Saving WCW in October 1999

[Liam O'Rourke]

So for this week's podcast we're looking to tackle the commonly held belief that WCW was still salvageable when Vince Russo came along, and as always we're looking to get some feedback from your good selves on this issue.

If the date is October 1st, 1999, the numbers are heading South and the pressure is on, what would you have done to try and turn the tide against the WWF? Who are you pushing, who are you not, is there an angle you think could have made a difference? What changes would you make? Or do you think it was beyond repair at that point? 

Post your suggestions for what you'd do to "save" WCW, and as always the best ones will be read on the show, and I'll post the link in here this weekend. 

So whaddya think?

 

EDIT - The podcast taking your suggestions on saving WCW in 99 is now available at the following link: http://squaredcirclegazette.podbean.com/mf/web/khzvan/SCGRadio42-SavingWCWinOctober1999.mp3

[WWFChilli]

The correct answer really is the company could do nothing unless, the Time Warner/AOL deal didn't go through, or Jamie Kellner didn't rock up with his nutjob fears of remote controls (he legit hated TiVO because you could skip the breaks and miss the adverts). WCW was done no matter what happened, they could have been making money or least a lot less in the red in late 1999/2000/2001 but the cost of producing Nitro for the ad revenue it was making, plus the new boys in the towers, seeing wrestling as low rent for the corporations image at the time meant it would be cancelled regardless. That's the real horrible not fun 'fantasy' answer.

 

For the real (or is that fake) answer, WCW really became un-salvageable when in 1999 you STILL had the same blokes about in the Main Events, 1998 was really the last year anyone excepted it, and even then people were really losing interest. The 'youth' (i.e. new characters) initiative was working in the WWF and WCW could have really tried harder. I would have also still hired Russo, but I would have told him before he signed that he would be working within a committee, it did work in WWF so elements of it could have been effective somewhat for WCW, but the audience was pretty different, still Russo liked to give everyone an angle so at least morale might have been up, just less skits Vince, less skits. It wouldn't be daft to hire Vince Russo in 1999, if he was available and like everyone, you fell for his jabbering, he would be considered a steal. Eventually they would have figured he was a dick anyway... Jesus, really WCW was just fucked, I'm out of ideas... GOLDBERG, when in doubt, something something Goldberg. That works. Oh, and any angle is better the another nWo reboot, fucking state of that.

[Dr.PeterVenkman]

Good point about Russo, its easy for all the Wrestlecrap wankers to go on about how he was a disaster but ANYONE running WCW at that time would have been mad not to steal him from Vince, not that it worked out well in the end like but in October '99 it was the best choice other than maybe throwing mental money at either Austin ($200m over ten years according to Sky text at the time) or The Rock (who wasn't quite there yet)

[tiger_rick]

Good "What if". I actually think Russo had a good grasp of the problems he was there to solve. The issue was that his answers drove people away more quickly.

 

They still had a good TV audience in 1999, they had some really strong cities and they had an excellent roster. Just a few things I would have done:

 

1. No massive angle. Just put the title on Goldberg and build up the next 6-8 challengers to the title by keeping them winning, giving people a reason to love/hate them and keeping them well away from each other. Goldberg never had the World Title run he should have had. At that point in 1999, I'd have built Bret, Sting, Benoit, Booker, DDP and Steiner as his next challengers taking them all the way through to mid 2000.

 

2. Make the appearances of really old people sporadic on TV. Make sure the likes of Funk and Piper only come out if absolutely necessary while making appearances by Hogan and Flair a massive event and a Hogan or Flair match an even bigger deal.

 

3. Make the TV Title and Cruiserwight title exclusive to Thunder and make it a show where the up and comers battle. Lots of rotation in the roster, lots of fresh talent from Japan, Mexico and Indies in for short runs of a few matches and workrate matches over the TV title like the old days.

 

4. Cut the talent that wasn't doing anything and replace it with the fly-ins as mentioned above. They had a ton of guys doing nothing who Vince wouldn't want. Streamline the talent and cut unnecessary costs.

 

5. Push La Parka.

[WyattSheepMask]

People often talk about Vince being the filter for Russo when he was at WWE. The Dogshit ideas wouldn't get passed, whereas WCW was such a mess in the office there was nothing stop the shit-stream from breaking the levee. Sure Russo had lots of ideas, but so did Alan Partridge when he was pitching to Tony Hayers.

 

Russo in interviews has also often thrown out the "no one would expect that to happen" logic, but that logic of 'just because it's unexpected' doesn't mean that it's good. No one would expect an elephant to come out on a tiny unicycle during RAW, but that doesn't mean that it should happen

[Bukamania]

Tank Abbot as World Champion would have solved everything.

[AshC]

I'd have been up for Monkey Tennis on Nitro.

[Really Big Shoe]

I think WCW was on the ropes by that time already. WWF were on a massive successful run and they had everything firing on all cylinders. The only way to turn the tide would be if they out Attitude'd the WWF but WCW standards & practices probably wouldn't have allowed it. Or they could have been the PG family friendly product. Anyway here's what I think

 

1. Leave Vinny Ru & Ed Ferrera at the WWF. Just re-evaluate the talent they did have and maybe bring in RVD, The Dudleyz & a few other top indie talents at the time. De-push the older talent, elevate the likes of Benoit, Saturn, Eddie, Malenko et al and let the established names do the job and then fade away into the sunset

 

2. Don't try and outdo the WWF, let WCW work their niche of the NWA/WCW style of wrestling. Make the Horsemen vs nWo the focal point of the rest of the year which would allow WCW to elevate Benoit & Malenko, maybe have Eddie as a Horsemen too so that way you're putting the nWo away and concluding that long running angle with WCW winning in the end instead of the whole thing fizzling out. 

 

3. Focus on just one show - WCW Monday Nitro. Make that cutting edge like it used to be. Gradually re-introduce talent each week so say Curt Henning turning up on Nitro would be a big deal as the fans wouldn't have seen him for months. Have Nitro be exciting, cut down on the promo's, focus on the Crusierweights and younger talents. Perhaps have a legends match every month or so for the fans to see Flair vs Hogan for example but keep them as a special attraction. Make the tag team division important, re-unite the Steniers, Harlem Heat et al and put on some solid tag matches. 

 

4. Use their talent agreement with NJPW more effectively, that way you're bringing in fresh talent and giving talent a way to freshen themselves up by working overseas then coming back to WCW with a freshness to them.

 

5. Like it's been said, slimline the roster, at one time it was heavily bloated so future endevour quite a lot of talent just keeping the cream of the crop and leaving roster space for guys like a Jerry Lynn, RVD et al to work in the crusierweight division

 

6. Don't concern themselves with what the WWF is doing, be the alternative for fans who might not like the Attitude Era type product. Maybe be PG and a show which families can watch together and have storylines which make sense and have logical conclusions or branch out in ways which tell a better story.  

[KingofSports]

Just happened to watch Starrcade '99 last night. Final ppv of the 20th century. The first 11 matches lasted a total of 50 minutes & if there was a clean finish, I'm struggling to remember it. Jarrett manages to feature in 2 matches! I didn't quite make it to the penultimate & final match, but here's a list of some of the guys crammed into that first 50 minutes; Meng, Kevin Sullivan, Rick Steiner, Mike Rotunda, Dean Malenko, Perry Saturn, Shane Douglas, Vampiro, Steve Williams, Booker T, Curt Hennig, Dustin Rhodes, Diamond Dallas Page, Lex Luger, Sting, Kevin Nash & Sid Vicious. I didn't manage to give any of those matches a single star(*). That's how I remember WCW from then on, except it got worse. Financially, I have no clue, but when you put on shows like that, you're fucked.

 

Could it have been saved? Yes, probably, but I see a parallel with TNA over the past 2/3 years, in so much as, you can reach a stage (and this usually only happens when dismal show follows dismal show for weeks or months on-end) people no longer care about your product & nothing you do from there on in, is going to make any difference. My memories of late-WCW consist almost entirely of; Russo, Jarrett & his fucking guitar, Sanders, Palumbo / O'Haire - possibly because I can't abide any of them & shitty, pointless factions. They probably had Muta making tea, flipping burgers or something.

[spotlightmagnet1]

People often talk about Vince being the filter for Russo when he was at WWE. The Dogshit ideas wouldn't get passed, whereas WCW was such a mess in the office there was nothing stop the shit-stream from breaking the levee. Sure Russo had lots of ideas, but so did Alan Partridge when he was pitching to Tony Hayers.

 

Russo in interviews has also often thrown out the "no one would expect that to happen" logic, but that logic of 'just because it's unexpected' doesn't mean that it's good. No one would expect an elephant to come out on a tiny unicycle during RAW, but that doesn't mean that it should happen

 

One of the biggest problems I had with Russo was, he wasn't that creative. 

 

ALot of what he did in WCW was rehashing 'his' best hits in WWF. Stone Cold Hulk Hogan, Madusa getting a push wrestling men, Buzzkill being Road Dogg, Montreal screwjob left right and centre, nWo 2000, Canada vs. USA, etc. Ionically the things he said no one expected, they did expect cause they saw the real deal on WWF. when it was unexpected. 

 

Maybe that's an over-simplification, but I still think there's an argument.

 

Anyway, how to save WCW? Politely ask the stars like Hogan, Hart, et al to forgo there maybe in lieu of a bit more money. Not that all wrestlers would stringently exercise it, but enough did to kill upward mobility and fresh stars at the top. That would be the first port of call. After that, keep it family friendly-ish (say put some innuendo and some blood here and there but never too much) and stay the course, it'll be banal but still alive. 

[Michael_3165]

They shouldn't have pushed the old timers vs new blood angle. People didn't buy the new guys going over established talent. I would have kept using old time guys periodically to put over up and coming stars but only when they are seen as a threat. Perfect example is Hogan vs Kidman - it was meant well but fell on its arse.

 

Take a step back and go back to basics, cut the gimmick match bullshit and make it about characters and matches people care about. Once people arent invested emotionally you might as well give up. The title changed hands so many times in 99-00 that no wonder people tuned in. Why would they?

 

Similar to TNA in many ways

[fraserbee]

WCW was in less trouble in 1999 than they were in 91-93. While the shows were a confusing mess, they were still drawing fair TV numbers, drawing some good crowds (they drew 25000 to The Georgia Dome in July 99) and PPV numbers were slipping but still passable. Their biggest problem was that they were spending so much money, even decent business lost loads.

 

I think they needed to cut costs and slimline that massive roster. They needed to produce a logical TV show built around probably Bill Goldberg, Bret Hart, DDP and a few others that had name value, but could wrestle in a manner that didn't look pathetic when compared to Austin and Rock on the other side. They could then keep the Hogans, Flairs, Savages etc as special attractions, at least until their contracts were up and then see what could be negotiated after that. At the same time they needed to set about building up the next guys.

 

The key had to be patience though, which just wasn't the mentality of the time. Regardless what they did, business would probably have kept falling well into 2000 until things started to bed in and settle. Unfortunately if the ratings didn't turn around the next week they had to hotshot to something else.

[IANdrewDiceClay]

WCW was in less trouble in 1999 than they were in 91-93. While the shows were a confusing mess, they were still drawing fair TV numbers, drawing some good crowds (they drew 25000 to The Georgia Dome in July 99) and PPV numbers were slipping but still passable. Their biggest problem was that they were spending so much money, even decent business lost loads.

Because unlike 91-93, WCW was still riding the wave of popularity from the boom period. 1999 was the year the hole appeared in the boat. 2000 was when they are went under. Even though things werent as bad as they'd get, its plain to see looking back everyone in the company hadnt got a clue what the fuck to do to stop the bleeding.

 

I watched that year back last year, and I wanted to punch everyone who wasn't the Jersey Triad. Master P, KISS, Chad Brock, DJ cunting Ran, that knob jockey from MTV that showed up (Ricky Wankface of whatever his name was).

[stevieg1980]

Just my opinion but the time between the end of Souled Out 2000 to the reset just before Spring Stampede 2000 was some of the worst TV and PPV's I've seen. Superbrawl and Uncensored are pretty much unwatchable.

 

The company could have been salvaged but this period made WCW look old and tired if you compare say the Superbrawl card to the No Way Out card and the matches that were put out and the 'stars' that were on the show it's like night and day.

 

The April reset should have been after Souled Out and the only way to go forward was youth and ECW poaching. But make the signings count. Don't just bring in Mike Awesome because you can and have him appear without a build up. Don't have Chuck Palumbo appear to superkick Lex Luger when nobody apart from Saturday Night viewers know who he is. Build slowly. The war is pretty much lost so start again and try not lose your current audience.

 

Oh and keep Mark Madden away from commentary.

[Really Big Shoe]

keep Mark Madden away from commentary.