can still watch his matches without thinking about what he did, he was still a great wrestler and that's who I see.

[King Pitcos]

But Yeah I can still watch his matches without thinking about what he did, he was still a great wrestler and that's who I see.

 

I'm pretty sure that statement is indicative of mental illness. There aren't enough crisp Germans in the world to make Roboto's workrate more prominent than "he killed his wife and son, him" in a sane mind.

 

I don't follow it, so I'm not sure, but for folks on American football forums, are there people on them who say things like "I don't think of the murders when I think of OJ, I think of his touchdowns" or suchlike?

[David]

I don't follow it, so I'm not sure, but for folks on American football forums, are there people on them who say things like "I don't think of the murders when I think of OJ, I think of his touchdowns" or suchlike?

I don't think it's ever been proved that Simpson is suffering from some sort of brain injury/mental illness brought on by too many bumps to the dome, has it?

[Dirty Eddie]

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[David]

Why the fuck did you quote me? I was simply asking a question.