NeverYield Posted May 19 Share Posted May 19 I'm a pretty big fan of 'Taker, he is probably one of, if not my favourite wrestler of all time, but he also comes across to me like one of those people who could only behave a certain way amongst certain crowds and circles, and for 'Taker that was the world of pro wrestling. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members wandshogun09 Posted May 19 Paid Members Share Posted May 19 Tracy Smothers thought Taker was a cock. Good enough for me. Taker in the locker room in 96 burying Kloudy, the male valet of the Body Donna’s… ”Some fucking guys would do anything to get in this business” Tracy… ”Yeah, how long you been dead now?” Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members air_raid Posted May 19 Paid Members Share Posted May 19 6 hours ago, TheBurningRed said: Edge vs Foley and Shawn Michaels vs Vince were the standouts but both gimmick matches and Rey winning the world title. It was quite a lacklustre Mania. It was a ridiculous situation that guys as good and/or pushed Shawn, Taker and Edge had to slum it with a non-wrestler, a retired wrestler and Mark Henry. What I neglected to mention that Vince’s original plan with getting Bret back to the table in 2005 was a match at Mania 22, but Bret didn’t go for it. Edge vs Foley turned out an enjoyable spectacle but at the time all three matches felt inconsequential with obvious winners. Cena vs HHH on the other hand was far more intriguing and played to a boisterous Chicago crowd, so I loved it. Mania 23 was fubarred from the first draft too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Donald J Trump Posted May 19 Share Posted May 19 I've tried to niavely cling to the belief that you're all jaded, cynical curmudgeons with terrible stories about everyone, then I seen something somewhere that supports everything posted here so far, and made me feel as sick as a pig. It's about Edge and Christian, and they've been summoned to wrestlers court for giving a writer an action figure. "and then they brought The Undertaker a bottle of Jack Daniels, and the boys popped so hard that the case got thrown right out of court." I might be very late in getting on this bandwagon but I think I'm through with the pathetic old bastard. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chili Posted May 19 Share Posted May 19 Am I right that Taker reduced Melina Perez to tears in a wrestlers court, or was it Bradshaw. Either way, regardless of the reasoning, fucking wanker. I found him hilarious on The Last Ride, stuck in time loop of 'I gotta have a good last match' and he kept shitting the bed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simonworden Posted May 20 Share Posted May 20 .This conversation got me thinking about why Taker survived the big bad guy for Hogan year(s) and didn't get shit canned back to WCW soon after like the typical monster heel did. Surely the key thing to setting him up right was that first brief title win. Even with interference he actually beat Hogan, an absolute rarity in that day. That alone set him up to be worth keeping around and luckily the gimmick caught on enough to be made a face without having to dance or hold a doll or silly prop other than the urn) to cause a fast decent and release to happen. Without that I think he'd have been Mean Mark-ing Vs Sting in WCW by 92/93. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members air_raid Posted May 20 Paid Members Share Posted May 20 2 hours ago, simonworden said: .This conversation got me thinking about why Taker survived the big bad guy for Hogan year(s) and didn't get shit canned back to WCW soon after like the typical monster heel did. Surely the key thing to setting him up right was that first brief title win. Even with interference he actually beat Hogan, an absolute rarity in that day. That alone set him up to be worth keeping around and luckily the gimmick caught on enough to be made a face without having to dance or hold a doll or silly prop other than the urn) to cause a fast decent and release to happen. Without that I think he'd have been Mean Mark-ing Vs Sting in WCW by 92/93. I think I’ve made this point before, but I think the live crowd reactions at Survivor Series suggest the wheels were already turning for him needing to be turned babyface and hence becoming a merch machine you kept around. There’s a remarkable number of fans in Detroit that night that can be seen or heard celebrating when he pins The Hulkster. Arguably that could simply be down to people becoming a little sick of Hogan on top, but nevertheless Taker became popular organically so they had to turn him. There’s conflicting stories from those close to the situation whether Sid was promised Hogan at Mania from the start or whether they were indeed planning Hogan vs Flair prior to understanding the full fallout from Arsenio and Hogan needing to be ushered into a little break, but those that say Hogan vs Flair was in the first draft usually have Savage vs Jake and Sid vs Taker too - the transformation of the plan for Taker being wrestling a babyface Sid Justice to being the one of his alliance with The Snake to turn face is quite an interesting one, and it does make me wonder that if Survivors and Tuesday In Texas had gone the way they did, but plans went ahead on Hogan vs Flair, what they would have done. One thought is that the title isn’t up in the Rumble but Hogans in it (see 89/90) but the finish is the same ; sore loser Sid costs Hogan the chance to win for the third year in a row and Flairs win supports his claim for the title shot at WrestleMania just as Hogans did in 1991 and what would become the explicit prize in 93. Though how you turn Taker with his enemy being Sid instead of Jake is a different question, which I don’t have an answer to. Or maybe, blind to Taker’s burgeoning popularity, they leave it the way it was. But then… there’s no heel Sid waiting for Warrior. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members unfitfinlay Posted May 20 Paid Members Share Posted May 20 4 hours ago, simonworden said: .This conversation got me thinking about why Taker survived the big bad guy for Hogan year(s) and didn't get shit canned back to WCW soon after like the typical monster heel did. Surely the key thing to setting him up right was that first brief title win. Even with interference he actually beat Hogan, an absolute rarity in that day. That alone set him up to be worth keeping around and luckily the gimmick caught on enough to be made a face without having to dance or hold a doll or silly prop other than the urn) to cause a fast decent and release to happen. Without that I think he'd have been Mean Mark-ing Vs Sting in WCW by 92/93. I’d imagine the steroid scandal had to have played a part too. He was a naturally imposing guy who happened to come around at a time when most of the WWF roster was far from natural. I can definitely see them deciding to keep him strong just in case they needed to fully move away from all the heavy steroid users, which is what ended up happening, for a few years at least. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Carbomb Posted May 20 Paid Members Share Posted May 20 Harking back to the previous part of the discussion, I'd quite forgotten Edge vs. Taker at WM24; that is also a much underrated match, I think, in terms of storytelling. It does suffer from the monolith of the Streak looming over it - Edge was never going to be the guy to end it, and particularly not at that point in his career - so it is a bit of a damp squib as a Mania main event as regards unpredictability, but it has a certain momentousness to it that feels right, plus Taker was still popular enough at that point that more people wanted to see him coming out of WM the champ than not. It's a decently-crafted match, as well. Not plodding or boring, some good bits of action. I suppose it's one of those that could be summed up as "the journey being worth more than the destination". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members air_raid Posted May 20 Paid Members Share Posted May 20 1 hour ago, Carbomb said: Harking back to the previous part of the discussion, I'd quite forgotten Edge vs. Taker at WM24; that is also a much underrated match, I think, in terms of storytelling. It does suffer from the monolith of the Streak looming over it - Edge was never going to be the guy to end it, and particularly not at that point in his career - so it is a bit of a damp squib as a Mania main event as regards unpredictability, but it has a certain momentousness to it that feels right, plus Taker was still popular enough at that point that more people wanted to see him coming out of WM the champ than not. It's a decently-crafted match, as well. Not plodding or boring, some good bits of action. I suppose it's one of those that could be summed up as "the journey being worth more than the destination". It was good, but after the length of time it took to get there, I wish that had been the end of it. They carried on having gimmick matches until Taker got injured then blew it off at SummerSlam, and I was a bit sick of it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chili Posted May 20 Share Posted May 20 To join in the opinions of his work, Undertaker is one whose matches I don't actively go to watch but with the right opponent he was really good when the chemistry matched. I don't think he could carry the weight on his own, but I don't think he was hardly shit. Give him a good dance partner and he could really go. He owes a lot to Mick Foley for getting some proper fire out of him, their KOTR 96 match is obviously forgotten and it's a very good first chapter match. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gaffer Posted May 20 Share Posted May 20 On 5/19/2024 at 3:26 PM, TheBurningRed said: Edge vs Foley and Shawn Michaels vs Vince were the standouts but both gimmick matches and Rey winning the world title. It was quite a lacklustre Mania. I remember the intrigue over Cena's crowd reaction being the main point of interest for many. This was when the backlash was at its absolute height, where it felt like it could/would actually work and we'd all - clever us - force Vince to admit this Cena fella just wasn't money and go and put the title on Carlito or something. But yeah, poor WrestleMania. It's full of the company's attempts at re-creating 'Attitude' as well. Foley vastly overrates his match with Edge. It's way too self consciously trying to be 'my best match' for me to genuinely get lost in it. He used it as an excuse to write vol. three of his memoirs! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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