patiirc Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 I mentioned the plothole re COO and GM last night in chat. Laurenitiis is GM, but HH was meant to be COO of the whole WWE, they even made reference in the opening segment to the anonymous Raw GM as if though current and then completely ignored it anyway in favour of a Deus Ex Machina device where Vince ( who had no interest in the board since being fired in the storylines and thus no control) comes in and is able to fire HHH because he had been to see the board. What purpose would he possibly have there seeing as on screen they stripped him of pretty much everything they could so to say he is fired and for HHH to agree made no sense whatsoever  For the first 20 minutes things were still a bit hazy and they could have done anything with the storyline  Instead, the whole thing ended up being a clusterfuck and it didnt sit well. Way back when I said HHH would become the full focus of the storyline and that Punk would assume the Jericho role and be buried and largely Ive been right  This Raw was largely about HHH and in a show where he buries over half the roster, gets fired and then neutralises the threat that Miz and R-Truth had been teasing to pose, they completely neturalised everything in favour of the HHH show, again  Looks like yet again, they have lost faith in whatever they were supposed to do and went back to old stars to prop up the ratings. This was part of the reason WCW got shat on iirc as numbers fell through the floor because people were sick of old stars fighting each other and doing the same thing over and over. The current WWE is no different and when the ratings start to tank (maybe not now, but say over the next 12 months if the dont do anything) they have nothing to fall back on. Matches are getting repeated over and over and over and things that are saved for PPV are being done on Raw as well. Making buying PPV's pointless if you have already seen the match a zillion times in recent times before that  The argument against is that they are giving people TV time and things are progressing at a lower level. They arent really Randy Orton has gone from the World Title picture against Henry to a feud with Cody Rhodes over the IC belt and is a slight backwards step. Henry has gone back to a feud with Big Show, which is understandable considering that Henry injured him, but we have been there and done that within 6months already, and it would appear that they are placing or setting up Henry to lose, Against Orton, he needed help to win, but previously has destroyed him, ditto for Big Show, yet Big Show obliterated him on Smackdown.  R-Truth and Miz, went from having an outsiders style gimmick to being fucked over in the space of one show. Getting buried by HHH at the end there hardly makes them seem dominant when only the other week, they were laying waste to the World Title contenders and Airboom back stage etc as in can attack anyone anywhere. Now they have been neutered.  The rest of the roster got turned heel, including both Sincara's and various others by being marked out as strikers and anti wwe and then re hired by a Heel GM. The audience didnt know whether to cheer or boo them when the came out to the ring and as a result, there were some very mixed responses.  If they wanted to muddy the waters then they have succeeded, but its not looking great to follow on from. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcmahonman Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 The argument against is that they are giving people TV time and things are progressing at a lower level. They arent really Randy Orton has gone from the World Title picture against Henry to a feud with Cody Rhodes over the IC belt and is a slight backwards step. Â Stupid. He can't be in the title picture every month and has to move down the card to allow something different. You moan about having the same matches over and over again yet they actually make a change but it's not good enough because Randy Orton is 'going backwards.' After being in the title picture for months, where would you like him to go? Up? Something that is impossible to do (except on extremely rare ocassions.) Â Rhodes has been brilliant recently and is feuding with a proven main eventer. THIS IS NOT A BAD THING. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Total Package Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 Sooo... CM Punk is a face now? And HHH is also a face? Cena as well? And the WWE's biggest storyline for years is all forgotten and they're all mates? Blinding.   Alvarez and Da Meltzer are losing their shit over this episode of RAW, one of the worst RAW's ever by their words, they are actually comparing it to WCW 2000, that takes some doing, I feel like watching it now, in the same car crash fashion I re-watch WCW 2000, its so bad its good, besides I want to see just how far they have fallen from the hot product they had 3or4 months ago, to WCW 2000 relived.  As long as JR continues being a company man he deserves the shit he keeps getting. Anyway nothing in that show interested me and I spent most of it with my finger on the fast forward button as soon as Punk walked out for his u-turn and I am even less interested in the next PPV then ever.  Truth and Miz are going to get fucking slaughtered by Triple H and his new best mate CM Punk and I don't like Cody's chances either.  Shit show and a rotton main storyline.  Yeah apparently this latest JR firing they did in front of his wife, Meltzer said she was sat behind JR, as usual JR and not many people knew about it, that would explain his reaction, probably saw it coming the minute he was called into the ring, I have to agree with Meltzer the way they bully JR is just so fn childish, to the point where JR doesn't even give a fuck anymore, I wish he would just goto TNA already, thats what they are missing, him putting over the likes of Roode would be great, even if it doesn't work out he can always go back to WWE where they can take the piss out of him some more, since that seems to be the only reason they have him around.  What this means is more Booker T, DA HELL, Cole who sucks at many levels and Lawler who has been on auto pilot for years now, what a shit announcing team, most likely calling shit throw away PPV's, because that's what Vengeance is looking like.  All I can its a good job The Rock is coming back, because I don't know what else there is to look forward to, unless Cena in another title match is what gets you hype. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Pitcos Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 Didn't mind it, but it wasn't great. I really liked the opening bit, they all seemed to be having fun. Then the chaos all finished abruptly, and nearly everything else was par for the course. Henry vs Orton and Punk vs Del Rio are both matches we've already had several times the last few months. Johnny Ace as evil GM is good, his firing of JR was awesome.  To be fair to them, the announcers broke a bollock trying to put over how uneasy an alliance HHH/Punk was, and Punk even had it put into his promo how he doesn't particularly like Triple H but doesn't agree with the coalition of the crappy breaking their word and staging a sit in. And, Punk/Cena used to wax lyrical about how much they 'respected' each other when they were kicking each other's heads in. Of all the feuds that have been swept under the carpet, this is probably one of the more believable.  Plus, Punk always said he thought Triple H was apart of the problem but after they both got beat down at HIAC he accepted that Hunter had nothing to do with it. Aye, I suspect the people complaining about those three being pally this week (after they've been pally several times in the last few months) don't actually watch the shows.  Though, if Air Boom don't, at least, point out their frustration that they walked out on Hunter because they got jumped by Miz/Truth (despite H firing them) and they came back to work only to have them rehired, they'll look like goofs. They said on Smackdown they didn't walk out because of Miz and Truth.  All I can its a good job The Rock is coming back, because I don't know what else there is to look forward to, unless Cena in another title match is what gets you hype. Do you mean "hyped"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Total Package Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 Do you mean "hyped"? Â That's it. Â Like some others ADR doesn't really interest me, Cena... well its gone past the stage of hating the guy, I just find him boring, and you know if he beats ADR again so soon, the IWC will go nuts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ozzfan Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 I'm really not sure whether I liked that or not. Pretty much everyone involved is brilliant, but the booking is dodgy and rushed, but it's building to the PPV rather well. Very odd. Â Of course, I'd rather have an odd, temperamental, almost TNA-like product, than the utterly tedious product WWE has been giving us for the past few years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The King Of Swing Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 LOL Alvarez and Meltzer are ripping it to shreds both even agreed that Impact is better. Â Ouch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baz Windham Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 On the whole 'what roles HHH did or didn't have and vince etc' the only dodgy bit in that for me is the anonymous GM, everything else has been explained, or at least they've tried to. If you do it without the Anon Gm I understand it as this; Vince was running WWE TV and chairman of the board, HHH became COO and ran Raw, HHH relieved of duties by Vince, still chairman of the board (which was mentioned), Laurinaitis becomes Raw GM while HHH keeps other duties as COO. Where it becomes dodgy is that they appear to have only just removed the anonymous GM stand and the running of Raw is only just being mentioned again in terms of a general manager. It seems at least for now as if that wont be resolved, which is annoying and will now always come in in the "who raising the briefcase, Raven's partner, drover the hummer?" threads. I had hopes it would be as they hadn't got rid of it so that they have now decided to get rid so far down the line is a shame. Â Â Anyway I enjoyed Raw, despite not getting to see HHH wrestle a broom for 2 hours. HHH and Punk being friendly doesn't bother me as HHH feuded with him to get personal revenge and he did it like he said he would, in the ring and Punk thought HHH was the one messing about with him and backed down and said it wasn't. They will now unite to take out two who definately are the enemy, Miz and Truth. I assume and hope there are still revelations to come which will tie things up and probably see Laurinaitis get his comeuppance when he's revealed to be behind the mic's cutting off, hate campaign against HHH, driving the hummer etc etc. I wouldn't bet against The Rock being involved in his downfall either. Â Aside from the main feud I continued to really enjoy the midcard guys who mostly now have much more identity and purpose. Rhodes' segment with Orton was especially enjoyable, look forward to their eventual match. I hope Show/Henry has a stipulation, could be really good then. Cena/Del Rio again is a little dissapointing but their last match really surprised me so hopefully this will be good too. Â EDIT - Put anyone else in HHH's role and I guarantee there'd be a few blind eyes turned to some of the stuff people are getting their knickers in a twist over Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
300 Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 LOL Alvarez and Meltzer are ripping it to shreds both even agreed that Impact is better. Ouch.  Oh who cares. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The King Of Swing Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 I'm trying here but I just can't defend this show even to wind up the fappers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doog Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 Some epic overreactions here like, especially from Meltzer and Alvarez. Â It wasnt that bad and furthered the main storyline pretty well again, the only bit I didnt like was just randomly saying Cena is facing Del Rio at Vengeance and neither bloke commented on it. Â Im really intrigued with this main storyline, Lauranitus has finally gotten what it's seemed like he wanted, being in charge, Triple H is now just one pissed off bastard, him and Punk teaming up makes sense, it's obvious it's all leading to the big Survivor Series match so I assume we get Nash helping Miz and Truth at Vengeance. Â It's made me want to watch next week again to see how this plays out. The big match at Survivor Series and whatever stipulations it has is going to be fantastic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baz Windham Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 Yeah I can't understand the massive dislike. If it's not your cup of tea, fair enough but I don't see what made it that bad. I'm far more annoyed when Raw is a really dull by the numbers show. I'm willing to have the odd dodgy plothole and the feeling of really wanting to tune in next week, rather than a perfectly told storyline that leaves me apathetic. Obviously a combination of the two would be lovely, and it does happen now and then but I think that's unrealistic to expect all the time when in comes to a weekly live 2-hour TV show. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JV John Vollman Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 First twenty minutes or so was really interesting and entertaining then Big Johnny L replaces Hunter and it becomes a standard hum-drum Raw for me. Â All the intrigue about where it was headed etc has just been washed away and all the usual suspects return for your generic Raw. Â I hope the doesn't end that storyline cause I thought it had legs right up until Survivor Series at the very least. Â On a positive note, Christian's stable looked really good, hope this becomes a permanent fixture. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 It's throwaway television with no real direction, and has been pretty much for years now. The best approach is to just take it for what it is. If you look too much into it you'll end up cracking up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr.Showtime Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 It wasn't the worst show in the world. But the whole thing was promoted using a Solidarity Rally storyline and we didn't get one segment, or even glimpse, of the guys and gals outside the arena with their signs and their grievances. And so after the first 20 minutes when things were effectively resolved there was no way people were going to like the rest of the show. It wasn't what was promised. Â I've wanted to back Jim Ross throughout his later career and the stuff he's gone through and the way he deals with it, but last night tipped it for me. Is he now officially the planet's biggest pussy? If he didn't know what was going to happen (and he clearly didn't care either way) he should have walked into the ring and smacked Johnny Ace. Or swore down a microphone. Or gave him the finger. Jim Ross needs to quit, never set foot in WWE again, and get on one of those shoot things and try and explain himself so we can feel sympathy for him again. What an absolute waste of time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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