carry jobs

[kobashimark]

For me it has to be as follows:

 

2. Bret Hart Vs Tom Magee: Tom Magee was a bodybuilder, and he wrestled Bret in a trial in the 80's. Bret made him look amazing and Vince thought he had a Hogan v2. Magee then exposed himself to be horrendous and unusable when put in with anyone else, and was released and enver heard of again.

 

this was a dark match and theres no footage on it i think, happened in 1987, he went to AJPW and even baba found him hard to get over

 

Has anyone ever seen this match?

I was going to say it is a pretty strange choice considering no-one on this board will have ever seen that match. Dave Meltzer has certainly seen it as he has written about it in the Observer on several occasions, but bar him and people in the arena that night, I doubt many others would have seen it. I know many who are heavily into Tape/DVD trading and have unbelievable collections of old and rare stuff, and this match is seen as some sort of holy grail amongst them.

[kobashimark]

Terry Funk and Jumbo Tsurara were great carries of wrestlers

[IANdrewDiceClay]

No wonder Hogan decided not to do the return job.

Im pretty sure Hogan had already decided that. Shawn wasnt too happy about getting mullered by Hogan then he picks up his cheque and heads back to the tanning beds.

 

It was unprofessional but I cant blame him. If I was a full time wrestler I would have felt the same.

All I saw as a far in that match was Hogan murdering Shawn Michaels. Watching it on the night just looked like Michaels was making Hogan look tremendous. It highlighted both as what they are in wrestling history. Hogan bringing the crowd to their feet by doing very little and Shawn Michaels being a wrestler who can work around any limitations. If Michaels was doing it to prove the difference in quality between the two as far as work-rate goes, well there wasn't any secret in that to begin with. The buyrate for me was what sets these two apart. The event did mega-business, which WWE wasn't doing much of at the time.

 

At least Shawn never lost his smile this time. He was probably pissed off because he hadn't played the political game with someone like Hulk Hogan. He's not a Bret Hart or Chris Candido. He's not doing anything he doesn't want to, if he doesn't have to.

[ColinBollocks]

HHH vs Khali from Summerslam a few years back was a minor miracle.

Forgot about that. Really basic but very watchable.

 

Other recent ones are Triple H v Sheamus at 'Mania (still Sheamus' best singles match, I had no interest in it but come Triple H winning I was glued) and Kurt Angle v Abyss/Matt Morgan (he got two excellent brawls out of the shittest wrestler in TNA and carried a blown up Matt Morgan to a cracker at Bound For Glory 2009).

[HappyWanderer]

I recall a match between Golberg and DDP in maybe 98 that was awesome. Goldberg, as mentioned before, was green as hell but DDP really worked wonders.

 

I'm sorry, but that wasn't even approaching a carry job. It was a fantastic match though, saw it recently.

 

 

Dude you can't be serious?!

 

Goldberg admitted years later when he signed with WWF/E that he still needed carried in all his matches.

 

DDP worked through that whole match in private with Goldberg dozens of times before they did it in front of an audience and that was why it was Goldberg's first match that was anything other than a quick (or relatively quick if you count Steve Regal throwing a spanner in the works or Goldberg's US Title victory over Raven) squash match.

[air_raid]

DDP worked through that whole match in private with Goldberg dozens of times before they did it in front of an audience and that was why it was Goldberg's first match that was anything other than a quick (or relatively quick if you count Steve Regal throwing a spanner in the works or Goldberg's US Title victory over Raven) squash match.

 

Mate, that's probably got more to do with Page than Goldberg. (I think it was) Flair said that he was right out of the Macho Man school of rehearse, rehearse, rehearse until you know everything you're going to do out there, forwards and backwards, rather than just go out there with a finish and one or two key spots like everyone else did.

 

Shawn Michaels had a very good match with a ladder at Wrestlemania 10... carried Scott Hall on his back at the same time I believe.

 

That's a myth perpetuated by Shawn loyalists and talking heads in WWE bios, who have either been instructed what to say or just generally want to tow the line that Shawn Michaels should be universally adored for staying in the WWF at the time and generally staying true to the "cause" (model profession, that Michaels) and Hall, to be blunt, wasn't. In fact, I believe "Shawn Michaels had a match with a ladder" is a direct quote from a DVD, sounds like something Jericho might have said.

 

Yes, it's fair to say Razor had his best matches with Shawn, but if that's the only criteria there were dozens of other extremely talented men over the years who can also be accused of being carried by him. While Shawn did most of the spectacular stuff and took the hardest/craziest bumps in their ladder matches, Hall still had to be there for him, play crash mat to him, and get the timing right for all of their big spots, which he did. Scott Hall was a very capable worker, in the first match portraying agony very convincingly on quite a few of those big spots and drawing great face sympathy. Similarly at SummerSlam 95 - a match as good if not better, but completely different, his subtle heel mannerisms as he tries to take down Superman are a thing of joy.

 

There's a world of difference between "being carried" and a great match happening between two talented professionals, even if ones start shines brighter than the others. Which is nothing to be ashamed of when your opponent was the greatest performer in the history of the industry in the eyes of many.

 

Bret Hart maybe carried the following, certainly gave them better matches than they usually produced at the time. Hakushi,

 

This falls into the same category for me. Hakushi/Shinzaki was an excellent wrestler, and his matches with Bret were clearly a lot better than most of the rest of what he achieved in the WWF because simply put they were allowed to be longer and more competitive than most of his matches were - Bret even has mentioned the office being slightly miffed that he let Hakushi have more of the match than they would have liked. You only have to look at the match Hakushi had with 1-2-3 Kid at SummerSlam just one month after his feud with Bret concluded to see he was a great talent and didnt need "carrying" by anyone.

 

 

Not to be accused of bumming Shawn again, but I thought he carried Virgil to a great match on the 30/11/92 Prime Time, really back and forth. The only time I've been convinced Virg was a decent wrestler, and the only time I gave a hoot if he won or lost other than SummerSlam 91, which was 100% storyline. In fact between that, the aforementioned Sid matches, and my personal favourite with Masters, Michaels really was the king of making diamonds from pencil lead.

 

Another thought - Sid Vicious carried Lee Scott to the best match of his career??

[IANdrewDiceClay]

Dude you can't be serious?!

 

Goldberg admitted years later when he signed with WWF/E that he still needed carried in all his matches.

 

DDP worked through that whole match in private with Goldberg dozens of times before they did it in front of an audience and that was why it was Goldberg's first match that was anything other than a quick (or relatively quick if you count Steve Regal throwing a spanner in the works or Goldberg's US Title victory over Raven) squash match.

By that logic, DDP also needed to be carried because every match he ever did was scripted and worked through before they actually did it. Did Savage carry Steamboat when they scripted that match out as well? Goldberg had a match with Kevin Nash about two months after the DDP one where they went about 15 minutes and he wasnt carried in that one either. DDP couldn't have had that match with anyone, because 90% of the match was filled with "Goldberg" chants and the crowd going mental. Take the crowd out of it and they couldn't have played up their qualities.

 

On a related note, Chris Kanyon told this story in his shoot interview about DDP coming to the WWF and presented one of his opponents his script for the match and all the WWF locker room looked at him like he was a cunt. When the match got under way, a move fucked up or something and DDP landed badly and the Undertaker spoke up and said "I wonder if DDP wrote that down in his script". Cuntish thing to do, but what a line!

[JakeRobertsParoleOfficer]

Bigelow vs lawrence taylor is my number 1

[jimufctna24]

By the thread starters definition

 

Id say Kurt Angle carrying Matt Morgan a few years back at bound for glory is a good choice

 

Kurt on his day can carry almost anyone to a great match

[HappyWanderer]

Dude you can't be serious?!

 

Goldberg admitted years later when he signed with WWF/E that he still needed carried in all his matches.

 

DDP worked through that whole match in private with Goldberg dozens of times before they did it in front of an audience and that was why it was Goldberg's first match that was anything other than a quick (or relatively quick if you count Steve Regal throwing a spanner in the works or Goldberg's US Title victory over Raven) squash match.

By that logic, DDP also needed to be carried because every match he ever did was scripted and worked through before they actually did it. Did Savage carry Steamboat when they scripted that match out as well? Goldberg had a match with Kevin Nash about two months after the DDP one where they went about 15 minutes and he wasnt carried in that one either. DDP couldn't have had that match with anyone, because 90% of the match was filled with "Goldberg" chants and the crowd going mental. Take the crowd out of it and they couldn't have played up their qualities.

 

Oh don't get me wrong, I agree that the crowd were going mental, but they were going mental for every single match Goldberg was having back then as his push had been worked absolutely perfectly and the crowd couldn't get enough, I know, I couldn't get enough of him either then.

 

What I'm trying to say is that if you sat down and watched all of his matches before that one they were essentially the same formula, as were plenty after that as well. Heel/ Jobber attempts some offense, Goldberg no-sells it, clobbers them with a few forearms/ power moves, spear, jack-hammer, 1-2-3.

 

The DDP fight was the first fight that he had that could be considered GREAT and by far the best match I ever saw him have.

 

I don't recall the Nash match that you're referring to (I presume you don't mean the one where Nash used the taser to cause Goldberg his first defeat as that was more than a couple of months later and was crap). I do remember Goldberg's win over Hogan for the World Title and matches against Bret Hart which had some heat but were nowhere near the standard of the DDP one and I might be wrong but as I personally feel nobody else managed to get a match of that quality out of Goldberg then I have to stick to my guns and say I believe Page did carry Goldberg that night.

[IANdrewDiceClay]

I don't recall the Nash match that you're referring to (I presume you don't mean the one where Nash used the taser to cause Goldberg his first defeat as that was more than a couple of months later and was crap).

DDP vs Goldberg was October 25, 1998 and Goldberg vs Nash was December 27, 1998. So it was two months after and bollocks was it crap. Nash vs Goldberg was a better match than the DDP one. Goldberg worked really hard in the match as well, and the crowd had a sense that a title change. You might want to watch that was again. Power Slam even called it "the best match of Goldberg's short career by some distance" at the time. Goldberg was progressing as a worker at the time. After Starrcade 98, injuries and shit booking combined with a lack of motivation finished him off as far as his progression goes, but Goldberg was having some belters at the time.

[air_raid]

I don't recall the Nash match that you're referring to (I presume you don't mean the one where Nash used the taser to cause Goldberg his first defeat as that was more than a couple of months later and was crap).

 

It was LITERALLY a couple, i.e. two months later. He wrestled DDP at Halloween Havoc, had World War 3 off, then wrestled Nash at Starrcade.

 

I'll ignore that you "dont recall" the match, but DO recall that it was crap.

 

Depending on what you thought of Big Bill's match with Sting on the post Fall Brawl Nitro, this was his first long and competitive match. The Raven match was a well constructed five minute match, Hennig had a longer heat spell at Bash at the Beach but that was dull and lead to the same Goldberg formula finish.

 

I suppose whether or not Page "carried" Goldberg is slightly weighted by what you might think of his similarly lengthed match with Nash as mentioned, Nash not normally being lauded as someone who can carry.

 

If you thought that was rubbish, then you'll probably think Goldberg needed carrying, and Page did that, producing somewhat of an anomaly.

 

If you thought it was good, it proves that Big Bill was capable of working a decent length "proper match" and he and Page both worked together to make a great match.

 

Personally I thought the Nash match at Starrcade was ok, but their match at Spring Stampede four months later was rocking.

[DJ Kris]

Bigelow vs lawrence taylor is my number 1

That's the 2nd time I've seen that in this thread, but I honestly don't remember that match being particularly good. Is it worth a rewatch?

[WWFChilli]

I'd still say Page called the match though, and planned a majority of the big spots. And even though that Starrcade match wasn't bad, it had Nash in it. Who as it pains me to say, was not the worker in 98 that Page was. Plus christ on a bike if your comparing a then 15 year vet in Ricky Steamboat to an intense but still green as grass Bill Goldberg.

 

the ultimate carry job as great as Angle is, is Bigelow/LT. It's the definition almost.

[kamicazze]

i didnt mean cena gets carried. i was stating a lot of people think cena gets carried in his good matches but i believe he has a vast collection of good matches which means he cant have been carried. That tom magee is terrible. to make him look good speaks volumes for the talent bret was. i may watch that ddp goldberg match now, not personally seen it