The new MMA general news, events and thoughts thread

[Egg Shen]

Well Newell himself is primarily a wrestler so to say its not like he was tossed in with no experience. He had his shot and he couldnt capitalise on it. Im unsure on the whole Newell situation, its incredible what he can do really but him getting decimated by Justin Gaethje was incredibly uncomfortable to watch, i dont really care to see that happen again.

[wandshogun09]

Fuck me, I'm half surprised they didn't book Punk vs Newell. Although I think they'd have had to tie Newell's other arm behind his back as well, to give Punk a fighting chance. Could Punk beat a man with no arms? I'm genuinely not sure. 

[David]

1 hour ago, Egg Shen said:

Well Newell himself is primarily a wrestler so to say its not like he was tossed in with no experience. He had his shot and he couldnt capitalise on it. Im unsure on the whole Newell situation, its incredible what he can do really but him getting decimated by Justin Gaethje was incredibly uncomfortable to watch, i dont really care to see that happen again.

I don't quite understand that viewpoint, Ebb. 

From someone who doesn't know the sport, fair enough, but you've seen Newell fight, right? So you know that he's just as capable as most other guys out there, and is probably more capable than most outside the top 8 or so in the division?

This idea that it's uncomfortable to watch because the guy was born missing a limb is mental, in my opinion. 

[the_mole]

It's lightweight, a mega strong division, he would be doing well if he beat a top 20 fighter, he won't though and its just giving him false hope, he probably beats a few UFC LWs at the bottom end from countries they are trying to break into, lightweoght has abput 90 fighters just on the UFC roster. hell the guy that beat him didn't even get a contract and he was 5-0.

CM Punk was a freakshow but at least he was really popular, you even hear fans chanting his name now at wrestling shows, he should have been one and done, Nick Newell barely has fans, WSOF wasn't popular and when you hear his name you think one armed fighter. He would still beat Punk but that doesn't matter.

[David]

13 hours ago, the_mole said:

It's lightweight, a mega strong division, he would be doing well if he beat a top 20 fighter, he won't though and its just giving him false hope, he probably beats a few UFC LWs at the bottom end from countries they are trying to break into, lightweoght has abput 90 fighters just on the UFC roster. hell the guy that beat him didn't even get a contract and he was 5-0.

Going into the Contenders Series bout Newell was 14-1, former XFC champion and his one loss was to Justin Gaethje. Someone who doesn't have his physical limitations walks into the UFC, no doubt.

We can all talk about how he wouldn't fare well against wrestlers, how he probably wouldn't crack the top ten and all that jazz, but the bottom line is that he was passed up and not given the chance to at least try because of his disability.

That's just a fact.

[Egg Shen]

That isnt true though is it Dave, if they didnt want to give him a fight they wouldnt have stuck him on the contender series full stop. They ran vignettes and promoted his fight as the main fight in the whole season. Theres nothing saying he wont get another shot on Contenders either, other guys have fought twice on there already.

You're also forgetting that Newell retired in 2015, before the contender fight he'd fought once in nearly 3 years. I dont see the issue with him going through Contenders to get in the UFC.

[David]

4 minutes ago, Egg Shen said:

That isnt true though is it Dave, if they didnt want to give him a fight they wouldnt have stuck him on the contender series full stop. They ran vignettes and promoted his fight as the main fight in the whole season. Theres nothing saying he wont get another shot on Contenders either, other guys have fought twice on there already.

No, it is true. If they wanted him in the UFC they'd have put him in the UFC. The Contenders Series is primarily a platform for up and coming guys. Newell has been a recognised name in the sport for years now.

You have to remember that Dana White was the guy who said a while back that Nick Newell "would never fight in the UFC" because it was "too dangerous." That's what he said, isn't it?

Maybe I'm being cynical, but I honestly think that the UFC and Dana knew they were in a tough spot. They had this guy who was talented enough (let's face it, he's more talented than a lot of the goons we see in the UFC today) to make the step up, but who had a condition that wouldn't look good for the company, especially if he was in a war that he lost, such as the fight with Gaethje.

At the same time, if they continually deny the disabled kid from a chance to compete they would look just as bad, especially in a world where discrimination of that kind is kinda frowned upon.

The best course of action? Stick him on a show that doesn't air on proper TV, so no one will really see it, and mach him up with someone who can take him down and win a decision. Obviously it wasn't a 100 percent sure thing, but they stacked it up as best they could.

Now they can say they gave him a shot, that he wasn't good enough, and they have a reason for denying him. 

He won't be back, Ebb. I'd be very surprised if he ever steps foot inside a UFC cage again.

[OzExile]

Am I the only one who thought Till clearly edged out Wonderboy? 

He had all the Octagon control

He made more significant strikes 

He got a knockdown 

He defended 1/1 takedowns 

I know it was close, but I don't really get the debate on that decision? 

[David]

17 minutes ago, OzExile said:

Am I the only one who thought Till clearly edged out Wonderboy? 

I didn't see it as a robbery by any stretch, but it wasn't clear in my book. I think this article sums it up perfectly.

[Egg Shen]

I scored it for Wonderboy.

[David]

13 minutes ago, Egg Shen said:

I scored it for Wonderboy.

Yeah, me too. It wasn't a robbery by any stretch, as i said, but it wasn't clear cut in either direction. Can't see how anyone besides Till's family and friends could think that.

[Egg Shen]

3 hours ago, David said:

No, it is true. If they wanted him in the UFC they'd have put him in the UFC. The Contenders Series is primarily a platform for up and coming guys. Newell has been a recognised name in the sport for years now.

You have to remember that Dana White was the guy who said a while back that Nick Newell "would never fight in the UFC" because it was "too dangerous." That's what he said, isn't it?

Maybe I'm being cynical, but I honestly think that the UFC and Dana knew they were in a tough spot. They had this guy who was talented enough (let's face it, he's more talented than a lot of the goons we see in the UFC today) to make the step up, but who had a condition that wouldn't look good for the company, especially if he was in a war that he lost, such as the fight with Gaethje.

At the same time, if they continually deny the disabled kid from a chance to compete they would look just as bad, especially in a world where discrimination of that kind is kinda frowned upon.

The best course of action? Stick him on a show that doesn't air on proper TV, so no one will really see it, and mach him up with someone who can take him down and win a decision. Obviously it wasn't a 100 percent sure thing, but they stacked it up as best they could.

Now they can say they gave him a shot, that he wasn't good enough, and they have a reason for denying him. 

He won't be back, Ebb. I'd be very surprised if he ever steps foot inside a UFC cage again.

https://mmajunkie.com/2018/06/dana-white-on-congenital-amputee-nick-newell-contender-series-ufc-shot-mma

This article tells a different story, Newell asked to go on the Contenders show to prove himself. Going from Dana's comments does it sound like he was against the idea of Newell fighting in the promotion in 2018? It doesnt to me. Dana's initial comments you are referring too were made 5 years ago, and despite Dana's head on way of speaking he wasn't overly negative, he just didnt believe it was a good idea and its pretty understandable.

...and again, Newell was used as the center piece for the series, he was given the vignettes on UFC shows before the season even started to advertise the thing, they let people specifically know what episode he'd be appearing on from the very start, it doesnt sound anti-Nick Newell does it?

To be honest, i just think you are so anti-UFC at this point Dave that you cast negativity on anything they do.

 

[David]

3 minutes ago, Egg Shen said:

https://mmajunkie.com/2018/06/dana-white-on-congenital-amputee-nick-newell-contender-series-ufc-shot-mma

This article tells a different story, Newell asked to go on the Contenders show to prove himself. Going from Dana's comments does it sound like he was against the idea of Newell fighting in the promotion in 2018? It doesnt to me. Dana's initial comments you are referring too were made 5 years ago, and despite Dana's head on way of speaking he wasn't overly negative, he just didnt believe it was a good idea and its pretty understandable.

To be honest, i just think you are so anti-UFC at this point Dave that you cast negativity on anything they do.

You're right, I am anti-UFC at this point (well, anti UFC ownership to be exact) but that isn't my beef in this situation.

I just get fed up seeing absolute fucking goons getting contracts to fight with the UFC while decent talent gets ignored, usually based on how Dana feels on any given day.

Both Ben Askren and Nick Newell should be plying their trade in the UFC today, simple as that. Maybe neither is a world beater, but they're certainly better than most of the mid-level shite we get served up on prelim cards these days. Both of them have paid their dues in the regionals, and both have seen success.

They're not in because Dana doesn't want them in. It has nothing to do with ability, despite what he peddles to the fans at his "scrums."

As for my negativity, it's mainly based in the fact that I've watched this sport since the early days of UFC 1. Yeah, I'm old enough to remember getting that event on VHS for a party at a mate's house, and I was hooked from the day ol' Art laced up that single boxing glove.

I've seen it build up to the point where it became an exciting, can't-miss sport. 

I'm now watching this new ownership group come in and flush all of that down the john. If I didn't know better I'd say they were trying to destroy the company intentionally.

From fucking about with title fights and interim title shots, to the absolute fucking disaster of a TV deal they signed, I honestly think there's a good chance the company could be fucked WCW-style within 5 years.

[Egg Shen]

I understand the frustration, im as much a fan as you. I do think you are off with the Newell thing though.

 

[David]

7 minutes ago, Egg Shen said:

I understand the frustration, im as much a fan as you. I do think you are off with the Newell thing though.

I'm not off with the Newell thing though, am I? All i've said is that he's done the rounds on the lower circuit, and he's done pretty fucking well. Look at his record. He's done the business.

He's due the step up, his record backs that up. I'm not saying he would be a guaranteed success, but he's entitled to a crack, surely? Like it or not, even with one arm he's better than a lot of the dross on the roster at the moment.