Who needs to turn?

[ShortOrderCook]

Inspired by a bunch of discussion elsewhere on the board in the Raw thread and the 'Whos the next man?' topic mainly, who do you think needs to make a switch to the other team in WWE and TNA? It's not unusual for a turn to completely revitalise someone or for the wrestler in question to suddenly become a revelation. R-Truth last year being a recent example and CM Punk seems to be fairing a whole lot better since going back to the dark side.

 

As mentioned in the Raw thread, Brodus desperately needs to ditch the Funk and become a big fat destroyer in a tag team with Tensai I reckon. Some say they should be a Natural Disasters type team but when I think of them together I think more of The Sky-Scrapers and Lord Humungous. I'd like to see them presented as some hybrid of that.

 

Many have said before here that Dolph Ziggler would make a tremendous face. I can't completely disagree with the idea and I'd like to see it given a go. If only because he's been fed to the face team for so long that I think it's getting to the point that it would need to happen to save him. The MITB briefcase has been used numerous times to instigate a heel turn. I'd love for there to be a twist with Dolph and his cash-in used to turn him face. I think that could go down a million times better than the common, tired opportunist cash-in.

 

Randy Orton is another that many feel needs to turn. I'm not sure he needs to turn but he definitely needs to do something a bit different. There was also a mention of Del Rio going face which I can't see at all and Miz as a face too, which would be interesting to see how that would be played.

[Carbomb]

Yes, it's an obvious one, but: John Cena.

 

In terms of business, no, he doesn't need to turn, but creatively speaking, he's pretty much spent. Plus, imagine his type of promo on the mike - heel Cena would be bloody spectacular.

[King Pitcos]

Looking at the WWE roster, nobody really. I preferred R-Truth as the conspiracy nut heel, but for him to just revert to doing that now would be iffy. I can see the argument for Ziggler as well, certainly the "he's been fed to the face team for so long that I think it's getting to the point that it would need to happen to save him" part of it makes sense. A change is as good as a rest and all that. I might take a gamble on a babyface The Miz as well, but not yet. And certainly not at the same time Ziggler was turning.

 

For the most part, I think everyone's on the right side of the fence -- it's quite hard to judge when much of the roster don't even have much of a gimmick or character besides "face" or "heel" anyway. I'd maybe have Gabriel become a Model Martel kind of character, but at the moment him turning would have zero gravitas and it'd be too similar to Dashing Cody Rhodes anyway.

[ShortOrderCook]

Oh, fuck off Carbomb. Cena as heel is so far gone. He's fucking brilliant as he is now. I honestly think making Cena a baddie is a fucking terrible idea. It's basically like turning Goldberg heel.

 

Ziggler is the real main one for me that I think needs to happen somewhere, sometime soon and that could actually be a game changer. Cody Rhodes is losing his way as a heel too, he needs something substantial (as most do) and a face turn probably isn't it but I liked him as a face before in his matches against Orton so I wouldn't mind seeing how that would play out now with both of them switched.

[IANdrewDiceClay]

I bet the Cena turn comes in the next 12 months. Bold yes and hopefully this post will be long forgotten if it doesn't happen to spare my blushes, but if Cena is hurting as bad as is being touted (both emotionally from his divorce and physically from all those surgeries he said no to), I wonder if they will roll the dice on it. I think the chances are better now than ever. Especially with all the special attraction draws they have for the big shows like SummerSlam and WrestleMania. His role in those shows aren't on his shoulders much.

 

If they are really going with Sheamus, a heel Cena vs babyface Sheamus would be different.

[Carbomb]

Oh, fuck off Carbomb. Cena as heel is so far gone. He's fucking brilliant as he is now. I honestly think making Cena a baddie is a fucking terrible idea. It's basically like turning Goldberg heel.

 

Fuck off yourself. He's not gone at all, his character is incredibly stale. It's not like turning Goldberg heel, because Goldberg demonstrated he couldn't do it. Cena clearly can, and should - it would add a whole new level to his whole story. Not to be smarky, but he among a few others is one of the main reasons I've switched off - I just find him incredibly boring, and even stellar ability such as his can't bring me back from that.

 

The only thing he can't do, in my opinion, is stay as a permanent career babyface. He doesn't have that type of charisma - Sting somehow had it, Steamboat had it, but Cena is not that likable all round. That's not a criticism, as it's a very rare form of charisma that not many wrestlers can produce. Even Hogan, Austin and Rock couldn't stay face forever, and Cena's face run is roughly reaching the length of time period that Hogan's did when people started turning on him - and Hogan's era had far, far less programming to over-expose him on.

 

Also, Ian's just raised a very good point: if Cena's as smashed up as reported, it'd be the best thing for him physically to turn heel, as for most main-eventers it's a much less strenuous and demanding task.

[ShortOrderCook]

The thing is, I'm not sure how you turn him now. I thought after the Rock first returned they immediately started doing a slow slow subtle turn with him but, I think it's too far gone now and I don't know how today's audience would be with it. Personally, I don't think it should happen or needs to happen. It could be something totally mind-blowing for all I know though. The turn itself and execution would have to be incredible and logical for it to really work I reckon.

[air_raid]

I came in here specifically to post "don't go on about Cena, we've done that one to death and it ain't happening," but as usual Ian has shown us the way. Im simplest terms if the feeling is prevailing that Cena is on his way out within twelve months or so, they'll need a really strong top face to replace him. The best vehicle they would have to propel that new face, I too believe, would be a heel Cena. If you're losing the Cena merchandise machine anyway, why not go for it. Nothing to lose, would finally prove whether or not the Cena turn would be as artistically satisfying as lots of us have long suspected it would be, even though the saner of us have admitted it made no sense from a business perspective. Suddenly, it would make sense from a business perspective.

 

Unfortunately that top face would probably end up being Orton. Sorry Tommy.

[Carbomb]

The thing is, I'm not sure how you turn him now. I thought after the Rock first returned they immediately started doing a slow slow subtle turn with him but, I think it's too far gone now and I don't know how today's audience would be with it. Personally, I don't think it should happen or needs to happen. It could be something totally mind-blowing for all I know though. The turn itself and execution would have to be incredible and logical for it to really work I reckon.

 

In honesty, it's probably a good thing we can't imagine how to turn him - much more of a shock when he does. Bit like the Hogan nWo turn, it's got to come out of absolute nowhere - which is probably the easy bit, given that he's been face for so long, and WWE have built up this expectation that, however much or little he's booed, they won't turn him.

 

Perhaps it might be worth him going down the Austin route, turning on someone like Rey or Kofi, and aligning himself into a tag-team with Lesnar like the Two-Man Power Trip? Nah. No good, but that's why I'm not a booker.

[ShortOrderCook]

Maybe. Maybe it's because I think his character has gone through so many things and still come through keeping his ways when The Rock or CM Punk issue presented good opportunities for him to snap and it all to have got too much. I think his character is incredibly solid now and I disagree that he's stale.

 

How would you lads turn him?

[The Ultimate Worrier]

Too much of a gamble to turn Cena heel. Creatively i'm not even sure it would be as interesting as some people think it would but more importantly there's no way to gauge what effect it's going to have on your typical "take the kids to the WWE show" type audience. I'd leave well alone.

 

Ortons starting to stink. Personally i'd pay the guy off but i'd settle for a turn.

 

Del Rio looks seriously low on gas as far as interest goes at the moment too, I could just about picture him as a good guy, I reckon his act is better suited to it actually.

 

Miz as a face could have serious legs. He's surprised many up to this point already, it isn't outwith the realm of opportunity that he could be a megastar.

[Carbomb]

Maybe. Maybe it's because I think his character has gone through so many things and still come through keeping his ways when The Rock or CM Punk issue presented good opportunities for him to snap and it all to have got too much. I think his character is incredibly solid now and I disagree that he's stale.

 

Like I say, Hogan was face for about the same period of time, with plenty of opportunities to turn heel, and didn't for a long time. But wCw realised it made sense in the end, and, even now, people still consider it not only one of the best turns in history, but also one of the most effective extensions of a wrestler's shelf-life ever.

 

It's not a "I Hate WWE" thing to want Cena to turn heel - if anything it's something a fan should want if they want to keep watching him, because it would re-vitalise his career, and make for even more great memories. Cena is one of the masters, meaning it's an absolute guarantee he can make a heel run worth tuning in for.

[ColinBollocks]

Oh, fuck off Carbomb. Cena as heel is so far gone. He's fucking brilliant as he is now. I honestly think making Cena a baddie is a fucking terrible idea. It's basically like turning Goldberg heel.

Not sure about that. Cena has been the top babyface for 7+ years now and Goldberg was Da Man for about 3 in WCW - to add, they turned Goldberg when he'd been out injured for ages and had enough away time that the fans were desperate to have him back to tan the heels. I can't see the fans rejecting a Cena turn the way they did the Goldberg one, a big reason is that Cena will probably relish the freedom of heeldom, unlike our Bill.

 

Turning Cena is a great way of giving Sheamus a push up the ladder too, tbh. He's a solar system away from being near Cena's level, so giving him a few big wins bound to help. When they do turn Cena, lets hope they do something huge with it (like the great Easy E did with Hogan), it's one of the few things in wrestling that will probably make people tune in and care.

 

It's a shame Henry got injured, as it was looking like they were gearing him up for a run as a babyface. Looks like Ryback pinched his spot though.

[andrew "the ref" coyne]

Maybe. Maybe it's because I think his character has gone through so many things and still come through keeping his ways when The Rock or CM Punk issue presented good opportunities for him to snap and it all to have got too much. I think his character is incredibly solid now and I disagree that he's stale.

 

How would you lads turn him?

 

Im not nessesarily saying you should turn him, but if you had too....

 

For Cena (the character) it's incredibly easy to be the wholesome holier than thou individual. It's incredibly easy for him to preach to the heels and to the likes of CM Punk because he is the top dog. The WWE merchandice machine push him regardless of any recent losses and regardless of any championships he holds. The Rock and CM Punk, as great as agitators as they were, won't cause Cena to 'snap' because he knows that deep down... he's got a good thing going. What did the loss to the Rock really do to him? Nothing really. What did a loss to CM Punk really do to him? Nothing really.

 

Cena is a face because he is comfortable.

 

However now there are rumors of the WWE (in storyline) looking for their new face. With Cena getting older, with injuries piling up, WWE are now looking to other wrestlers to become the new face of the WWE.

 

What does that do to a man like Cena? Could it make him desperate? Would he be satisfied of being just "another main eventer"? Could Cena turn heel when he is out of his comfort zone and the WWE are turning to the likes of Ryback, Ziggler, Sheamus (or more likely some future guy yet to debut) etc to be the new face of the WWE?

 

Running on the above idea, I would propose Cena forming an alliance with someone like Orton (who is currently on this spiral downwards so would be a natural fit) and maybe even Lesnar (who wants to rinse the WWE of money and fuck the future of the business)... guys who are on the natural spiral down and are terrified of losing their spots. They see the next wave of super maineventers coming and they don't like it.

[King Pitcos]

Maybe. Maybe it's because I think his character has gone through so many things and still come through keeping his ways when The Rock or CM Punk issue presented good opportunities for him to snap and it all to have got too much. I think his character is incredibly solid now and I disagree that he's stale.

Completely agreed. If Cena was getting stale now, people who were fans of his in 2008 or 2010 would just be going off him. But everybody who doesn't like Cena now didn't like him then, either. If anything, Cena through his battles with Nexus, The Rock and CM Punk has become far more interesting than he was prior to the last couple of years. He's probably the most three-dimensional, authentic character that wrestling has ever had.

 

I can't think of any logic that he could even give for a heel turn, at least until someone else seems to be taking his place and he feels jealous and threatened. Sheamus is the closest to that by far, and it's hard to imagine even him looking like a threat to Cena's spot anytime soon... At least without them throwing a full megapush at him (similar to what he has now, except more storylines and promos, and doing more than throwaway matches on Raw). And Sheamus' on-screen limitations have been exposed quite a bit over the last year, so giving him more of a push might result in him getting more boos and Cena being seen as the lesser of two evils.

 

It'd make no sense for Cena to suddenly start doing the "I've had enough of you people disrespecting me" routine and going battering a Kofi Kingston, Santino Marella or Zack Ryder. Those are the heel turns Big Show and CM Punk have done this year. They're too passe for someone of JC's stature. And like you say, he's already had the situations with Rock and Punk (and Ryder and Kane) where the opportunity was there. Doing it now would just seem desperate and contrived. The ship's sailed on it now for me.