TAFKAC Posted January 18, 2014 Share Posted January 18, 2014 Was working today covering the Stranraer game. Got to Stair Park before finding out the game was off. Ah well... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bydo Posted January 18, 2014 Share Posted January 18, 2014 How can Rangers get "Co-Efficient" points being in the bottom league? I always thought it was points gained in the top league in a country? Paul Hartley's just resigned from Alloa. Irrespective of where the points come from, it can't be denied that the points were added to the "oldco" Rangers total. To be honest, the old club/new club debate is as boring as sin now. As far as the SFA, SPFL, UEFA, ECA and the law are concerned, the issue has been put to bed- so should we. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Cum Doctor Posted January 18, 2014 Share Posted January 18, 2014 To be honest, the old club/new club debate is as boring as sin now. As far as the SFA, SPFL, UEFA, ECA and the law are concerned, the issue has been put to bed- so should we. Â That entire line sums it up for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members SiMania Posted January 18, 2014 Paid Members Share Posted January 18, 2014 Nah. As long as the same club myth is peddled, it will be discussed. Liquidation deniers answer me this. - what was the name of the "company" running the club. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bydo Posted January 19, 2014 Share Posted January 19, 2014 "The Rangers Football Club PLC." Â The PLC there is the important part. Just because the word 'club' is in the name of the company doesn't mean a jot. Â Also, I'm not denying liquidation. That happened, there's no dispute there. Â Celtic are owned right now by a different company than they were before 1994. Yes, I know that the 'old' Celtic company was not liquidated- so there's no need to make that point- however, the clubs SFA license and membership was transferred between the two in 1994. Â Just like Rangers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MungoChutney Posted January 19, 2014 Share Posted January 19, 2014 Not just like Rangers at all. I'll repeat this again: Insolvency law makes no provision for the transfer of the history of a club, nowhere in the liquidation documents was the club history sold as an asset therefore it ceased to exist when the company was liquidated. There was more than 1 indication from Charles Green and other individuals involved in the sale that it would be a new club. This only changed when they realised the full implications of this, not least from the Rangers support. Â Edited to add: by Bydo's logic, any club that is sold in line with company law in the UK should lose their history because Rangers had to. Except Rangers were liquidated, and as a result their history died with them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gary v1 Posted January 19, 2014 Share Posted January 19, 2014 Paul Hartley resignation is an odd one. I can only assume he has his eyes on a bigger job. One bad result doesn't take away from the fact that he's had back to back promotions and is 10 point clear of the play off spot this season. Will be interesting to see where he goes next. Would surprise me if he end up in English League 1. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FUM Posted January 19, 2014 Share Posted January 19, 2014 "The Rangers Football Club PLC."Â The PLC there is the important part. Just because the word 'club' is in the name of the company doesn't mean a jot. Â Also, I'm not denying liquidation. That happened, there's no dispute there. Â Celtic are owned right now by a different company than they were before 1994. Yes, I know that the 'old' Celtic company was not liquidated- so there's no need to make that point- however, the clubs SFA license and membership was transferred between the two in 1994. Â Just like Rangers. Â No they aren't. The company just changed their name, it's not a different company. Also no license or membership was transferred between anything, Celtic kept the same registration so let's not make things up. Â A club isn't "owned" by a company anyway, they're incorporated into one. Not going any further into the debate though, it bores me to death. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bydo Posted January 19, 2014 Share Posted January 19, 2014 Not just like Rangers at all. I'll repeat this again: Insolvency law makes no provision for the transfer of the history of a club, nowhere in the liquidation documents was the club history sold as an asset therefore it ceased to exist when the company was liquidated. There was more than 1 indication from Charles Green and other individuals involved in the sale that it would be a new club. This only changed when they realised the full implications of this, not least from the Rangers support. Edited to add: by Bydo's logic, any club that is sold in line with company law in the UK should lose their history because Rangers had to. Except Rangers were liquidated, and as a result their history died with them. How can 'history' ever be considered a tangible asset? History can't be 'sold' or 'liquidated'. It can however be 'recognised' as belonging to something or someone, which it is in the case of Rangers by ALL the relevant bodies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MungoChutney Posted January 19, 2014 Share Posted January 19, 2014 Look, I quite like the idea that football governs itself but this issue is so far removed from the actual football that the only viable reference material is company law. As the article I posted explains, when a company is liquidated there is no provision to transfer or even 'recognise' anything other than the assets listed on the sale documents. Â I should add btw, that I don't actually mind that the SFA and other bodies recognise the leagues etc that were won by the old club because overtaking them will be all the better for Celtic fans. What irks me, and keeps me arguing the point beyond the time I should have given up trying, is the total lack of humility from Rangers fans. I can honestly say, hand on heart, if this were Celtic I'd be thoroughly embarrassed by events of the last 2 years, same as I was by the Green Brigade's antics during that period. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bydo Posted January 19, 2014 Share Posted January 19, 2014 I should add btw, that I don't actually mind that the SFA and other bodies recognise the leagues etc that were won by the old club because overtaking them will be all the better for Celtic fans. What irks me, and keeps me arguing the point beyond the time I should have given up trying, is the total lack of humility from Rangers fans. I can honestly say, hand on heart, if this were Celtic I'd be thoroughly embarrassed by events of the last 2 years, same as I was by the Green Brigade's antics during that period. Honestly mate, I am. Every time I pick up a newspaper or a Chairman/CEO is forced to resign, I despair. I would love nothing better for this sorry mess to be done with once and for all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members SiMania Posted January 19, 2014 Paid Members Share Posted January 19, 2014 "The Rangers Football Club PLC."Â The PLC there is the important part. Just because the word 'club' is in the name of the company doesn't mean a jot. Â Ummm, I think it's exactly what it means. The club was incorporated into the company. Company gets liquidated......so does the incorporated club.. It's not difficult to get your head round tbh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daaaaaad! Posted January 19, 2014 Share Posted January 19, 2014 Ummm, I think it's exactly what it means. The club was incorporated into the company. Company gets liquidated......so does the incorporated club.. It's not difficult to get your head round tbh. I think See, this is where you're going wrong. Fact is the SFA and UEFA have both given indication that the Rangers FC playing in SPFL League One is the same one that it has always been, so no matter how much personal opinion you put into it or pretence you put upon it, you can't change the fact. Â MungoChutney - please don't confuse this for arrogance. Much like Bydo, I am embarrassed pretty much every time I read 'Rangers' in the news. It might very well be the same club but that doesn't make it any less of a joke. I've shown little to no interest in continuing to follow the club and outside of the odd circumstance where someone has wanted to go with me I've made zero effort to put any money into them through ticket sales. The whole thing is a shitstain of a situation and sadly it doesn't appear it will get any clearer. I wouldn't be surprised to see them show up in SPFL League 2 again at some point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members SiMania Posted January 19, 2014 Paid Members Share Posted January 19, 2014 Where have the SFA and UEFA explicitly stated that? And how can they overrule company law if they did say that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bydo Posted January 19, 2014 Share Posted January 19, 2014 Ummm, I think it's exactly what it means. The club was incorporated into the company. Company gets liquidated......so does the incorporated club.. It's not difficult to get your head round tbh. Â Problem with that is- the Oldco Rangers aren't liquidated yet! Â Let's say you bought a toaster from Woolworths before they liquidated. The liquidation of Woolworths doesn't mean your toaster suddenly disappears. Â During the ongoing liquidation process (in fact, before it even began if you want to get picky), Rangers FC (the club) were sold alongside other assets to Sevco Scotland Ltd. in order to pay 'some' money to creditors. Â Let's let Lord Nimmo Smith confirm that since you're wanting to go down the law route: Â "On 14 June 2012 a newly incorporated company, Sevco Scotland Limited, purchased substantially all the business and assets of Oldco, including Rangers FC, by entering into an asset sale and purchase agreement with the joint administrators. The name of Sevco Scotland Limited was subsequently changed to The Rangers Football Club Limited. We shall refer to this company as Newco." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.