The PROGRESS Wrestling Thread

[Big Benny HG]

... and just as a follow-up, here are a few of my photos from the event, which really capture the scale of the show:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Benno]

Hopefully more can be done next time about some the sightlines. If the entrance or ring could be raised at all it would make a big difference. As Benny said, the best view turned out to be standing at the back. Even from a couple of rows back in seating you were always looking at a sea of backs of heads, especially on entrances or any mat work.

 

Having watched the On Demand now, I have to retract what I said about how it might look though. The place looked fantastic on tape and I probably never should have doubted the Progress production lot, they shot the place fantastically as always.

[Big Benny HG]

Decent interview from the TalkSport website with PROGRESS co-owner/promoter Jim Smallman, talking all things PROGRESS:

 

http://talksport.com/wwe/jim-smallman-progress-wrestling-we-want-fans-see-us-pinnacle-british-wrestling-161002211150

 

 

Independent wrestling’s hottest company drew nearly 2,500 fans to south London last weekend in one of the biggest shows mounted in Britain for decades - but PROGRESS co-founder Jim Smallman is in no rush to make the jump into venues such as the capital’s O2 Arena.

 

“It’s not really us. For independent wrestling, I think 2,500 is a pretty good ceiling,” show host Jim told talkSPORT before last Sunday’s record-shattering event at the Brixton Academy.

 

Having begun operations out of rock venue The Garage in Islington, north London, before switching to the Electric Ballroom a few miles away in Camden to accommodate rapidly-growing demand for PROGRESS’ highly-acclaimed live experience, the 38-year-old stand up prefers to ensure the setting complements the enlightened, punk-ish aesthetic running throughout the company’s pre-eminent brand.

 

Whether found in PROGRESS' outstanding in-ring stylings, compelling video-on-demand delivery, peerless social media and merchandise marketing strategies or the unique crowd atmosphere straddling those of live comedy, gigs and the terraces and underpinned by wrestling nerd culture, that music core has helped PROGRESS plug into audiences that may not otherwise be interested in pro wrestling.

 

He continued: “There’s loads of independent shows in this country at the minute and going from 350 [in the audience] to 700 was a very big deal. Going from 700 to 2,500 is insanity. So then going from that to 5,000 is however many times crazier.

 

“I’m not saying it is completely beyond us but I do like us doing shows in music venues. Not just where we run in London, but also where we run in Manchester and where we will be running in Birmingham all suit our product whereas I don’t think an arena setting necessarily would. Music venues certainly fits in with the whole punk ethos of the company, too.”

 

‘Chapter 36: We’re Gonna Need a Bigger Room’ is now available for viewing by PROGRESS’ worldwide family of fans. The lure of being there in person for previous London shows has persuaded fans from New Zealand, Australia, Canada, the United States, Germany, Austria, Switzerland, France, Ireland, Portugal, Netherlands and Norway to make pilgrimages to pro wrestling’s promised land.

 

And although a recent international collaboration with Smash Wrestling in Canada proved a box office success, with plans for dates working alongside Germany’s wXw in January and in Orlando, Florida during Wrestlemania week next April demonstrating further the scope and scale of PROGRESS’ ambition, it is the 2017 move into the Midlands and consolidation of the Manchester market - with 17 Chapters planned alone - that should see them make the most significant headway.

 

“I spent a lot of time thanking people for coming [after the Brixton show] because we can't do something like that without 2,400 people who want to do something like that, so we're super super super grateful to everyone that came along,” Jim said on his Tuesday Night Jaw podcast earlier this week.

 

But with several prominent talents committing their futures to WWE, Ring of Honor and New Japan Pro Wrestling, will PROGRESS be able to maintain the superiority quality of their cards as their show schedule ramps up? Are there enough top-level performers to future-proof PROGRESS?

 

Jim - and business partners Jon Briley and Glen Joseph - are convinced UK performers will continue to hit top form… and get even better.

 

Building around British acts and giving them a platform to excel, rather than a model of trading off the reputations of ‘imports’ whose international TV stardom may have dimmed somewhat, is an aspect Jim singles out as one of PROGRESS’ finest achievements.

 

“There’s people in this country who are already very good who we don’t use - and we’ll start using them,” Jim told talkSPORT.

 

“There’s also great guys coming through our ProJo [in-house training program], like Pastor William Eaver, Jack Sexsmith and Damon Moser - they’re all people we know we can rely on because they’ve been with us such since the beginning and they’re learning things the right way. But because British wrestling is doing so well now, there are always new stars being created.

 

“Looking at someone like Will Ospreay now, he’s contracted to New Japan and he’s a mate so I’m chuffed for him. We’ll see him again, it just won’t be for a little while. Will was very exciting in his first match for us back at Chapter 2 - but he was also very raw. Four years down the line, he’s one of the best wrestlers in the world.

 

“There’s nothing to suggest that there’s not somebody we’re already using now or someone we could start using who has not got that potential. Everyone we use in this country has got the potential to be one of the best wrestlers in in the world... whether they’re as young and acrobatic as someone like Will, or someone who may be tremendously technical, excelling in the strong style, like Pete Dunne, who’s a similar age.

 

“There’s always going to be those opportunities. In the same way, there’s always going to British guys who go to United States or Japan who will eventually come back home again.”

 

Jim added: “What I’m most pleased about is how we’ve managed to create a product based around British wrestlers. There are plenty of popular promotions in British wrestling, but the fact we’ve built up such a loyal following and trust with our fans while primarily using British guys, I think it is amazing.

 

“And then seeing things like PWG’s Battle of Los Angeles the other week and how many of our guys were in it [including regulars Mark Andrews, Pete Dunne, Tommaso Ciampa, Tommy End, Zack Sabre Jr, Will Ospreay, Marty Scurll and Mark Haskins], it is a vote of confidence for us doing things the right way.”

 

But the march of PROGRESS will not proceed without a further raising of the bar from all performers that aspire to make their presence felt.

 

Jim continued: “We always expect to lose people. We fully expect them to get snapped up by other companies that are bigger than us and we say goodbye with a shake of the hand. Anyone that goes on the bigger things, like Will or Jack Gallagher, we’re just delighted for them because that is what they wanted. That’s why they worked so hard for us.

 

“All that means is that there is going to be another generation of wrestlers who’ve seen them do it and recognise to get where they are is to work really hard for us.

 

“So hopefully that means there will always be a conveyor belt of really, really talented and really, really enthusiastic wrestlers who want to work for us and be part of our product and get noticed. We’ve always got to be prepared for that.

 

“And as a challenge, creating news stars is something the three of us really look forward to doing, because you can’t just expect one person to be at the top of your card forever. You do have to reset and refresh things.

 

“We’ve planned pretty much up until the middle of next year and we have exciting things planned. But we know we’re going to have to turn over our roster a little bit based on people we’re going to use.”

 

No doubt WWE will continue to keep tabs on PROGRESS’ knack for helping polish Brit performers. Hints of a link up first became apparent last year when PROGRESS footage appeared on the WWE Network as part of Finn Balor’s NXT hype featurettes. But a relationship of sorts was confirmed earlier this year when PROGRESS became one of only two British promotions to host European qualifiers for WWE’s Cruiserweight Classic tournament.

 

For astounded long time wrestling fans, WWE’s willingness to work alongside an outfit it has no stake in roared volumes about the regard PROGRESS is held by the global market leaders.

 

“It all came from a phone call from William Regal,” explained Jim, keen to emphasise how the association between PROGRESS and WWE is “tiny”.

 

“[NXT on screen manager and talent scout] Regal is a friend - he spends most of his time bullying me about Phil Collins - but he is a friend and someone I’ve worked with a lot during his excellent stand up tours over here and I get on really well with him, regardless of what he’ll tell you.

 

“When WWE comes calling and goes ‘we like what you do’, that’s an amazing pat on the back. And then when they offer an opportunity that offers more eyes on our product, obviously we’re going to go: ‘Absolutely, yes!’”

Jim added: “We’ve been very lucky in that they seemed pleased with the CWC matches we put on for them.

 

“The whole thing worked out really well for us and because the CWC did so well, it was great to be one of the companies in on the ground floor, like EVOLVE and Rev Pro. It helps us in the eyes of someone who doesn’t know that much about wrestling, it is a little bit of validation because WWE has gone: ‘These guys are cool.’

 

“I love our company and I’m very proud of PROGRESS’ product - but we're very different to WWE. If we can attract more fans through the tiniest of associations with WWE, that is tremendous.”

He also hinted at future collaborations with WWE in the future.

 

“We don’t spend any time having a pop at WWE. There’s no point in doing that. That’s very 1997 ECW. WWE is the biggest wrestling company in the world and we’re all fans.

 

“We are our own company and they just wanted to do us a little favour. That’s pretty much all it was and we appreciate that. We’re super proud of that because as wrestling fans, knowing they like what we do is seriously, seriously cool.

 

“If they ask us to do it again, I’m sure it’d be brilliant. We’d be daft to say no.”

 

British wrestling may not draw football league-sized crowds, but the scene is thriving on a small business level not experienced since World of Sport’s TV heyday, with hundreds of fans watching live wrestling up and down the country every weekend. Far from basking in the boom, Jim and the PROGRESS team intend to keep applying the elbow (drop) grease.

 

Jim said: “You’ve only got to look at how many more companies there are since we started four and a half years ago. I certainly think we’ve contributed to it but I don’t think we’re solely responsible for it, that’d be tremendously arrogant!

 

“But I think it is ourselves, ICW, PCW, Fight Club: PRO, Rev Pro, IPW, Southside, Attack!, Chaos and loads more companies I’ve missed out that have all done really good things and fostered a brilliant community that’s meant wrestlers have more shows to work on. So those wrestlers have all got loads and loads better and the whole industry has really kicked on and grown.”

 

He continued: “I always worry the boom won’t last forever. You can’t ever sit there and be complacent and think: ‘British wrestling is going great! We can put anything on!’. No. You have to work harder.

 

“And in our case we want to work as hard as possible because we want to be seen as one of the best companies. So we’re never going to stop working hard because we want people to see us at the pinnacle of an industry that is doing really well in this country.

 

“There’s definitely been an upswing in British wrestling. When we started the average attendance was probably around 300, but many, many companies that run shows that pull in 700. Don’t forget, 700 people to an indie show in America is almost unheard of.

 

“PWG is one of the finest indecent companies in the world and they have 400 people in for their shows. The fact that we’re doing a couple of shows a month for 700 plus is crazy - and we’re not the only company doing that.

 

“There is a limit to it, of course - we can’t all play to 10,000 all the time, there’s not enough fans to go around - but we’re pushing the boundaries with Brixton, it is an exciting time and we’re delighted to be part of it all.”

[BrodyGraham]

Really fun show today. The first half shot past. Really good fun. The second half wasn't quite so much fun, mostly due to the Atlas match slowing the pace down after the tag triple threat.

The main event took its time to get going but finished well.

If such a thing is possible, I think Gibson might be too over as a heel in Progress, certainly in Manchester. The first half of the match was basically Gibson vs the crowd, which felt like it hurt Haskins a bit getting over.

[TheBurningRed]

I can't really watch Progress anymore. The fans in that Facebook group put me off. When they're not moaning, they're calling themselves the greatest fans in the world and Progress the best promotion and nothing else matters. They're just as annoying at the shows and it all feels very cliquey. Smallman is alright but he goes on too much during the show. The commentary has always been dire and it's worse with Callum Leslie and Glenn Joseph doing it. Great wrestling, enjoyed the few shows I went too and the DVDs I've owned and watched but I could only watch them with the sound down if I was to watch again. Shame. But I wish them luck

Edited October 17, 2016 by TheBurningRed

[cleslie92]

I can't really watch Progress anymore. The fans in that Facebook group put me off. When they're not moaning, they're calling themselves the greatest fans in the world and Progress the best promotion and nothing else matters. They're just as annoying at the shows and it all feels very cliquey. Smallman is alright but he goes on too much during the show. The commentary has always been dire and it's worse with Callum Leslie and Glenn Joseph doing it. Great wrestling, enjoyed the few shows I went too and the DVDs I've owned and watched but I could only watch them with the sound down if I was to watch again. Shame. But I wish them luck

 

Sorry to hear you aren't enjoying the shows. If you had any specific feedback on the commentary feel free to shoot me a message, always interested in improving.

[Jon-Carr_92]

My only issue with the commentary was Chapter 23 was it? The one with Ospreay v Mandrews main eventing. Every spot is just the commentators screaming down their mics and it gets annoying after a while. Otherwise, it's fine. It helps if people weren't such screamers sometimes for the sake of it. Quite a few out there as well. But in my view. It would be OK to dial it down a bit. I still remember the people who whined and complained about the commentary of Will Ospreay's balcony moonsault which was funny as anything.

[cleslie92]

My only issue with the commentary was Chapter 23 was it? The one with Ospreay v Mandrews main eventing. Every spot is just the commentators screaming down their mics and it gets annoying after a while. Otherwise, it's fine. It helps if people weren't such screamers sometimes for the sake of it. Quite a few out there as well. But in my view. It would be OK to dial it down a bit. I still remember the people who whined and complained about the commentary of Will Ospreay's balcony moonsault which was funny as anything.

There have been quite a few shows with some levels issues, and the sort of thing you describe at 23 has been improved upon recently. We got a new mixer in the summer and it took a couple of shows to get that right. Brixton was pretty perfect mix wise I thought, which was great. 

[TATTA]

I can't really watch Progress anymore. The fans in that Facebook group put me off. When they're not moaning, they're calling themselves the greatest fans in the world and Progress the best promotion and nothing else matters. They're just as annoying at the shows and it all feels very cliquey. Smallman is alright but he goes on too much during the show. The commentary has always been dire and it's worse with Callum Leslie and Glenn Joseph doing it. Great wrestling, enjoyed the few shows I went too and the DVDs I've owned and watched but I could only watch them with the sound down if I was to watch again. Shame. But I wish them luck

Sums up how I feel pretty perfectly.

The fans don't do the promotion any favours, and I realise it's probably only a vocal minority, but they killed the vibe there a loooong time ago.

[Benno]

I go to most of the shows and I can see why the crowd would irritate some, it can be a bit culty and Smallman goes overboard a bit, but the "we're all part of this" thing is a big element of what they're selling and a big part of why the atmosphere is so good. Agreed on the Progress Fans Facebook though. That place is fucking terrible.

 

Yesterday in Manchester was great I thought, especially that first half. Hopefully Aichner secured himself a spot going forward because he was incredible fun live. Hoping with a few faces leaving that a spot has opened further up the card for Bubblegum too, he's such a great great heel act.

 

Really enjoyed the comedy in the 3 way tag but thought it was misplaced in the number 1 contenders 4 way. Felt like with Trent Seven inexplicably being able to add himself to the match, it was a lot more comedy based than it would have been if Strickland had made it over. Didn't really seem the appropriate match for it, but was glad to see Scurll win and the Havoc run in was another tremendous moment. Enjoyed the main event, I have my doubts about an extended Haskins reign, but they really sucked me in by the end. I know some might not like that a heel as over as Gibson was getting duelling chants near the end but I think that's what happens when you're not far from Liverpool.

 

On a more negative note, hopefully that's the end of Whiplash in Progress. He's sucked the air out of the room every time he's turned up as the surprise opponent/partner/run-in and if that's the gimmick, it's not a very good one. Enough already.

Edited October 17, 2016 by Benno

[TheBurningRed]

Callum - My feelings on the commentary is it all sounds very false. False excitement. Unnecessary shouting/screaming that doesn't sound real. I know the commentary table is there now etc, but it all feels very post production. It's a chore to get through, even worse than Smallmans.

 

 

The whole "The Family" shtick is what annoys me. And the way they act like Progress is the best wrestling ever and slag off WWE for all their stuff... No promotion is perfect and they have to stop thinking Progress is and that they're the perfect fans. There's a certain fan in that group who is a bit of a know it all and made a claim he would welcome all new fans and make them feel at home. I was at the front of the queue when he and some others came over and I found him quite rude to myself and others who were also new. And yet he always brings up that 'One Rule' shit. But I suppose that's the clique mentality of some of them. If you're not there all the time, you're not really one of them. Or an 'Ultra' if you like

Edited October 17, 2016 by TheBurningRed

[cleslie92]

Callum - My feelings on the commentary is it all sounds very false. False excitement. Unnecessary shouting/screaming that doesn't sound real. I know the commentary table is there now etc, but it all feels very post production. It's a chore to get through, even worse than Smallmans.

 

 

The whole "The Family" shtick is what annoys me. And the way they act like Progress is the best wrestling ever and slag off WWE for all their stuff... No promotion is perfect and they have to stop thinking Progress is and that they're the perfect fans. There's a certain fan in that group who is a bit of a know it all and made a claim he would welcome all new fans and make them feel at home. I was at the front of the queue when he and some others came over and I found him quite rude to myself and others who were also new. And yet he always brings up that 'One Rule' shit. But I suppose that's the clique mentality of some of them. If you're not there all the time, you're not really one of them. Or an 'Ultra' if you like

 

I get what you're saying. Personally I would say give the more recent shows a go, I feel like that's something we've been working on and has improved. 

 

As for the fans, any hot indie product is going to gather a rabid cult. PWG, ICW, OTT, anything. It goes with the territory. Some wrestling fans are always going to be shit, or weird, or dicks. Sadly that also goes with the territory. I don't think it's unique to PROGRESS. 

 

Not sure what you mean about PROGRESS slagging off WWE. PROGRESS have a working relationship with WWE! 

[TheBurningRed]

 

 

Callum - My feelings on the commentary is it all sounds very false. False excitement. Unnecessary shouting/screaming that doesn't sound real. I know the commentary table is there now etc, but it all feels very post production. It's a chore to get through, even worse than Smallmans.

 

 

The whole "The Family" shtick is what annoys me. And the way they act like Progress is the best wrestling ever and slag off WWE for all their stuff... No promotion is perfect and they have to stop thinking Progress is and that they're the perfect fans. There's a certain fan in that group who is a bit of a know it all and made a claim he would welcome all new fans and make them feel at home. I was at the front of the queue when he and some others came over and I found him quite rude to myself and others who were also new. And yet he always brings up that 'One Rule' shit. But I suppose that's the clique mentality of some of them. If you're not there all the time, you're not really one of them. Or an 'Ultra' if you like

I get what you're saying. Personally I would say give the more recent shows a go, I feel like that's something we've been working on and has improved.

 

As for the fans, any hot indie product is going to gather a rabid cult. PWG, ICW, OTT, anything. It goes with the territory. Some wrestling fans are always going to be shit, or weird, or dicks. Sadly that also goes with the territory. I don't think it's unique to PROGRESS.

 

Not sure what you mean about PROGRESS slagging off WWE. PROGRESS have a working relationship with WWE!

Sorry, I should've made myself clearer. I meant the fans of Progress have slagged off WWE when they are pushing Progress as the best company in the world. And it's their opinion and whatever, it just becomes tedious after a while. Same as they can get like that with other UK Promotions. And I've been to WWE and Rev Pro shows and there is always a few fans that can be annoying, you'll get them everywhere. It just seems a bit too much with Progress. Leaving the group has allowed me to escape from all that and maybe in time, I will come back to the shows and enjoy it again and maybe even the commentary too.

 

As I said, I wish Progress luck. They're doing great things and have great shows with some of the best UK talent and I am pleased for them. It's just my personal opinion on things.

Edited October 17, 2016 by TheBurningRed

[pryko]

The best way to be a fan of PROGRESS is to not be a part of the Fan Group on Facebook

[Tuna Taco]

I really don't find the fan group that bad, but the family stuff is pure Juggalo. They sell a fuck load of merchandise so clearly know what they are doing.